Vortech vs Closed Loop?

With regard to vortech noise, I am convinced they have upgraded to newer motors. I have an old Gen 1 that is easily 4x as loud as a new Gen 2 I just got. The new Vortechs are MUCH quieter. I wonder if they use brushless motors? It sort of sounds like it.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13292560#post13292560 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Aimforever
With regard to vortech noise, I am convinced they have upgraded to newer motors. I have an old Gen 1 that is easily 4x as loud as a new Gen 2 I just got. The new Vortechs are MUCH quieter. I wonder if they use brushless motors? It sort of sounds like it.
Click to expand...

Have you put the new Gen 2 magnets in the older one yet? I wonder how much difference they make themselves. I don't think they would have changed out the motors yet, makes it hard on a small company to have to keep multiple types of spare parts around, but it could happen. Or at least different lots from their supplier, maybe later ones are to higher tolerances or something.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13292560#post13292560 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Aimforever
With regard to vortech noise, I am convinced they have upgraded to newer motors. I have an old Gen 1 that is easily 4x as loud as a new Gen 2 I just got. The new Vortechs are MUCH quieter. I wonder if they use brushless motors? It sort of sounds like it.
Click to expand...

I would have to agree. The latest Vortech I got is MUCH quieter than my older one. I sent the older one in, but I still think I am having some issues with it.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13292911#post13292911 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by TulsaReefer
Have you put the new Gen 2 magnets in the older one yet? I wonder how much difference they make themselves. I don't think they would have changed out the motors yet, makes it hard on a small company to have to keep multiple types of spare parts around, but it could happen. Or at least different lots from their supplier, maybe later ones are to higher tolerances or something.
Click to expand...

Yes the Gen1 Vortech is fully upgraded with all Gen 2 hardware and software. However, the noise I am referring too is definitely due to the motor itself. I am virtually positive they are using new motors. The sounds from the two different dry sides are totally different, the new Gen2 being significantly quieter. The noise has nothing to do with the magnet alignment, rather it is the actual sound of the DC motor revving.

I don't think it would be very difficult for them to sub in a similar spec'ed motor that has been slightly tweaked to reduce noise output. Think about it, what is one of the top complaints you always hear about the Vortech? It is too noisy. I can hear my Gen1 across my entire apartment (even through a closed door) when it is pulsing at full speed. The Gen2 I can't hear from 10 feet away. It makes sense a lot of sense that they would switch to motors that have been tweaked to directly address the noise issue, which is exactly what I think they did.

This is of course all my own speculation. :D
 
They could have changed the motors, it's probably hard to tell without disassembling a couple of them.

I just got my older pump that I bought used. It was actually an unused pump, with everything still in brand new shape, but still is "used" since it's a secondary sale and over a year old so out of warrantee. It's the older non-wireless controller version. The wireless controller upgrade should be here Monday, and a new Gen 2 magnet some time later next week. The strange thing is that when I hooked it up on my new tank (which only has about 8" of water in it right now), running at full speed, it seemed quieter than my new Gen 2 pump for motor noise. There was a little more of a vibration from the wet end, but the motor was pretty quiet. My newer Gen 2 pump had less vibration, but more of a whine out of the motor. Maybe they are just balancing the motors better now too. If something like that was a tiny bit out of balance I could see how it would vibrate.

So I'll have to wait and see how it works out, once the tank fills with water it should help dampen the vibrations some and I'll see how it goes then. And they may just need a more thorough job getting them aligned. The newer pump is on my old 110 gallon tank, so it's not running near full speed right now, about 1/3 or 1/2 in reef crest mode, so it's very quiet that way for now. And after I get the new tank set up I'll be able to see if I can run these at full speed or if I'll be needing to keep them down a bit anyway depending on how the aquascaping goes.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13297454#post13297454 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by TulsaReefer
My newer Gen 2 pump had less vibration, but more of a whine out of the motor. Maybe they are just balancing the motors better now too.
Click to expand...

That is interesting, as it is the opposite of what I observed. (My Gen1 whines loud, Gen2 can barely be heard) All my observations have been made with the pumps pulsing at full speed, so maybe that has something to do with it. I'm not sure.

Either way, I concede that it's poor form on my part to say they must be new motors when I am basing that off my experience with just one old pump and one new pump, but it sounds like in both of our cases there are significant differences in pump noise. Perhaps you are right that it is something different, although the general consensus seems to be that the newer ones are quieter.

I guess the only way to really know for sure is to ask them in their sponsor forum if they have made any changes that would make the newest pumps quieter. I just wish I had ended up with two of the quiet ones :rolleye1:
 
The WWD upgrade came today for the older Vortech I got last Friday. Installed it and was very surprised that it completely changed the sound of the motor. It sounds a lot more like my Gen 2 pump now, and before it had a kind of hesitation that you could feel somewhat like a thump every few seconds, and now it's running smooth. So I wonder if it's as much a change in the way they regulate power to the pump. The new WWD has a lot more components in it than the old non wireless controller. Now I'll have to wait for the new Gen 2 magnet upgrade and then see if that changes anything else. At this point I could easily run the older pump at at least 85% power without really hearing it at all. It may be because the pump is down on the end of the tank that faces a corner of the room about 1.5 feet away, and the high pitch motor sound seems to be trapped in the corner and not really reflect out to the rest of the room much. If I put my head around the side of the tank I can hear it for sure, but not otherwise. Oh well, I want to take the other one off my old tank and put them both on the new one to play around, but I've got a few other things I need to get done, if I get time I may do it later this week.
 
The Gen 2 magnet upgrade came Friday for the older pump, so now it's really a full Gen 2 pump, with a new WWD and Gen 2 magnet assembly. I posted over in the Vortech forum asking about the new WWD and how it seemed to smooth out the older pump I had and they replied that it was a much better driver, and ran the pump smoother, cooler, and with less power. They didn't say if they've ever changed the actual motors, so I'm not sure on that.

I have the pump now running at Reef Crest mode on full speed, and can barely hear it when it revs up, and then only if I am listening for it. I think if it weren't for being in a corner and that blocking a lot of the sound it would sound a lot louder, but where it's located keeps it pretty quiet.

I'm also impressed at the amount of current a single Vortech can put in a 220G tank (72x24x30). I have it mounted about half way up the tank on the one end, and there are little swirling eddies of current picking up debris from the sand on the far end of the tank. The only other movement I have in the tank is a modded Tunze 6025 on the back facing forward, and the return pump which is probably doing about 650 GPH. The whole tank is pretty turbulent. With it where it is I'm not really seeing any sand storms, though the sand is slowly building up in little riffles across the bottom, but it's actually pretty nice and natural looking, so I don't mind at all. I can't wait to see when I add the second Vortech and another modded Tunze...
 
You guys really have me wanting to drop $400 on one of these guys. JD, do you think 1 would be enough for a 150 tall? Right now I'm using to seio 900gph pumps and a mag12 for my returns.
 
Yes one would be fine. Ask Doug (DG) he had one in his tank and from my understanding he said 1 vortech out performed both his tunze's. The undertow theese things have is unbelievable! I think if you dont want to buy 2 then one and supliment it with your seio. Your corals will love you!! I've seen sooooo much more coloration in my corals since adding the vortech's! Go for it!!
 
So Greg are you liking the vortech? Are you considering it over the closed loop? I have to admitt the undertow is wonderful. I love the performance of this pump. Very impressed.
 
Well I like the Vortech, and I like the closed Loop, so I may do both. I really like the battery b/u feature on the Vortech, the way the weather has been the last few years it will probably be needed. I am def going with the closed loop, but I am not going to have a wave maker of any sort so the Vortech will probably help with a bit of that as well.
 
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