This was an eye opener - cont.

[Dingo44]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15410833#post15410833 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ctenophors rule
the article didn't fly over myhead...though my resonses ay be flying over yours......

Your responses aren't even getting off the ground son. All the alarmist talk is coming from the media and political talking heads. If you have been researching scientists like you say, then you should have no problem accepting Scooter's challenge, in fact I'm waiting patiently to see what you come up with. Remember, primary source is the key here, that means it's straight from the horse's mouth.

I'm going to repost one of Scooter's points because I think it's worth it in your case:

"The nature of science is skepticism. Plain and simple. NO TOPIC IS ABOVE DISCUSSION IN THE SCIENTIFIC COMMUNITY. Newton's theory of gravity was accepted by ALL physicists for a long time until a lowly patent clerk who dropped out of college demonstrated the theory to be incomplete. "

 

[ctenophors rule]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15411314#post15411314 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dingo44
Your responses aren't even getting off the ground son. All the alarmist talk is coming from the media and political talking heads. If you have been researching scientists like you say, then you should have no problem accepting Scooter's challenge, in fact I'm waiting patiently to see what you come up with. Remember, primary source is the key here, that means it's straight from the horse's mouth.

I'm going to repost one of Scooter's points because I think it's worth it in your case:

"The nature of science is skepticism. Plain and simple. NO TOPIC IS ABOVE DISCUSSION IN THE SCIENTIFIC COMMUNITY. Newton's theory of gravity was accepted by ALL physicists for a long time until a lowly patent clerk who dropped out of college demonstrated the theory to be incomplete. "

i am not an alarmist!!!i dont advocate destroying every car in the world, melting it down, and building a giant co2 scrubber to match our needs. but at the same time stuff needs to be done. you don't want to be inconvenienced...you want to make small steps...but the nas came out with a report, which i will find and post later, that shows three senerios that they agree with, one is minor, medial, and major..in order to prevent even the minor larger steps must be taken....as i have suggested their are many ways of doing this....but if your unwilling to be inconvienienced for the human race, and are willing to site a less credible source against my two highly credible sources and call that an even drawl then i am done talking....you guys gio ahead and have the pointless discussion of how little your ideas will impact our day to day life, this discussion is below my dignity, which is surprisingly high for a 15 year old...maybe that makes me arragant...but i dont realy give a hoot anymore....

good luck, and i am not being a fanatic, if you wont see reason than your being the fanatic.

x>y

x scientist believe global warming is man made and will cause huge problems

y scientist believe global warming is man made and will do very little.

x>y

what is their to discuss?

p.s. the study was in these vids, i am not going to watch all 6 hours again.....and as long as your ignore the religious fantic arguments that he is using t convert, and you se it for th scientific facts...then you can either see reason and believe or.....well i dont care.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIGXK0xNvdQ&feature=channel

 

[ctenophors rule]

and finaly how is taking a stand and creating new jobs out af thin air going to be a bad thing? and instead of just taking the small approach why not start a project where you can hire the best of the best of scientist, economist, et al, to make a chart and plot what will most likely happen? would you believe that, or would all of them be wrong as well???

i digrest..this is below me......my final post.....cheer if you like....good bye.

 

[ScooterTDI]

Settle down...

If you want to leave the discussion, I respect that. I have considered it many times myself.

I think I have made a solid case for a moderate approach to resolving global warming. I have cited reputable sources. You have even said that one of them was excellent at one point.

I'm not sure what you really want out of this conversation. I think that article I linked made a pretty good case for the fact that we can effect change WITHOUT being inconvenienced, but only if we approach the topic from a rational frame of reference.

Yes, it is possible that the outcome of global warming will be horrible. That is one of the many projected scenarios. It may even be likely. Noone really knows except fortune tellers.

I don't think my approach is fanatical either. It is very middle of the road. Thats why I don't understand why you are getting so worked up over this.

Let me leave you with this...

Not everything in the world is black and white, there is a gray area. The truth/solution is in that gray area.

Scott

 

[ScooterTDI]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15411688#post15411688 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ctenophors rule
and finaly how is taking a stand and creating new jobs out af thin air going to be a bad thing?

Do you think that the current plan for cap and trade will create jobs? That plan is effectively taxing ALL businesses. Taxing businesses doesn't create jobs. It gets people layed off. It stifles innovation because companies have less money to invest in R&D.

Do you remember the X prize? It was a prize given top the first company to design, build, and fly a commercial spacecraft capable of carrying passengers. Noone had put any significant effort toward commercial manned spaceflight until this prize was debuted. Only a few years later, they had commercial manned spaceflight. It was amazing how fast they got that done, and the prize was only 10 million.

Why do I bring this up? I think it might be a good idea to try this sort of thing with technological innovations required for reducing global warming. For instance, make a 1 billion dollar prize for the first company to demonstrate profitable large scale production of renewable fuels. That would get the ball rolling and create jobs.

It just an idea...

Scott

 

[ScooterTDI]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15411598#post15411598 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ctenophors rule

p.s. the study was in these vids, i am not going to watch all 6 hours again.....and as long as your ignore the religious fantic arguments that he is using t convert, and you se it for th scientific facts...then you can either see reason and believe or.....well i dont care.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIGXK0xNvdQ&feature=channel

You are joking right? I have to believe you are joking. Please say you are joking.

How can you complain about my sources of information after linking that. At least my sources don't wear funny hats

Scott

 

[ctenophors rule]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15411875#post15411875 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ScooterTDI
You are joking right? I have to believe you are joking. Please say you are joking.

How can you complain about my sources of information after linking that. At least my sources don't wear funny hats

Scott

i know i said i wasn't gonna post..this is my last one! he isn't my source....my source are the ones he uses, and i have researched further....

bye bye!

 

[ScooterTDI]

This is what is wrong with America's youth....

I really feel like an idiot. It is like I've been trying to explain quantum mechanics to my fish for the last week.

This is my last post as well.

Scott

 

[ctenophors rule]

he isn't my only source. ***! i just found the article by way of his vids, which my homes made me watch.....but this is getting me no where.. i will not absolutely not reply any longer....aurevoir!

 

[Dingo44]

Ctenophor, don't leave like this. It's hard to convey tone with text, but nothing I've typed is meant to be taken in a harsh way, just a conversation. I think it's really cool that you are interested in current events, god knows I could care less at your age. It's been a pleasure, for better or for worse, to get a glimpse from your perspective. I'm wasn't trying to change your mind... just broaden your horizons in a sense.

When you're reading and posting on forums, you know nothing about the person you're talking to, but I have a feeling you're seeing too much into other people's responses, assuming way too much, and letting you emotions get the best of you. From what I've read you seem to be a good kid, don't let someone else's words get to you like that, don't give someone that power. Come back and let's continue, we can all benefit one way or the other from your perspective.

 

[ctenophors rule]

well dingo, not to be disrespect ful....i am sure that you guys could benefit from my perspective...but i feel i can no longer benefit from yours.....i debate to learn...and all i am learning now is how many ways i can retype what seems to be an obvious scientific analysis of statistics and of credibility, and learning how many waysit can be skirted....or the wrong info can be proffered hidden with flashy words like phd....which means nuthing when put against the majorit of his peers....

so i don't think i will return....but i will still read....like an unwanted relative from heaven...supposing you believe in that stuff!

bye bye...and i shouldn't have given him the power...proof of why i should leave....

 

[Dingo44]

Alright then, to each his own, live long and prosper and all that good stuff....

Anywho, in case anyone is still paying attention, heres an article that was just written in the Financial Times, reporting how India is rejecting the west's findings on global warming, specifically the claim that the glaciers in the Himalayans are shrinking. The Indian environment minister points out how big a role the western media is playing in all this. Any thoughts? Ideas? Criticisms? Refutations?

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/c2896b88-77bd-11de-9713-00144feabdc0.html?nclick_check=1

 

[ScooterTDI]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15412921#post15412921 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dingo44
Ctenophor, don't leave like this. It's hard to convey tone with text, but nothing I've typed is meant to be taken in a harsh way, just a conversation. I think it's really cool that you are interested in current events, god knows I could care less at your age. It's been a pleasure, for better or for worse, to get a glimpse from your perspective. I'm wasn't trying to change your mind... just broaden your horizons in a sense.

When you're reading and posting on forums, you know nothing about the person you're talking to, but I have a feeling you're seeing too much into other people's responses, assuming way too much, and letting you emotions get the best of you. From what I've read you seem to be a good kid, don't let someone else's words get to you like that, don't give someone that power. Come back and let's continue, we can all benefit one way or the other from your perspective.

Ok my comments were disrespectul. I admit that. But I won't withdraw them. It seems to me that everyone nowadays relies youtube, twitter, or facebook as their source of information. That is pretty sad.

Did you see that youtube video? That was possibly the funniest thing I have ever seen in my life and at the same time it was the saddest.

Why would he link that video if actually had done any research? He hasn't done the research.

Scott

 

[ScooterTDI]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15413025#post15413025 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ctenophors rule
well dingo, not to be disrespect ful....i am sure that you guys could benefit from my perspective...but i feel i can no longer benefit from yours.....i debate to learn...and all i am learning now is how many ways i can retype what seems to be an obvious scientific analysis of statistics and of credibility, and learning how many waysit can be skirted....or the wrong info can be proffered hidden with flashy words like phd....which means nuthing when put against the majorit of his peers....

That is interesting because I feel the same way...

Scott

 

[Dingo44]

I did see the video, whoa. That is a big problem, gossip on blogs and facebook are being considered fact. Most youngin's get their news from the Daily Show, at least Jon Stewart is more credible than the mad hatter pseudo climatologist. After I was done laughing, the realization set in about how sad it is that people like that are educating our youth.

I don't think Ctenophor knows what a credible source is, all the things he's been telling us came right from that video without even a simple google search to see if the claims are remotely close to reality.

You shouldn't take back anything you said. Maybe he/she will take a deep breathe and re-read this thread one day in a different light. Your time has not been wasted my friend.

Something else that depresses me is that Ctenophor is an example of probably millions more young Americans who are misguided.

 

[ScooterTDI]

I really feel like an old man after saying all that, but I'm only 26!!!

Its amazing how much things have changed in the mere 11 years since I was his age.

Scott

 

[Dingo44]

I know how you feel, I'm 27 and I'm apparently way out of touch with today's youth. It's a good thing that there's so much info so readily available, at the same time it's dangerous for impressionable youths because they glom onto a certain idea and defend it like it's their own dignity on the line.

 

[ctenophors rule]

i am confused as to how me being unable ti find the source, but knowing a secondary source that tells of the primary source.....but that right! you do't care about that! you only care about discrediting me.....never mind the fact that i am only bringing this up because in their is the source i was talking about.....this was why i left...why did i come back? oh yeah too much pride to be treated like the kid i am.....lol...but serioudly, you guys realy can't think of a better way to spend your time than discrediting a 15 years old by putting words in his mouth?

thats why i left......just don't look at my as an ignorant impressionable kid, if you remember i disputed his way of arguing....i said that if you can get past his religious fanatic arguments......but you dont care about what i said.....just tat the guy has a funny hat....

i guess i can't be true to my word either and just stay away from this......too much pride....or hatred of stereotypes? your call.

 

[Dingo44]

He's back! I knew you couldn't stay away. One of the things Scooter and I are trying to get through your head is: don't trust what people say, especially religious fanatics with stupid hats. Watch the video closely for the source you're talking about, write down everything that crackpot says about it, then go find the PRIMARY source for that study. I myself am curious about this source you speak of, I'm not being fecicious about it, I really want to know.

And no, I don't have anything better to do when the economy sucks and my work is slower than molasses. Nobody is putting words in your mouth, discrediting your opponents statements and arguements is part of debate. Don't take it personal, it seems like you have invested a lot of yourself into your view, therefore when people try to argue with your view, you take it as an attack on yourself.(Does that make sense?). Getting mad, rambling, using caps, lots of exclamation marks, all these things broadcast that we're getting under your skin. That is showing us a weakness, never let your opponent see you bleed! Stay strong in your convictions, part of debate is confidence in your stance. When you get mad and storm off, that undermines your position. If your opponent is asking for something specific, get it and
shove it in his face to shut'em up!

I'm not here to discredit you, I'm here because a) I'm bored stupid at work b) these types of debates are fun for me c) I like reef tanks!

Good man for coming back! You came back cause of your pride? Awesome! Don't take crap from anyone. Never give up.

Let's light this candle, go get the primary source and shove it in my face!

 

[ScooterTDI]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15415646#post15415646 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ctenophors rule
i am confused as to how me being unable ti find the source, but knowing a secondary source that tells of the primary source.....but that right! you do't care about that! you only care about discrediting me.....never mind the fact that i am only bringing this up because in their is the source i was talking about.....this was why i left...why did i come back? oh yeah too much pride to be treated like the kid i am.....lol...but serioudly, you guys realy can't think of a better way to spend your time than discrediting a 15 years old by putting words in his mouth?

thats why i left......just don't look at my as an ignorant impressionable kid, if you remember i disputed his way of arguing....i said that if you can get past his religious fanatic arguments......but you dont care about what i said.....just tat the guy has a funny hat....

i guess i can't be true to my word either and just stay away from this......too much pride....or hatred of stereotypes? your call.

I did nothing to discredit you. You did that yourself, my friend. You'd make me more happy than you'd know if you went and found that primary source.

Scott