Top down shots

[markalot]

Hi Ed,

always love to read your thoughts, very informative as always ... but you asked above if someone wanted to see more pictures. YES.

 

[justy]

Hi I have just finished reading your thread I was put on to it by reefmutt big thanks to him! What can i say WOW your tank and methodology are an inspiration.
I have been keeping fish/corals for over thirty years and by reading your thread I have been reminded of some of the things I have forgotten over the years.
Keep it simple if you can, 15 years ago i had great success growing corals with mh and t5 and no dosing of anything.
I think we can all get caught up in the hype of new ways to run our systems. Unfortunately the more complex a system gets and the more perceived control we have the opposite becomes true. We chase numbers and lose control and our corals suffer.
Thanks again for pointing me in the right direction.

Thanks again Justin

 

[Big E]

Hi Ed,

What is your tank water's current PO4 level?

Thank you.

Last time I checked they were around .02. I don't think I've ever had that large of a gap between P04 and NO3 before, but since everything is doing well I'm going to leave it as is.

Right now they are lower because a few months ago I started using GFO full time. The main reason I did this was I was trying to create more stablility and consistency throughout my tank to see if I could get some benefits.

We all talk about it but I started realizing I should focus on keeping my system as consistent as possible. A few other things I did was do my water changes at smaller increments (twice a week), and also run carbon full time.

Obviously nothing ground breaking, but so far the results have helped as some Sps that were stalled for quite some time started to grow.

I also made a point to feed the fish constantly all day like how it is on a reef instead of twice a day. So there is more of a constant flow of food for the corals and fish. I'm feeding more as well.

Hi Ed,

always love to read your thoughts, very informative as always ... but you asked above if someone wanted to see more pictures. YES.

Hi Mark,

I'm working on it.............I've hacked up my larger colonies quite a bit lately and now since my frag tank has stabilized I can move some corals into there and maybe finally have a display tank to show instead of a glorified frag tank.

Still, I have way too many acros........it's a weakness we all have.

Hi I have just finished reading your thread I was put on to it by reefmutt big thanks to him! What can i say WOW your tank and methodology are an inspiration.
I have been keeping fish/corals for over thirty years and by reading your thread I have been reminded of some of the things I have forgotten over the years.
Keep it simple if you can, 15 years ago i had great success growing corals with mh and t5 and no dosing of anything.
I think we can all get caught up in the hype of new ways to run our systems. Unfortunately the more complex a system gets and the more perceived control we have the opposite becomes true. We chase numbers and lose control and our corals suffer.
Thanks again for pointing me in the right direction.

Thanks again Justin

Hi Justin and thanks! I'm glad the thread stirred up some thoughts for you.

It's very easy to get caught up in the hype and what goes through the forums on a daily/weekly basis.

The fundamentals never have changed and if you stick to proven methods and tech you're always going to be better off. I'm generally not a guinea pig.........it's up to the manufacturers to prove it to me over time. I'm very skeptical to blurbs of short term success on blogs, forums, ect.

I try to think logically and really dissect cause/effect. If your methods are simple you'll have a much easier time controlling your system and troubleshooting.

It's also good to find a way to stay connected to the tank................too much automation makes Murphy creep in or create a false sense of security.

 

[hbrochs]

How are you using the gfo?
Is it in a reactor, or more passive mesh bag?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[kainic]

I also made a point to feed the fish constantly all day like how it is on a reef instead of twice a day. So there is more of a constant flow of food for the corals and fish. I'm feeding more as well.

Hi Ed,

How are you doing it? Using an automate feeder? What food are you using? How often?

TIA

 

[Big E]

Hi Howard,

It's in a reactor........I'm using 4 ounces, which I think is half the recommended amount and slow flow.

I wasn't getting consistent results with it just sitting in the sump.........on my old setup I could run it passively because I had more flow throughout my sump.

Plus, with my plan to feed more, I knew I wasn't going to keep the levels in line and I also didn't want to give the nuisance algae a chance to start creeping in.

 

[Big E]

Hi Ed,

How are you doing it? Using an automate feeder? What food are you using? How often?

TIA

I don't have a specific plan of number of times..........I cut up what I need and then just dump some in throughout duration of my lights on period.

I more or less feed within a 6-7 hour time frame. My lights are only on for 8 hours so I don't feed much the first or last hour.

75% or more is chopped up raw frozen scallops, shrimp, clams...........mysis, Hikari Ocean plankton. I dump in all the juices that are created.

Once or twice a week some frozen Formula 1 or 2.

I throw in some Formula flake foods or NLS pellets on occasions when I'm lazy.

 

[sensei]

Big E
I discovered your thread 3 days ago and I because addicted to it. Took me 3 days to read from beginning to end. I learned a lot, thanks for all the info. The color in your corals are a real dream.. your corals are increadible..

I remember reading that you basted all your rocks every night for 15 min to get detritus suspended, do you still do that?

I am having problems in my new 600g system ( 9months old). I have some large cyano spots even though I have a lot of flow with 4 MP60s and 2 maxspect gyres in main dt. I feed 1 cube of frozen food and 1 sheet of nori and I have 17 fish, 7 of them tangs and several are big.

in my tank it is difficult to bast the rocks becuase it is 36" deep. should I blow rocks with a powerhead? how often should I do it? weekly with the 10% WC? I believe the detrietus in rocks is feeding the cyano? should I put a filter sock for a couple of hours after blowing rocks to trap detrietus or should I leave it to the skimmer?

I have a problem in my tank becuase I can not get my PO4 to show in hanna and I do not know if feeding more would make my cyano problem worst. can it be that the cyano is absorving the PO4 not enabling it to show in test kits? or is it a matter of just feeding more??

why is it that you feed only when lights are on? why don´t you feeding first and last hour of lights? I put the first sheet of nori in the morning when lights are still off, is this a bad practice?

Thanks a lot for your help

 

[DiscusHeckel]

Last time I checked they were around .02. I don't think I've ever had that large of a gap between P04 and NO3 before, but since everything is doing well I'm going to leave it as is.

Right now they are lower because a few months ago I started using GFO full time. The main reason I did this was I was trying to create more stablility and consistency throughout my tank to see if I could get some benefits.

We all talk about it but I started realizing I should focus on keeping my system as consistent as possible. A few other things I did was do my water changes at smaller increments (twice a week), and also run carbon full time.

Obviously nothing ground breaking, but so far the results have helped as some Sps that were stalled for quite some time started to grow.

I also made a point to feed the fish constantly all day like how it is on a reef instead of twice a day. So there is more of a constant flow of food for the corals and fish. I'm feeding more as well.

Thanks Ed. Do you fluidise carbon or use it passively in a filter bag/sock?

 

[sensei]

Ed,
At the begging of thread I remeber reading that you had PO4 levels of about 0.35, now you are using GFO and above I read you have levels of 0.02

Have you made any conclusion of which range do you preffer and why?

are you dosing vinager now

thanks

 

[sensei]

It's been a while and quite not what I expected when I switched tanks. It has taken a good 3.5 months for the corals to really start responding. Even though I used all the same water and rocks the balance still got knocked out of whack. I also had to run the tank fishless for about 6 weeks.

Ed,
When you had this ich problem, what did you feed your coral?
did you target feed?
did your corals maintained same colors?

I have a QT fishless tank that I run permanent to qt my coral and invertebrates in batches of 72 days. I target feed powder coral food 3 x per week. I alternate between coral frenzy and reef roids in each feeding. I turn circulation pumps off for about 10 min while I target feed. I also turn return pump off for 30min so that the food stays more concentrated in dt without going to the sump.

What do you think of these practice?
is it good to turn return pump as I am doing it now?

Thanks for your help

 

[Big E]

Thanks Ed. Do you fluidise carbon or use it passively in a filter bag/sock?

I have an old hang on box filter I use. The output line from the GFO goes into the box filter............carbon is in a nylon bag. I use half the amount recommended.

Set up this way, it's effectiveness is between using a reactor and passively.
I'm wary of stripping all the organics out of the water too quickly/completely.

 

[Big E]

Big E
I discovered your thread 3 days ago and I because addicted to it. Took me 3 days to read from beginning to end. I learned a lot, thanks for all the info. The color in your corals are a real dream.. your corals are increadible..

I remember reading that you basted all your rocks every night for 15 min to get detritus suspended, do you still do that?

I am having problems in my new 600g system ( 9months old). I have some large cyano spots even though I have a lot of flow with 4 MP60s and 2 maxspect gyres in main dt. I feed 1 cube of frozen food and 1 sheet of nori and I have 17 fish, 7 of them tangs and several are big.

Hi and thanks! I only baste more often if there is lots of detritus on the surface that is causing issues. Once the rock matures you should have less detritus accumulating.

I normally do it about 15 minutes before I do a water change. It makes sense to throw in a filter sock to catch it just so you don't get a build up in your sump.

in my tank it is difficult to bast the rocks becuase it is 36" deep. should I blow rocks with a powerhead? how often should I do it? weekly with the 10% WC? I believe the detrietus in rocks is feeding the cyano? should I put a filter sock for a couple of hours after blowing rocks to trap detrietus or should I leave it to the skimmer?

You have to be more careful using a powerhead. You could try to set up your pumps with more alternating current. That can help so all the buldup isn't as concentrated.

Any new setup is going to go through cycles of cyano and other short term algae type issues. As your tank matures they burn out or are out competed by your corals as they grow. If it's just on the rocks I wouldn't be as concerned.

You could also try some of the bacterial products without dosing carbon. The bacteria will compete with the cyano.

I have a problem in my tank becuase I can not get my PO4 to show in hanna and I do not know if feeding more would make my cyano problem worst. can it be that the cyano is absorving the PO4 not enabling it to show in test kits? or is it a matter of just feeding more??

That's possible for sure..........I wouldn't feed more.

why is it that you feed only when lights are on? why don´t you feeding first and last hour of lights? I put the first sheet of nori in the morning when lights are still off, is this a bad practice?

I'm usually doing other things like cleaning the glass, examining the setup and the corals. The fish aren't ready to eat right away when the lights come on. Near lights out is when I may do some basting or the fish are already starting to bed down.

I just do what basically works for my schedule.

The nori set up you have is fine.


Thanks a lot for your help

 

[Big E]

Ed,
When you had this ich problem, what did you feed your coral?
did you target feed?
did your corals maintained same colors?

I used Reef Frenzy and the juices from the fish food. The corals paled out and growth slowed. A month or two isn't going to be deadly in this condition, but months on end it would be more of a problem

I have a QT fishless tank that I run permanent to qt my coral and invertebrates in batches of 72 days. I target feed powder coral food 3 x per week. I alternate between coral frenzy and reef roids in each feeding. I turn circulation pumps off for about 10 min while I target feed. I also turn return pump off for 30min so that the food stays more concentrated in dt without going to the sump.

What do you think of these practice?
is it good to turn return pump as I am doing it now?

That looks like a sound plan to me.

Thanks for your help

 

[Big E]

Ed,
At the begging of thread I remeber reading that you had PO4 levels of about 0.35, now you are using GFO and above I read you have levels of 0.02

Have you made any conclusion of which range do you preffer and why?

are you dosing vinager now

thanks

When I started the setup I didn't want to chase nutrient numbers, so I didn't test them. I had been dosing vinegar and had the usual problem that is common now to most people. Nitrates zero and PO4 continuing to rise.

Nuisance algae become a problem so I wanted to get that down to a more manageable level and also have the nitrates higher than P04, not backwards as it was.

For most of the time my setup averaged in the .08-.10ppm range, but I was only using GFO occasionally. I'm using GFO full time now for about 3 months so it's a bit lower. My main goal was to limit the roller coaster effect of the levels. I'm now waiting to see how my current levels will work, but this is a months long process.

Most tanks fit into what I call a ballpark range approx. P04 .02-.11ppm and N03- .25-5.0ppm. Anywhere in there should work. I like Bulent's ( from Hans Werner?) average ratio of N03 being at least 10 times P04. It's not something I'd chase......just another data point to keep in mind.

I stopped using vinegar 3 years ago.

My old setup I ran just an oversized skimmer Deltec AP703 rated for a 500g tank on my 160g system and never had to use any GFO. I even sold my Hanna because my readouts were a rock solid .03 for 8 years.

I'd like to get back to that type of stability.

 

[sensei]

Thanks a lot for your help,

I thought diatoms and GHA was expected in new tanks ( I already went though those 2 cycles), but from your comments I understand cyano is also another phase of a new tank?

When you say that dosing bacteria can help, you mean bacteria in a bottle like Stability form Seachem?? if so, how much ( recommended dose) and how long should I dose?

Thanks again

 

[sensei]

Ed,
you say you used coral frency and the "juices from your fish" to feed coral when your tank was fishless. did you collected those juices from a skimmer in another tank? can you please comment a little more about it

Thanks

 

[Big E]

The juices & small particles were from the food I was feeding the fish in the QT tank. I strained the food through a fish net before I fed the chunks to the fish.

=================

Cyano is a tough thing to figure out and why so many people have issues with it. I don't think tanks hit a balance for at least a year or more.

Some people resort to chemi-clean or dosing peroxide but I don't care for chemical fixes like that.

I used Microbacter 7 but it was a slow process that did work. I used less than what was directed and only used it for about 2 months, so I don't have a lot of experience using the commercial bacteria cures.

I believe some people are testing Vibrant now, but I'm not sure if its just for algae or both..........jason2459 has an on going thread on this. I think it's in the chemical forum.

I would do more research before jumping into something like that.

 

[DiscusHeckel]

I have an old hang on box filter I use. The output line from the GFO goes into the box filter............carbon is in a nylon bag. I use half the amount recommended.

Set up this way, it's effectiveness is between using a reactor and passively.
I'm wary of stripping all the organics out of the water too quickly/completely.

Thank you for your replies to my questions Ed.

Bülent

 

[sensei]

The juices & small particles were from the food I was feeding the fish in the QT tank. I strained the food through a fish net before I fed the chunks to the fish.

ok, I understand now. I have read the you give the fish a seafood coctail from pieces of scalops, shrimp, clams, etc. How small to the particles need to be from all this seafoods so that the acros are able to digest it?

did you target feed them when you had the ich problem?

is it better to feed them this natural food partiples instead of coral frenzy and reef roids??

many people dose aminoacids and other vitamins. I do not think it would be necessary since powder coral food and seafood particules have protein and aminoacids are the building blocks of protein, so it would make sense taht the coral gets the aminos a vitamins from the coral food. any thoughts about this??

=================

Cyano is a tough thing to figure out and why so many people have issues with it. I don't think tanks hit a balance for at least a year or more.

Some people resort to chemi-clean or dosing peroxide but I don't care for chemical fixes like that.

I used Microbacter 7 but it was a slow process that did work. I used less than what was directed and only used it for about 2 months, so I don't have a lot of experience using the commercial bacteria cures.

I believe some people are testing Vibrant now, but I'm not sure if its just for algae or both..........jason2459 has an on going thread on this. I think it's in the chemical forum.

I would do more research before jumping into something like that.

when you said that you have to be more carefull with a powerhead to blow detrietus from rocks, you mean carefull with coral or is there something else?, is it something you would not do?

Thanks a lot for your answers