AGYDAL
New member
I have a LPS dominant setup that's been under the light nine months now, colors are stable and amazing.*
*edit: except for one that was my mistake...see next post.
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Vertex Illumina Club
- Thread starter deangelr
- Start date
I have a LPS dominant setup that's been under the light nine months now, colors are stable and amazing.*
*edit: except for one that was my mistake...see next post.
AGYDAL
New member
Have you had the opportunity to see this light perform in person?
I don't need a PAR check to tell me what my corals can...the left side of the tank is dark because of my rockwork, the right side of my tank the rockwork slopes, at the edge of this I had a showpiece LPS and it bleached setting on the sand...it's now on the left slowly regaining it's color...according to my coral, the light is still intense at the edges.
jimrawr
New member
Guys I got my hands on an Apogee Meter and plan on doing some tests tomorrow at difference % for the LEDs. I did a quick run at it tonight just to get an idea and I wasnt impressed by the numbers at all. At the surface of the water was around 300, and down about 12-16 inches it was down in the 100's. I had turned the LEDs up 100% on all.
Will try to take some pics and different measurments tomorrow
Will try to take some pics and different measurments tomorrow
bluebastion
Member
... Interesting... Would like to to see the pics and results. This is much different than what I've seen posted for this fixture.
Rocky_Mtn_Reef
In Memoriam
Got to be something wrong w/ your fixture then...cause videos i have seen showing people take their measurments real time had way way higher numbers. Are you sure it was at 100%. I just replaced 2 250w mhs with these and have the whites 40% and both blues around 60% power and about 10" off the water and its way brighter...havnt tested the par yet though...waiting to get my hands on the club meter.
jimrawr
New member
I just retried it again. Went into expert mode, turned everything to 100% and uploaded via VLink. Unit restarted with the new settings, which are bright as hell. Right above the water level, and about 10 inches from the LEDs the reading was around 390, then about two inches under water and it drops to 250. Almost near the bottom it was down to 70.
I will try and take many pics tomorrow and possibly post a video. I am using an Apogee QMSS which puts out in PPDF not PAR, though my understand is that it shouldnt make a difference as far as the readings go.
Also, this is the 24" Illumina 260 model, not the 200.
I will try and take many pics tomorrow and possibly post a video. I am using an Apogee QMSS which puts out in PPDF not PAR, though my understand is that it shouldnt make a difference as far as the readings go.
Also, this is the 24" Illumina 260 model, not the 200.
bluebastion
Member
Maybe Kolognekoral can chime in on this one. The only thing I can think of is that the light might be too high?
I have my fixture 6" above the water level... The highest I've installed a light fixture was 9" but that was a MH light and the only reason it was mounted so high was because of heat issues.
I have my fixture 6" above the water level... The highest I've installed a light fixture was 9" but that was a MH light and the only reason it was mounted so high was because of heat issues.
jimrawr
New member
Dont think that matters. When I put the sensor 5 inches from the LED its reading 300ish. Thats out of water. Ive tried moving the height around of the light and results are the same. Will post some pictures and more definitive results soon. I am thinking there is definitely a problem with this meter reading LEDs, especially since it seems like an older model
jimrawr
New member
Here are my results. I tested in three difference intensities. 100/100/100, 100/0/0, 0/100/100. The reason I did this is because Ive read a lot that the sensor cannot pick up on the blues as efficiently, so I wanted to see what kind of drop off there would be without the whites at all.
Here is 100/100/100
Here is 100/0/0
Here is 0/100/100
And here is the meter I am using
Here is 100/100/100
Here is 100/0/0
Here is 0/100/100
And here is the meter I am using
bluebastion
Member
Is there a reefer around you that has AI Sols you can test to compare?
Kolognekoral
New member
Admittedly, I've never used a meter to check PAR. I have read the lab report on the Illuminas, however. The criteria is the lamp hanging 6"/15cm over the water. This is important as part of the measured PAR is due to the reflection and refraction of the light that is achieved at this height. The Illumina does not use an optic to concentrate the light, rather utilizes the LED's lens to spread the light and this factor is calculated for. that is to say, if the light is hung higher on a typical tank, you will loose light from the wide angle of the lens. It never hits the water. A height over 6" is only recommended when the tank has a width over 24".
The actual lab test gives 260 PAR at 50cm below the water surface in a 60cm wide tank when the lamp is hung 15cm over the watet surface. (aquarists measurements are typically higher that the tests, as moving tank water can augment the PAR value). Light emmision is pure air will be different, as air has a different refraction index! Part of the genius in these units is their use of factors that are ignored by most designers. It's a bit like cooking; two eggs can be fried, scrambled or turned into an opulent omlet. It is technique that makes the difference, not the eggs.
Also, I should mention that your tank is plexiglass, which has a different refraction index than glass. There will be slight variations in PAR, although most of the reason you are not reading what you expect is the height of the lamp over the water surface.
As to PAR in itself, we should always remember that a PAR meter is registering all light waves in the photosynthetic spectrum as part of the PAR value. That means light that is actually not very usefull to corals will be registered as PAR, which makes this a questionable parameter. When the utilized LEDs are in the cool white to blue-violet spectrum, then the measured PAR will be of use. If the lamps are producing large amount of light in the yellow to red spectrum, also part of PAR, you will get a high AR value, but not of the radiation your corals require. Ultimately, one must run a unit for a few months to really be able to judge its effects on your coral community. Using the blues alone will give a low PAR value, however, this is the part of the PAR spectrum that is vital to the corals. It is simply difficult for a par meter to read properly, or better said, to put it in the proper context.
Does this help?
The actual lab test gives 260 PAR at 50cm below the water surface in a 60cm wide tank when the lamp is hung 15cm over the watet surface. (aquarists measurements are typically higher that the tests, as moving tank water can augment the PAR value). Light emmision is pure air will be different, as air has a different refraction index! Part of the genius in these units is their use of factors that are ignored by most designers. It's a bit like cooking; two eggs can be fried, scrambled or turned into an opulent omlet. It is technique that makes the difference, not the eggs.
Also, I should mention that your tank is plexiglass, which has a different refraction index than glass. There will be slight variations in PAR, although most of the reason you are not reading what you expect is the height of the lamp over the water surface.
As to PAR in itself, we should always remember that a PAR meter is registering all light waves in the photosynthetic spectrum as part of the PAR value. That means light that is actually not very usefull to corals will be registered as PAR, which makes this a questionable parameter. When the utilized LEDs are in the cool white to blue-violet spectrum, then the measured PAR will be of use. If the lamps are producing large amount of light in the yellow to red spectrum, also part of PAR, you will get a high AR value, but not of the radiation your corals require. Ultimately, one must run a unit for a few months to really be able to judge its effects on your coral community. Using the blues alone will give a low PAR value, however, this is the part of the PAR spectrum that is vital to the corals. It is simply difficult for a par meter to read properly, or better said, to put it in the proper context.
Does this help?
Beenalongtime79
New member
Looks really, really bright, but those PAR numbers really stink!
bluebastion
Member
When I researched this fixture I ran into a thread on another reefing forum that also did PAR tests.... That actually was what sold me:
http://www.masa.asn.au/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=148&t=196860&start=600
http://www.masa.asn.au/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=148&t=196860&start=600
Beenalongtime79
New member
yeah, those numbers are great! I've seen them before, that's why the new PAR numbers posted are sooo confusing and perplexing.
Could it be a driver issue? I guess it could be the PAR meter but he did check it against the MH fixture.
Beenalongtime79
New member
Check out these PAR numbers for the new Maxspect Mazarra units, ridiculous!!! Watch out you don't scorch your corals. 
The 1400-1500 numbers are just under the water surface!
The 1400-1500 numbers are just under the water surface!
bluebastion
Member
Check out these PAR numbers for the new Maxspect Mazarra units, ridiculous!!! Watch out you don't scorch your corals.
The 1400-1500 numbers are just under the water surface!
Very nice! I was going to go Mazarras originally, but changed my mind last minute to the Vertex. The Illuminas had/have a great track record already and the Mazarras were an unknown commodity at the time of purchase. On top of that it seems the ship date on pre-orders kept getting pushed further back. I also liked Vertex's wireless controlling through the light studio instead of having to use a tethered controller. All said, the main reason I bought the Vertex was that it is basically non-existent. It's there, but it's not a "hey-look-at-me" form factor. Mazarra's are an industrial work of art in itself, however I'd rather people stare at my tank rather than the light.
I want to get a PAR meter to check my specs on my tank.... but right now I'd rather shell out the money for the MP40.
jimrawr
New member
Yes thanks for that post. Though I will say those numebsr are taken when the light is hung 5.5" from the water surface, so that isnt an issue here. Not sure what is TBH. Also I just checked something out which is wierd. When I hold the sensor about an inch under the LEDs the meter reads really high, 1600-1800. As soon as I drop it to basically water level or a little higher (3-4 inches) it drops down into the 300s. Isnt that a crazy drop for such a small depth?
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jimrawr
New member
I checked it against a MH fixture but it was out of water. I just hung the unit and tested the air under it and the numbers were great
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