The T5 Q&a Thread

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Hahn/Grim

Got an oddball question for you kids. (dont I always?)

Anyways, I've got a bunch of sylvania QTP 2x54w ballasts sitting around. I've got a 3' tank. I'm sure you see the issue. What would happen if I was to run 39w bulbs on 54w ballasts? Would i just overdrive them a bunch, or would I fry the bulbs? I'd like to get some use out of this stuff, and I really dont feel like letting them sit around for the year or two until I can get myself a four footer.
 
54 watt ballasts should run the 39 watt lamps. They may or may not overdrive them. 15 watts would be a very small amound of overdrive so I wouln;t worry about it.
 
I do not think it is a matter of overdriving or underdriving in this case. If you understood how florescent ballasts and florescent light bulbs work it is more of an issue with the starting sequence. If the ballast needs more than a 39 watts flow through the bulb to detect that it is lite then it will either remain in the starting sequence or keep trying to restart and possibly burn out the bulb without lighting it. This depends greatly on the design of the particular ballast you are using. However most ballasts have no problem handling lower wattage bulbs but can run into problems when a higher wattage bulb or bulbs are used. A transformer is often used to maintain the voltage through the tubes once they are lite and if that transformer is rated for say 54 watts and the actual flow is 79 watts (2 39 watt bulbs) then the transformer can overheat or produce less voltage than is required to properly light the tubes. With electronic ballasts these issues are more sensative than in the older tar type ballasts.




<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9164804#post9164804 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RichConley
Hahn/Grim

Got an oddball question for you kids. (dont I always?)

Anyways, I've got a bunch of sylvania QTP 2x54w ballasts sitting around. I've got a 3' tank. I'm sure you see the issue. What would happen if I was to run 39w bulbs on 54w ballasts? Would i just overdrive them a bunch, or would I fry the bulbs? I'd like to get some use out of this stuff, and I really dont feel like letting them sit around for the year or two until I can get myself a four footer.
 
TropTea, I've got a bunch of these QTP ballasts sitting aroudn, so it'd be a 39w bulb in each 54w slot, so pulling significantly less wattage.
 
Just call the freakin' engineer. I have a feeling he will say you can use 39s on the 54, just like the triads (or are they advance?) that are in my Tek light, but you dont really know unless you call.
 
Rich,
ill call, i have some QTP DALI ballast that im curious about myself.

whats your ballast # ?

TropTrea
im wondering how program start or instant start makes a different
when using on a lower watts lamps
 
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<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9168113#post9168113 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by The Grim Reefer
If it were part of the design it would be labeled as such.

nah, they like to be a little sneaky when it comes to this I have learned. They wont list it on their website, but when you compare model numbers, you see whats going on. Its so that distributors can limit the number of SKUs they have to order. For instance, a 2x54wattT5HO can also be wired to run just one bulb. You would think its cheaper to make a 1X54watt ballast, but no, its not. This indicates that the electronic ballasts have to have some sort of built in resistance detection or bulb sensing technology (as an electronic ballast should). You have to admit as well, 2x54wattT5 ballasts ARE the cheapest ballast out there as well because they are the most common. 2x39 and 2x24 watt ballasts would in effect cost more if made seperate because of their lower market demand. By making one ballast to handle them all, but not saying it, you have cut your costs, made distribution easier, etc. But letting every consumer know that their screwdriver can also be used as a prybar eliminates the possibility of selling someone a prybar AND a screwdriver. Know what I mean?
 
Look up product liability laws (wife has spent the last 20 years working for a defence law firm) That is why a decent company wont let that info out. If you were to use a 54 watt ballast in a 39 watt system because the company said it was OK (even if it really is) and anything went wrong, for whatever reason they would be at a trial lawyer's mercy. Check out a bag a marshmellows sometime. Some have a warning label about the hazzards of a small child choacking on a marshmellow (when mom gets in from a late night at the bar and feeds the 3 and 5 year olds a bag of marshellows for breakfast and goes to bed), that was a million dollar payout.
 
I am not particularly familuar with your particular type ballast. However under the general principles of most ballast designs either of three things will happen.

1. The ballast will fire the lower wattage bulb just like it would the rated bulb.

2. The start sequence will kick in but will not switch to the run sequence because it has not sensed the correct from of current through the tube.

3. The start sequence will cycle but when it switches to the run sequence it will not detect the bulb is burning properly and the start sequence will restart.

Either way if watch it within 3 minutes you should be able to tell which of the above three is occuring. If it lights up nor,mally which I suspect would happen with 95% of the none electronic ballasts then your home free. If not then the ballast is tightly tunned to a specific bulb.

Now if it is an electronic ballast and it does not properly fire some of them have adjustments so they can be tuned to particular bulb. The bad part is that these adjustments are not always readily accessable.

On the side note form others comments. Yes many manufacturers build only one basic ballast for multi applications. In some cases it may be the adjustment of a pot to change the ballast from 2- 24W bulbs to 2-54 watt bulbs, in other it may be a hidden selector switch, and it others it might be electronicly sensed and switched.

The saving between building a ballast to handle 55 watts maximium compared to 150 watts maximium is probbly less than a $1.00 each. Yet the savings by being able to build 10,000 ballast at a time compared to 2,000 is probably greater than $5.00 each. So it becomes a no brainer in many cases. However there are no gurantees as to haw a particlur company will approach this. If they are building millions of ballasts that savings of $1.00 in parts may be atractive as the savings from building 1,000,000 compared to 200,000 may be negliable or only pennies.

Now where you do have a much higher risk is when you assume that the ballast that ran your 1-24W bulbs will run your 2-54 watt bulbs. It might be able to light them up but is it properly cooled or have the heat sinks to handle the added wattage. Will it overheat. or start a fire? or is the same ballast they sell in a fixture with 4-54 Bulbs and will not give you any issues?

Dennis


<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9165939#post9165939 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RichConley
TropTea, I've got a bunch of these QTP ballasts sitting aroudn, so it'd be a 39w bulb in each 54w slot, so pulling significantly less wattage.
 
What about the other way:
Can I use a Quicktronic 2 X 54w ballast to light a single 80w bulb?
I have been using ODNO lighting where the leads for two bulbs are combined to overdrive a single T8 bulb. Would the some concept work to light a single higher wattage T5 bulb?
 
Mr. Grim I need some advice.

I am getting a new tank but I am not sure what tank yet. I know that I want to run only T5's for which ever tank I decide to get. Here are my choices

120 gal. This tank will probably be too small being only 4ft long.

135 gal (72x18x25) I like the length but the it is only 18" deep.

156 gal (60x24x25) I think this is the tank that I want. Not to big not too small. My question, Is there a good T5 lighting option for this size tank? If so which system and bulbs in order?

215 gal (72x24x29) I also like this size tank but I think it might be too big light and depth wise.

So what do you think? I appericate any input. I want to do this right the first time.

I want to stock the tank with a litte bit of everything including sps and clams at the top.

Also, those are the only tank sizes that I will consider.

Thanks again for the help.
 
On the Tank size question

What I advise everyone is to do is go as big as you can when you consider both space as well as your finances. The first consideration I use for size is the total cubic inches of surface area. In your case you have.

120 gallon = 24" X 48" = 1,152
135 gallon -+72" X 18" = 1,296
156 gallon = 60" X 24" = 1,440
215 gallon = 72" X 24" = 1,728

Looking at the height of the tank the first 3 are basicly 25" tall and last is 29" tall. If your lighting is 6" above the surface then in reality the difference in intensity will be a maximium of 78% less on the taller tank. If you put the higher light requirement critters near the surface that would not be a big issue.

The other point to consider is the dept of the tank. The 135 gallon tank is is 18" deep while the others are 24" deep. The deeper that tank the more room you have for lighting on the surface, as well as more room to do your aquascaping. So on a personal view here I would rull out the 135 gallon tank.

So now your down to three tank possiilities the 120, 156, and the 215. Space does not seem to be a big problem for you since your already considering these three tanks. However budget comes into play next. The bigger the tank more you will be spending. It is not unsusual for a total expenditure of a salt water tank to go well over $50 per gallon. so just looking at a value like that you have range of $6,000 to $10,750. Fortunatly it is the smaller tanks that have the biggest investment per gallon as when
I lost my 75 gallon tank the insurance company calculated I had over $7,000 invested in it of which only a little over $2,000 ended up being covered. (depreciation cost, livestock not coveredbeyound $200, and exceeding the max of the insurance policy)

Dennis
 
Well, since I already had Hamerstrom's email, I thought I would ask SINCE NOBODY ELSE WANTS TO PICK UP THE PHONE..lol.

He said that no, only the 24/39watt ballasts can switch like that. the Sylvania 54watt ballasts will not run 'nice' with the 39 and 24 watt bulbs. And no, a 2x54wattT5 ballast wont run an 80watt bulb.

Ha ha... Dennis said 'total cubic inches of surface area'...lol. Yeah... because thats possible.
 
I could use a bit of help with T5's......I think I've asked this before.......but what they heck.

Current lighting is 2x250w Phoenix 14K, run about 6hrs total. Each MH runs about 20 minutes before & after. Also have 2x54w T5 (Finnex - single reflector, replacement bulbs) that I use as extra lighting, that runs a few hours before & after the MH's for a total of 10.5 hours of light.

Problem - heat, in the summer the controller often turns out one or the other MH to keep the temp down.....a chiller is not an option. The MH's also put a LOT of heat into the room, open top no canopy.

Tank dimensions are 48L x 26w x 25" tall & livestock is a couple of LPS, some lower light SPS (monti's), and a couple higher light SPS (a. somensis - sp?), also one squammy 2/3 of the way up.

I had originally thought of using either 4 or 6 54w.......but the tank is eurobraced with a 1.25" top (yes, not a typo). So i'm thinking that not much is going through that portion anyway. The bracing is about 3" wide.

At the moment I'm thinking of going with a 36" fixture............but.......can I cram enough into the width to provide the light I need.

Thinking 6x39w with individual reflectors (IceCap) & cooling for best performance (DIY fixture)..........maybe 8?
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173414#post9173414 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by hahnmeister
Well, since I already had Hamerstrom's email, I thought I would ask SINCE NOBODY ELSE WANTS TO PICK UP THE PHONE..lol.

He said that no, only the 24/39watt ballasts can switch like that. the Sylvania 54watt ballasts will not run 'nice' with the 39 and 24 watt bulbs. And no, a 2x54wattT5 ballast wont run an 80watt bulb.

Ha ha... Dennis said 'total cubic inches of surface area'...lol. Yeah... because thats possible.

Looks like I'm gonna have to buy a new tank. Crap.
 
Mr. Grim/Anyone

This is what I got so far, If I go with

156 gal with starfire front glass
Reef Geek
T5 Retro
8-80w (640 total watts)

180 gal with normal glass
Aquatintics
Constellation
14-39w (546 total watts)

215 gal with starfire front glass
Aquatintics
Constellation
14-39w (546 total watts)

How does the lighting look for these tanks?
Any other input?

Thanks,
 
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