THIS time I want to do it right.....

J

joshbrookkate

New member
About 5 months ago I was given a used 72 gallon with about 50 lbs of live rock, 2 clowns, a fire shrimp, 5 turbo snails and a couple of hermits. Also included - a marineland 220 canister filter, a 48" 6 bulb T5 light, an Octopus 2000 skimmer, heaters, powerheads, ATI test kit, etc. It also came with aptasia and bubble algae. I reused all the water from the tank so I assumed I was ready to go.

This is where I start to veer off the track. I thought that because I reused the original water from the tank that I didn't need to give it time to cycle. So... As many newbies, I started to deal with the algae issues by asking my lfs for advice. He recommended 2 emerald crabs, 2 peppermint shrimps and 2 6 lined wrasses. Things have gone well for all these months. The aptasia is gone, bubble algae is under control and testing has showed good numbers. So... I added 3 (not 1, but 3) beautiful anemones and 2 black clowns. I also took the T5 down because I thought I could save money using LEDs - one Current Orbit 48".

I logged on the thereeftank.com in Oct. and recently switched to reefcentral, scouring new posts and stickies every day. I have bought and been reading the recommended books for beginners. am also lucky to have found a local fellow reefer to help me in my learning curve.

Now... my nitrates are high - as in 80+. I have been doing 5 gallon water changes every day, added purigen to my canister, replaced the bags of carbon, and reduced feeding. The anemones seem to be doing really well, as are the clowns and shrimp. Both wrasse are gone as are the crabs. Seem to have lost many snails, as well.

But now... I see a crack in the side of the tank. No leaks, just the crack. And it looks like the previous owner had tried to reseal the seams of the tank. Not the crack, just the seams. I LOVE my reef tank so my husband has agreed that I can spend $1000 on a new tank. I am passionate about this hobby! I want to do this right. I love my softies and may plan to stay with a softies tank. But I want to be able to add the lps if I choose to in the future.

So... I know I want a drilled reef ready tank, between 75 and 90 gallons. No bow front this time. If I can reuse the equipment I have, that's great. But I'm ready to take my time and spend my $1000 to do this right. I was planning to add a 20 gallon wet/dry sump with an external overflow. I have the sump (used) and a new jebao DC6000 return pump. Now, though, I'd like to plumb it. So I'm definitely going to have it drilled for the Bean "quiet and safe overflow system". I would like to use my T5s now, too. And the LEDs, if possible. I have purchased 2 new Eheim 150w heaters and want to buy a controller for them. And oh, yeah, we retire in 3 months so I want to take care of as many large expenses as possible before that.

Any suggestions for tank, equipment, setup? Thanks in advance for advice! And my apologies for the long post.

Michelle
 
I'd suggest checking Craigslist and finding a local reef club as your 1000 budget will go MUCH further getting good used equipment than going all new.
 
My husband wants me to go new for the tank. Once I hear what suggestions people have for equipment, I'll do used. And I think I can get him to stretch that max a bit! Lol. Thanks for the quick response.
 
Glasscages.com is gonna be the most affordable when it comes to new tanks. If he is handy with power tools he can build your stand and canopy. Its not that hard there are a bunch of DIY walkthroughs on how to build a stand. That will save you a big chunk of change right there. The best Value is the 120 Gallon once drilled and overflow installed for 476$. If you build your own stand you can have a 120 build at a bargain.
 
First, welcome to Reef Central.

Whew - That's a lot of questions, but you've come to the right place to answer them.

First, let's address your current tank. The high nitrates are relatively easy to fix with "carbon dosing". Carbon dosing is essentially adding an organic carbon source to your tank water to promote the growth of bacteria, which your skimmer then removes. Because all life, including bacteria, use carbon, nitrogen and phosphorus as building blocks, removing the bacteria by skimming effectively removes N & P. The carbon source used in this approach is vinegar (acetic acid), vodka (ethanol), or sugar. An alternative approach is the use of "bio pellets", which are a slowly-dissolving source of organic carbon, typically used in a reactor.

If you're a beginner, I'd stick with vinegar dosing. It's cheap, easily obtainable, works well, and because vinegar's dilute (5% solution of acetic acid in water), the amounts you need to add are larger than with a more concentrated source like vodka or sugar, and are thus easier to measure. However, it's critical that you read up on the technique. Overdosing can potentially cause your entire aquarium's demise. Here's an excellent article on the subject. If you need more answers on the subject, post them in the "Reef Chemistry" section.

Regarding the crack - this is typically the result of unequal stress being placed on the aquarium from its support structure. That could be a tank stand that's deteriorating, or a stand that's been placed on an uneven floor without leveling. That explanation won't help you with your current tank, but will be worth noting for your new tank.

Regarding the new tank - as you may have guessed, "bigger is better", at least up to a point, in this hobby. It's true that nanos are very popular, and the amount of water that must be hauled around is much lower, but keeping the water chemistry stable and finding suitable inhabitants that won't overcrowd or outgrow your tank can be a challenge.

Your budget ($1000) will buy a custom, rimless tank in the size you're interested in, if only the glass box is considered. If you buy a standard, mass-produced tank from Deep Blue, Marineland, All-Glass, etc..., then you'll have a lot of money left over. For example, PetSmart was running a sale before Christmas on an undrilled 75 gallon Marineland tank with stand, glass covers (useless for saltwater) and an LED light (also useless for a reef tank) for $270. You'd need to either drill such a tank or have it drilled for you, but that shouldn't cost more than $100 - many Local Fish Shops (LFS) charge $25 per hole for tank drilling.

I'd advise you against the 90 gallon option, at least in standard tank size. Such a tank is too narrow front-to-back for the water depth, and makes tank maintenance much more difficult. A standard 75 gallon is much, much better in that regard.

You can use the rest of your equipment, except possibly the lighting. Realize that for photosynthetic organisms to truly thrive, you should have at least 4 T5HO bulbs over a 75 gallon, and that's bare minimum. 6 bulbs would be much, much better for your anemones, and if you're contemplating a photosynthetic clam.

Also realize that lighting is easily the most expensive purchase on an average reef tank. You could easily consume your entire budget on a drilled 75 gallon tank, stand, and 6 bulb T5HO lighting fixture. And suitable LED lighting in an american-branded product could easily cost well north of $800, because you'll likely need 2 modular fixtures to cover the 4' length of the tank. You can buy cheaper Chinese-made LED fixtures, but you'll still spend around $500, and give up some spectrum control and features. In my opinion, and since you're a beginner at this, I'd strongly suggest that you stick with T5HO. That choice is bullet-proof, and you won't have to think about whether your lighting is causing issues when you're troubleshooting a problem with your tank/animals. An Aquatic Life 6-bulb T5HO 48" long fixture with bulbs can be had for about $450 (reference Drs. Foster and Smith's online store). A nicer, brighter and more reliable fixture can be had in an ATI Sunpower 6-bulb fixture for $520, but doesn't come with bulbs (bulbs are about $20 each) - reference Bulk Reef Supply's lighting section.

Well, that's my $0.02. Keep asking questions - that's what us more experienced members in the Beginner's section are here for....
 
By the way - at this point your budget won't accommodate power-backup, your budget will be consumed with lighting, tank, stand, and (possibly) water movement devices.

So your best bet on a cramped budget for power-backup is a couple of battery-powered air pumps that you can get for less than $10 each. That'll be enough to keep your critters alive for a few hours during a power black-out. For longer term, you can buy a 1000 watt power inverter from an auto store for about $50. Coupled with a good extension cord, your vehicle, and a full tank of gas, you can keep your aquarium going for a couple of days.
 
I am doing a 75 on a budget also. I bought a non drilled marineland on sale and drilled out myself for a bean drain. I have less on the tank and drain than a reef ready tank would have been that only has 2 holes and a big box taking up a corner of my tank. I built my own stand for under $100 that is more user friendly than regular production stands. Build my own sump from a 30g, did you know petco is having their $1/gallon sale right now? Most of my rock came from marcos rocks because passing $5-$8 a pound at lfs for live just want in the budget. I have the dc-6000 and bought Jebao RW-8 wavemaker for my power head. Got a really good used skimmer and my lights are ocean revive leD's which where $300 for two. I will probably upgrade the lights to radions or kessel later down the road but these will work just fine for the near future. The more you can do yourself the cheaper you can do it and spend money on more important things. For instance I have about $50 in material for my sump and a new one somebody else built would have been well over $300.
 
Thanks so much for the advice!!!

Thanks so much for the advice!!!

Ok! I'm going to post on the lighting advice forum to get advice for bulb replacements for my 6 bulb T5 fixture. It's a start! And I'll stick with 75 gallons. The size works for me anyhow. I'll look into those tanks that have been suggested and find a local lfs that can drill to my needs.

Do you think a 20 gallon sump is big enough?
 
Refugium?

Refugium?

One more question - I would like a refugium, too. Will the 20 gallon wet/dry sump that I have accommodate my needs?
 
If you have a LFS you like do not be afraid to hit them up for a tank. I have got some really good deals on a tank. A lot of times they will eat the cost of a tank for your repeat business on other things. All things considered the tank is the cheapest thing we buy. good luck
 
joshbrookkate said:
One more question - I would like a refugium, too. Will the 20 gallon wet/dry sump that I have accommodate my needs?
Click to expand...

I don't think a 20g would be large enough for a refugium. I have a 20g sump on my 40g tank, and the skimmer and return pump already take up a sizable chunk of it.
 
joshbrookkate said:
What size sump do you recommend? wet/dry?
Click to expand...

the sump should be as big as possible. make it whatever your cabinet can fit. Or link it to the basement or somewhere.

the reason is: small fuge won't do much of nutrient export. It won't grow enough pods for mandarin either.

big sump allows extra room for equipment. Also, during power failures, the water drained back from the DT will all go into the sump, not all over your floor.
 
A sump is a wet/dry sump. Most people just call it a sump even when it has areas that are wet and or dry. The dry part isn't really that dry either. its where the water is coming in and splashing around. The wet part is where the equipment like a skimmer or the return pump is kept. You also should rethink the new tank thing. You can get a much better deal on craislist and your $1000 is going to go faster than you think. My last tank ended horribly because I didn't plan it out right. What killed me was in getting a tall tank. The lighting necessary to get the light to the bottom is intense. That's why people are telling you to stay clear of the 90, its a tall 75, and the lighting requirements are much higher.
 
I will rethink new vs used. I was trying to avoid the problems I've had with the used tank I have now. But when I got it, I knew NOTHING! I didn't even think to test it for leaks! I could have had a disaster! So we'll see. Thanks for the info and advice.
 
I'll send you a PM with my phone nuber if you'd like to discuss your set-up by phone.

Re: The sump. I agree with the other posters; a 20g will be too small for a 75g. Depending on the height of the slots in the overflow, the size of your skimmer and the size/strength of the return pump, a 20g long may actually flood if you turn off the return pump. A 40g breeder would be ideal for the set-up you describe, and you can get one from PetCo during their $/gallon sale for $40.

The one issue you might have with a 40g breeder is its width - it's 18", which is the same width as a standard 75g tank. A lot of commercial stands won't accommodate a sump that's the same width as the main tank. The best solution for this problem is to build your own stand (or better, if you know someone that's a hobbyist woodworker, have them build one for you).

Another solution would be to go with a 30 gallon standard size tank (i.e., not a breeder). These are 13" wide and the same height as a 40 gallon breeder (16").

Finally, if you have room for it, you might want to consider a 120 gallon tank. These are the same length as a 75 gallon (4 feet), except they're 24" front-to-back and 24" high. Because the length is the same, the equipment cost for a 120g is almost the same as a 75g, and you get substantial extra footprint for arranging an aquascape.

Finally, regarding the used/new tank. If you go with a 75 gallon and drill it yourself, I'd go with a new tank. Purchased at PetSmart, they're so cheap that the savings for a used tank may not be significant, and you avoid the hassle of looking for a used tank for sale, possible scratches, and aged/crappy tank stands.
 
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