Unusual Fish Behavior?

[Aqualund]

Okay let me preface this by saying that Im a big geek when it comes to my tank and water chemistry, and I check it regularly. I can say right now all of my parameters are near NSW with +/- .1-.5ppm. And these parameters are stable.

But I am seeing some bad signs with my fish that I cannot explain. My anthias have been having issues. Ever since I switched to the new stand and move rock around, I have not seen my Male Lyretail (3 weeks) except once for about 5 seconds...and then another time when I was doing a water change at night. At the night sighting he just same back and forth like he was on drugs.

I started with 5 Anthias...1 male and 4 female. About 1.5 months ago I awoke to 1 female being dead. Then another female started changing color to a male right about the time the current male dissapeared. Yesterday, the changing color female was dead and eaten by the shrimp. today I have 2 females left...1 is hiding head first in a rock with its fins tore up...and the other is swimming around just fine and eating and happy. I still do not know if the male is alive as I have not seen him.

Beyond all this, all of my fish, (15chromis, 1 CBB, 1 Scopas) seem very skiddish but still eat just fine. However they just dont seem to want to interact with me like they used to.

None of the fish have any visible parasites, scarring, or disease. They all look really healthy. The only thing I can say is that the tip of the mouth of my CBB is a little more pinkish than normal, and he is breathing kinda heavy.

My melanarus Wrasse is just fine and is doing everything he's always done.

The only changes to the setup that were made upon the new stand were flexible PVC, moved the lights higher (less par), and moved the rock work around.

Beyond all of that...every single one of my corals is doing AMAZING...growing like crazy and having great polyp extension.

I am leaning towards territorial and behavioral factors that the anthias are experiencing and affecting the whole community. However Im not unwilling to accept a water parameter.

Any thoughts?

 

[snorvich]

What are your water parameters? (I know they are "good" but you are asking for help). What sized tank? What inhabitants?

 

[Aqualund]

The water parameters are NSW +/- .5 ppm. 1.025 Salinity and 78 degrees temp. Stable.

The inhabitants are the fish I listed and then a dense SPS and LPS reef, with maintenance crew.

Tank size is 75G with a 20G sump and 20G frag tank.

 

[snorvich]

In your sized tank, my speculation is chromis issues. However, what is the behavior of the remaining fish? Are they somewhat reclusive? Hanging near the returns?

 

[SushiGirl]

What are your other water parameters such as ammonia and nitrate?
Moving rock around can cause problems with those.

 

[dirtyBit]

+1 SushiGirl. I know anthias are pretty delicate and might have trouble with this.

 

[Aqualund]

Yeah its weird. My parameters are basically NSW meaning no ammonia and 2ppm. nitrate. And like I said, the other fish are fine, and I have never had a problem with the chromis as they are passive. I have had all of these fish for a year with no aggression issues. Im thinking change in environment is possible...but I am concerned that maybe there is an unseen parasite or chemical.

But to your question, just recently the other fish have become more reclusive...as in they all disappear when I show up. This is in STARK contrast to just 2 weeks ago and the whole year prior.

 

[snorvich]

Yeah its weird. My parameters are basically NSW meaning no ammonia and 2ppm. nitrate. And like I said, the other fish are fine, and I have never had a problem with the chromis as they are passive. I have had all of these fish for a year with no aggression issues. Im thinking change in environment is possible...but I am concerned that maybe there is an unseen parasite or chemical.

But to your question, just recently the other fish have become more reclusive...as in they all disappear when I show up. This is in STARK contrast to just 2 weeks ago and the whole year prior.

When was the last fish added? the more information you can provide, the better chance we can be helpful.

 

[prop-frags]

Depending on how drastic the change in the rock work and how you went about doing it, the fish could behave as if they're in a different territory and you are the big bad predator that caused horrific stress to them and triggering their "flee" response.

As far as chemical possibilities, Sushi girl raised a good point, but your typical testing should show any elevated levels caused by stirring up detritus, etc. This leaves your comment about new plumbing - if you added new plumbing, did you thoroughly clean the new pvc before adding it? What kind of cement did you use? Was it possible to cure the cement prior to plumbing it into the system?

IME, lyretails will eventually beat/kill one another. Actually, keeping harems of most any species is tricky business, as the males are always having to harass and dominate the females to keep them from changing. The females are always scrapping amongst themselves to establish the pecking order, with an alpha female always right on the verge of changing as soon as the male shows any weakness or injury. Males who were previously alpha females can be wicked-aggressive towards the remaining females, especially in the first several weeks of them changing over - my guess is some kind of hormonal rage :angryfire:

 

[MrTuskfish]

lots of good info above.
IMO, your tank is way too small for a group of any anthias, a single fish is different. LA suggests 125 minimum and I think any other source will agree. Active fish that have an active male/female thing going need lots of room. I don't know if this is the cause of your problem, but I'm sure it contributes to whatever is going on. Also, all the chromis may be playing nice; but they can easily intimidate touchy fish, like anthias. A big herd of chromis and a harem of anthias just won't work (long-term) in a 75 gal tank. (IMO & IME).

 

[snorvich]

lots of good info above.
IMO, your tank is way too small for a group of any anthias, a single fish is different. LA suggests 125 minimum and I think any other source will agree. Active fish that have an active male/female thing going need lots of room. I don't know if this is the cause of your problem, but I'm sure it contributes to whatever is going on. Also, all the chromis may be playing nice; but they can easily intimidate touchy fish, like anthias. A big herd of chromis and a harem of anthias just won't work (long-term) in a 75 gal tank. (IMO & IME).

What he said, ever so much better than I.

 

[Aqualund]

All great information, thank you very much prop (& others). This is what I was leaning towards, and therefore makes me even more fascinated with the species, and ready to buy a 200g lol

 

[snorvich]

IME, lyretails will eventually beat/kill one another. Actually, keeping harems of most any species is tricky business, as the males are always having to harass and dominate the females to keep them from changing. The females are always scrapping amongst themselves to establish the pecking order, with an alpha female always right on the verge of changing as soon as the male shows any weakness or injury. Males who were previously alpha females can be wicked-aggressive towards the remaining females, especially in the first several weeks of them changing over - my guess is some kind of hormonal rage :angryfire:

Which is why larger tanks have the possibility of working better. I have harems in each of my tanks and your description of the social interaction is accurate. Since I have 8 foot tanks, it seems to work itself out, but my males each have their harem which they herd and protect.