Total Slaughter!!!

[New2Nano]

Ok this is how it happened.....

4 days ago I purchased a new Yellow Watchman Goby, a big feather duster, 1 medium sized sand sifting star, 1 orange Bally star, and bunch of snails and hermits. This was all being added to my 20g High tank which already had 5 hermits, 10 snails, 2 Peppermint Shrimp, and 1 domino damsel . The Perameters where perfect. So any way I am tottaly loving everything. I go to sleep and the next morning I wake to find my sandsifter totally beat up, my first instinct was hermit crab attacks because the white indents on its body wherent very large. But after further examination I noticed that the tip of one arm was completely missing. i was ****ed to say the least. But at that time I was already late for school so i had to go. I got home as fast as i could. I found that an entire leg was now missing and a lot of stringy orange and yellow stuff was hangin out. of course i wanted to get him out but i have nowhere for it to go. So i made my room look like night and came back in like 3 or 4 hrs. with a flashlight. Nothing. So i came back 2 hrs later right before bed and found that the star only had 2 legs left out of 5. I couldnt believe it. So i got on the internet and researched mantis shrimp. Made the inverted bottle trap and put the star fish remains in it as my LFS suggested. woke up and the starfish was dead untouched. so i took it out and went to school. Then after school i had to work so i didnt get home till 8. I found my domino dead with a gaping whole in its underbelly. i took it out and flushed it. after further inspection one of my peps was belly up in the back of the tank but with no apperent injuried. Next i went to the store and bought raw shrimp for bait. put it in and had no luck. next morning my goby was dead also w/ no injury, and so was the other pep. raw shrimp untouched. so i made my room dark again and waited an hr. came in with a flashlight to see a worm like thing stretching out of a whole. it was purple and very very thin only sticking out about 2.5-3 inched. But hid quickly once teh light hit it. So today i did a freshwater dip w/ the rock i saw the worm thingy in. waited for what seemed forever and put it back in the tank cuz nothing happened. Im so frusterated. I NEED HELP!! Thanks ~Jerod

 

[Dexter1334]

You might try some seltzer in the hole where you saw the worm. Sometimes that will drive them out. I used fresh water to driveout a mantis. When I knew which hole he was in. It is not recommended to dip the whole rock as this will kill beneficial stuff. It should work with a worm too.

Sounds like you might have a predatory worm. My mantis haven't bothered the brittle stars or fish though they have taken out a few snails and some small crabs.

 

[traveller7]

Stars are very senistive to variations in Specific Gravity. What method of acclimation did you use? What is the SG of your tank and with what tool is it being measured.

Predator or not, that last add was a significant increase in bio load. What is the current pH and ammonia level?

If you do not have a high volume skimmer, air pump, or powerhead with a venturi, I would consider adding one immediately.

fwiw: With the given information, it does not sound like a mantis or a worm.

 

[New2Nano]

my salt gravity is 1.023 and i tested everything before acclimating. Everything was perfect. I Drip acclimated for an hr at the least. I have a Maxi jet 606 for water movement. So are you telling me that the water condidtions or something about the water violently tore legs off my handsized sandsifter, or knocked the guts out of my domino damsel who had been living in there for 1 month? INTERESTING. Weird thing is that the trap bait isnt even being touched at all.

 

[ATLDrtybird7]

Water chemistry has the potential to change drastically from hour to hour. Testing the water before you introduce anything into the tank tells nothing of what is going on now. I reccomend that you check your nitrite (NO2) and ammonia/ammonium levels which can definately cause skin damage and cause loss of arms in starfish/sea stars. Also, check your pH, a high pH with elevated nitrite levels make the water more toxic than a low pH in the presence of nitrite. It is possible that you do have a predator in your rocks (and my mantis has mamed many starfish/sea stars) but even if the 'prdaator' didnt kill everything, you had decaying matter in your aquarium for several hours (starfish arms, dead fish, etc) that will most definately raise nitrites, which do indeed cause very violent flesh wounds to fish and can cause inverts to lose their appendages... so consider all of your possibilities, but first and foremost, look to your water quality in these situations. It is important to know your water quality is good when adding specimins, but know that wiht an increased bio load and an occurance of death, it most likely will not be the same as when you initally checked it. Jus the addition of new specimins will cause a spike in nitrite, so follow up with that first, and let me know how things are looking, and hopefully we can come up with a solution for you.
Mike

 

[traveller7]

......So are you telling me that the water condidtions or something about the water violently tore legs off my handsized sandsifter, or knocked the guts out of my domino damsel who had been living in there for 1 month? INTERESTING. Weird thing is that the trap bait isnt even being touched at all.

No, something caused the death of the fish which would seem more like water quality during a doubling of bio load then the sudden appearance of a predator.

You have enough hermits to make short work of the weak or dead critters to support the described level of damage.

Starfish are well known to erode and drop pieces in times of poor water quality and improper acclimation.

IMO: Lack of disturbance of the bait in the trap supports a well fed predator or the lack there of. Continue to try different fresh baits at different times of the day, but do not let it rot in there or it will contribute to a decline in water quality.

fwiw: I have serpents, brittle, chocolate chip, and other misc stars in with 3 different types of mantis without any negative effects.

Good luck.

 

[ATLDrtybird7]

what species of mantis do you have, mine has beat the living crap out of my brittle... he only has 1 arm left!

 

[New2Nano]

Water chemistry has the potential to change drastically from hour to hour. Testing the water before you introduce anything into the tank tells nothing of what is going on now. I reccomend that you check your nitrite (NO2) and ammonia/ammonium levels which can definately cause skin damage and cause loss of arms in starfish/sea stars. Also, check your pH, a high pH with elevated nitrite levels make the water more toxic than a low pH in the presence of nitrite. It is important to know your water quality is good when adding specimins, but know that wiht an increased bio load and an occurance of death, it most likely will not be the same as when you initally checked it. Jus the addition of new specimins will cause a spike in nitrite, so follow up with that first, and let me know how things are looking, and hopefully we can come up with a solution for you.
Mike

Thanks for the help. And yes i do know to check the water chemistry after the introduction which I did and there was a slight rise in nites, nates, and ammonia but nothing to be worried about. It was Expected. As you said i did have rotting things in my tank so i realize that it was that contributing to the death, But i dont think you realize the carnage. It was bad. and it wasnt slow. i would leave for an hour come back and 2 legs where gone no evidence anywhere of their remains. And believe me i looked. then go to work and my doms guts are ripped out, I also forgot to mention that prior to the additions i found that a couple of hermits looked as if they stepped on a landmine. There was legs scattered and empty shells, but i didnt really think much of it maybe just some Ultimate Fighting Championships or something. Very Frusterated. On the plus side i will be redoing my aquascaping after the hunt for the killer is over. PS what could this worm be? it was very very slender and i saw no mouthparts, didnt look like a predator at all. thanks all

 

[traveller7]

Likely a bristleworm.

If it is a mantis, the hermits snail shells will be broken up. If the shells are not broken, look to a molt or bad water conditions.

 

[New2Nano]

worm or whatever it is isnt bristly at all though...........

 

[brekurboy1]

is it dark brown and kind of thick? (like more than 1/4" inch?) maybe it's one of those crazy coral eating worms that eat other stuff too. just throwing it out there.

 

[jjrock]

For the record, I have a Mantis shrimp (OS) that is so aggressive he will literally kill ANYTHING I put in with him, whether or not he intends to eat it.

I went and bought a nice feather duster the other day, put it in there pretty much figuring the Mantis had no reason to kill it, but he immediately attacked it, bashing it repeatedly until the tube cracked open --then he simply pushed it aside.

Needless to say, the worm iself came out of the tube and died.

A Mantis (who is likely a basher) would not touch your Domino Damsel (unless the Damsel was already sick and dying or dead). My Mantis Shrmip don't bother with Damsels as they are too fast.

I'd like to see pics of that worm if you can get 'em.

JJ.

 

[MJI]

Try a search for eunice worms??

 

[overflowin]

if you mix up a soloution of water with a sg of about 1.030 and dip your rocks for about 30 second (one at a time) it will drive all the inverts out of their hiding spots. then you can sort thru the criyyer and keep the good and find a new home (or grave) for the baddies. some worms may need to be pulled out with needle nose pliers or tweezers.

i did this and it worked famously... hope this helps!

donnie

 

[JBrown]

My mantis is in with a damsel, a red brittle star and a false perc and has not bothered any of them. But when I put the starfish in he got a good suprise when he tried to get into my mantis's cave.

 

[ATLDrtybird7]

Wow, I'm impressed at what you all can put in with your mantises... maybe mine has a mean streak, but he has managed to kill 4 fish, including a rather quick pinfish, half the worlds population of turbo snails, by brittle star is barely clinging to life with his one arm, and he even went after my searass!!! maybe he just has a really nasty mean streak... the odd thing is he is a 2'' G. smithii...

 

[New2Nano]

I dont know what to do I am really getting tired of this. I have been baiting the tank for 2 weeks nothing has happend. So i thought i would try a 3 dollar green chromis. It lasted 2 nights this morning i found his skeleton. Im really ****ed. Im gonna set up a vid camera on night shot all night if i have to so i can see this bastard. GRRRRRRR

 

[brekurboy1]

Wow, I'm impressed at what you all can put in with your mantises... maybe mine has a mean streak, but he has managed to kill 4 fish, including a rather quick pinfish, half the worlds population of turbo snails, by brittle star is barely clinging to life with his one arm, and he even went after my searass!!! maybe he just has a really nasty mean streak... the odd thing is he is a 2'' G. smithii...

G. Smithii are known for being mean. I've read lots of stuff on how they're more aggressive than other mantis species.

What's wierd is my Peacock mantis is nice as can be. I put turbo snails right in his maxillipeds and he just plays with it and drops it. he even does that with the hermit crabs. What a wuss.

 

[imbuggin]

newtonano

newtonano

newtonano you still never answered the question of you water parameters. I think you were trying to say you had a rise in nirates ammonia and nitrites. "but nothing to worry about" any rise or level above zero is something to worry about. It can be toxic to fish!

If you water is bad it could kill a fish in minutes only to be ripped apart by preditors