What's wrong with my Haitian reef nem?

[CMDemey]

I am a beginner, our nem has had short fat tenticles for a couple months now and I want to see if anyone else knows if this is normal or if I am doing something wrong. I'm hoping its just that we over feed and it has no reason to search the water for food but I have no idea. Our tank is 4 months old, our levels have all been fantastic since the start, so far, even though we are only in a 29g tank. When purchased, its tenticles were longer. We feed a small bit of frozen krill every 3 days and also 1cc of MicroVert twice a day. Its in a tank with some live rock, emerald crab, 4 fish, and some snails, and a chocolate chip sea star. Its tankmates don't bother it, no one is nipping at it. It was stationary near one of the air stones and filter intake for nearly 2 months until I put a prefilter along thing around the intake to protect the new, now its moving each day but slowly around that half of the tank. Its tentacles are out except when it purges its waste as normal, its tenticles are just very short and fat and not like most of the pictures or other condys I've seen so I am worried. Its tenticles were long and thin when it arrivesd. Its foot is more pink than red, its tentacles are normal colored just bloated looking. It still eats and doesn't refuse its food, sometimes it does spit some out later after eating half of it if we fed it too big of a piece. I will try to upload some pictures. Any advice is appreciated.

 

[higgs83]

Without knowing the filtration you have (the air stones concern me a little...), I would say you might be feeding too much and causing more stress than good. Nems use light as their primary source, and a lot of people don't feed their nets unless they're supplementing for inadequate light or they just want their nem to grow a bunch. I definitely would cut that down in order to decrease ammonia in the tank and not cause extra work/stress to the nem.

 

[Dkuhlmann]

Is there any particular reason you chose this anemone? A few things you might want to know, this is from Live Aquaria website. Lots more information here on RC as well as if you Google them. Also to add this anemone is not a clown hosting anemone. I agree with Higgs sounds like you've been feeding it way too much food.

The Haitian Reef Anemone, also known as the Pink-Tip Condy, is found near Haiti, in lagoons or on inner reefs, as individuals, or loose groups. It is never found in connected clusters. It has a red column with long, tapering, pink-tipped tentacles. The tentacles may occasionally develop a bubble-like appearance. Generally it likes to bury the base in the sand or into the crevice of a rock for protection.

The Haitian Reef Anemone requires strong light and should never be purchased if a good lighting system is not in place. It will do well in an aquarium with live rock and several crustaceans. Although an Anemone requires a reef environment, it is not the best suited for the reef aquarium. The Haitian Reef Anemone moves around the tank and has a sting that can inflict grave damage to other anemones and corals. Do not include its natural predators such as the Red-Leg Hermit Crab. Unlike other anemones, the Haitian Reef Anemone does not have a relationship with any particular fish, and it is rare for any type of clownfish or damsel to reside within them.

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=497+499+630&pcatid=630

 

[CMDemey]

I will cut our feeding back to start. We found so much conflicting info on feeding. Some feed little bits daily, some every other day, some once a week, etc. We got the Condy because everything I read put it in our care parameters because they don't require as good of lighting as the other nems, for one. We have decent LED lighting for marine tanks but will be upgrading it and adding a protein skimmer in another month or so. We don't have any ammonia issues and have been diligent about doing our chemical tests, water changes, and adding PH up here and there, diluted salt as needed, and the no stress stuff at water changes. We have no metal contamination in our water, phosphate filter in with charcoal pad, and phosphate not an issue, test that as well, and other than treating a little red hair alge, our tank has cycled and stayed clear and in perfect range with everything. I tried to post pictures but couldn't get them to load. We have a Penguin hanging filter, live sand, live rock, not over crowded, small fish, NO ammonia issues, the test is always nice and yellow. We don't have coral or anything that eats nems, ours likes the fake rock over the love to hang out on, but preferred the higher water pull when the intake wasn't covered by the sponge, that's when he started moving. We did try a small shrimp in the tank but the nem ate it so we figured best to not try shrimp with it in a small tank. The new looks healthy just obese looking vs the skinny long tenticles. The local pet store fish guru I harass regularly, older gentleman, scuba diver, multiple beautiful tanks of his own he shared pictures with me of, said when I showed him pictures of my nem, that it was fine and healthy, all nems different just like people, and did recommend that in the near future I get a skimmer and UV light, I believe it was. I have air stones at either side of the tank. I wish I could get the pictures to upload so you all could see it. It doesn't look nasty and dreadful like its throwing in the towel (like it does every time it expels waste), it just looks the same as it did when we got it, but shorter fatter tenticles, like its fat and doesn't have to work for its food capture or maybe not the best light for it to reach towards? I think those two are probably the culprit. I'll start with cutting back feedings and try to get upgraded lighting as soon as possible. Oh and I know it doesn't host clowns. We weren't looking for that. Although we did get a clown, it is a snowflake clown and has chosen the fake rock as its house. Thank you for your thoughts!

 

[CMDemey]

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/h3chgcg6ymtmauz/AADJzKPANp37utErNVcZtlW4a?dl=0

Link to my drop box Tank folder. Not sure if others are able to view the photos there or not.

 

[Dkuhlmann]

NEVER and I mean NEVER use that PH buffer! IT's very bad news and will mess up many of your parameters. PH in saltwater aquariums isn't something you need to worry about. Now that you have an anemone and probably will get some corals you need to test for Mg/Ca/Kh. These are aka the Big Three. Very important if keeping anything other than just fish.

Pictures need to be under 1 mg to be able to upload them. You can also lose fish to that nem, they can and will eat small fish in addition to inverts as you've already found out.

 

[CMDemey]

I don't understand, the API saltwater master test kit tests for high range pH and it and the fish guy I mentioned earlier, said to keep it in 8.2 to 8.4 range. Ours had been a little low so we used API pH up but added it in small amounts to raise, in case any were sensitive to it. That was recent though, so the nem was already fat before using it. The dwarf coral beauty is sensitive to pH being low as well so I have to check and maintain a good pH for it. Also the 2 smallest fish are the clown and blue damsal and both have the mucus on their bodies that help the nem not to bother them, the six line wrassie and dwarf coral beauty stay on the other side of the tank on the live rocks, the nem likes the side by the intake and fake rock.

 

[vhuang168]

I will suggest, as many will, to read the stickies in the new to reefing section. Lots of info and a lot to read through but it will answer many of the questions and many you have not thought of and many you thought you know the answer to. Eg, chasing PH numbers.

I think to help you best, we need to step back and start with the basics.

What are the measurements from the API master kits?

The kit only measures PH, Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate. Those parameters are only really useful when 1st setting up a tank. After the nitrogen cycle is established, they are only checked occasionally.

If you are only going to have a fish only system, that maybe all you need. If you want corals, you will need to measure Alkalinity, Calcium at the minimum.

A way to measure salinity is also a must.

So what are you salinity, , Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate levels?

 

[CMDemey]

OK I will check those out. No plans for corals or carpet nems anytime soon. Maybe in a couple years after upgrading size tank for more room, better lighting, and a few other upgrades. This is a small set up for the time being. Fish, crab, nem, seastar, snails, live sand, live rock. That's it.

Fish guy at local pet store (not chain store bone heads) test my phosphates and metals. We have 0 metals and phosphates on point. So is everything else. Have not been chasing anything. Only had to up our pH slightly and only once. PH maintaining so far at 8.3, ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0. We do a water change every other weekend.

 

[Dkuhlmann]

I can't tell you the last time that I even bothered to check PH, it's totally a NON issue with saltwater. In Freshwater it's a different story. You need to learn to take what the LFS guy says with a grain of salt. He's there to make money ie the PH buffer and whatever else that he can get you to buy. We are only here to help you succeed with your tank, we have nothing to gain, but the LFS guy has profit to gain. Just like selling that Haitian anemone most people get anemones to be a host for their clown fish. That one has nothing to do with it and as it moves about your tank will kill anything that it touches.

 

[CMDemey]

I appreciate the advice. I sought out the Haitian nem though. I was not looking for one that would host, instead I was looking for the easiest to care for species that didn't require the upgraded lighting but would survive under the lower end of the salt tank LED lighting. This is a beginner learning tank for my 17 year old who is perusing a marine biology path. We are in the mountains of VA and the only ocean time she gets is scuba diving the keys every few years or swimming at Myrtle beach and visiting the aquarium every couple years. The chain shops, Petco, yes they know little and try to sell a lot, but I do my research first and have ordered direct ship, or through the locally owned pet store with someone who has their own salt tanks that I have harassed with more questions than stock I have purchased. He has actually advised me against some things I thought I needed and taken a dotty I ordered direct ship who did not make a good tankmate to my others. I'm still confused on why PH is not important when the "saltwater master kit" states it is and tests for it, and the write ups on the dwarf coral beauty say poor pH will cause it to suffer, as well as the saltwater aquarium book I purchase's before starting my tank advises to watch it and many web sites say pH is important to salt water reef set up, although a wider range is acceptable in a fish only salt tank. Confusing to hear that pH doesn't matter in a salt tank with so much saying it does. I am assuming it really just matters what inhabitants are in the salt tank as to weather or not the pH is actually import or not. That part makes sense.

 

[higgs83]

I can't tell you the last time that I even bothered to check PH, it's totally a NON issue with saltwater.

Besides being a ray of sunshine, your statement of ph being a "NON issue" is laughable...you even have a ph measurement on your signature. Ph is important to keep stable, however you can get that done. You can't shoot for stability without knowing where you're at.

OP, take a look at the stickies as mentioned. Nems will nem, happy or not, they'll move at detach, and just do their thing. Best we can do is provide a clean stable environment. Sticking to the basics (regular WCs, monitor/maintain acceptable salinity and temp) and watch how it reacts. Keeping a condy is a good cheap way to earn some experience. If you have a decent light then just let it be and don't make it exert more energy than it needs to processing massive amounts of food.

 

[CMDemey]

Thank you! I will. Things have gone extremely well to my surprise reading how hard a 29g would be to maintain, I have been ocd about everything because of all I read. I will check those out for sure. It seems very satisfied, I just wanted more opinions on the short fat tenticles being a bad sign or what I could do better. I am sure I over feeding the fat little critter and perhaps he is healthy just would prefer better lighting to stretch farther towards. I hope that's all. It looks and reacts well other than looking like a chub. I will read the stickys tonight. Thanks everyone. Was anyone able to see my photos in the drop box link I shared or is it restricted?

 

[Dkuhlmann]

Oh I see that I forgot to add the one most important piece to the puzzle of not having to worry about PH, if your Kh is in range then the PH will follow. Again no PH isn't an issue in saltwater tanks and something that many of us never ever check for. Mostly all that most people in the hobby check for is the Big Three Mg/Ca/Kh.

Your reason for getting one makes perfect sense. The problem with us sitting on a computer trying to help others in the hobby is that we don't know the background of you or your experience as well as what relationships you have or don't have with your LFS. For this reason we often ask many questions in trying to figure out what a particular problem actually is.

So Higgs, if you were so smart about saltwater tanks in general, you would have known that Kh relates to PH and testing for PH isn't necessary in saltwater tanks, as long as Kh is within specs. I simply forgot that one important part in my post above :hammer:

 

[CMDemey]

I appreciate the help and suggestions. I understand its difficult. The same reason IT people ask if the computer is plugged in for starters, lol. You aren't there from step 1. I get it. I tried to fill in the blanks as best I could. I'll try to shrink some pictures and get them posted. That probably would have expedited some clarification too.

 

[higgs83]

So Higgs, if you were so smart about saltwater tanks in general, you would have known that Kh relates to PH and testing for PH isn't necessary in saltwater tanks, as long as Kh is within specs. I simply forgot that one important part in my post above :hammer:

I'm not sure where you infer what I know from what I didn't say, but you obviously know enough to say 20+ things daily. Glad you're contributing your opinion so often.

OP, good luck and happy reefing.

 

[CMDemey]

managed to upload smaller photos

managed to upload smaller photos

I included one before shot, then 4 recent shots showing the tank and the nem with short fat tentacles.

 

[Dkuhlmann]

I'm not sure where you infer what I know from what I didn't say, but you obviously know enough to say 20+ things daily. Glad you're contributing your opinion so often.

OP, good luck and happy reefing.

My being on here almost 24/7 is because I've got a royally screwed up back and haven't worked since June of last year when I had surgery #1. They did a decompression and fusion of L4-L5. Well wouldn't you just know it that after only a few months that L5-S1 collapsed also so I'm going to have spine surgery #2 on March 31st. I am on huge amounts of narcotics for the extreme pain that I'm in and I can't hardly walk because of it.

I've got no life and nothing better to do than to be on here as it's something that I'm passionate about and I'm willing to do my best to help others.

My comment was because you had to give a comment that frankly neither needed to be said or if you had the experience that you are trying to come across as having you would have added to what I said instead.

 

[DanDashO]

I'm sure I'll be burned for this, but the only thing that regularly test for is phos. I didn't even own a test kit for years. The only reason I have one now is to keep things stable for clown breeding.

I'm not recommending no tests to a beginner, I just feel like we as hobbyists get so hung up on having the 'ideal' params and levels that we forget to just enjoy our tanks!
Just my .02 anyway..

OP, you also may have too low of flow for that animal. It would definitely like a gentle current bringing it fresh saltwater. I agree that it being fed too often, nems take hours, if not days, to digest their foods.

One more thing to remember, is that a lot of your rock isn't live yet, so the tank's biology is most likely not very stable yet. Try to avoid things like over feelings and large waterchanges to avoid any swings. Stability is the most important level in the ocean.

 

[CMDemey]

I figured that's why he started moving, it liked the flow by the intake, but I covered it so it wouldn't get sucked to it. Then he left the spot it had been in for a couple months and now moves about once a day. I hate to uncover the intake and have it sucked to it and die though. It already had shirt fat tenticles by then though. The rock was already cured and in the stores tank. A couple pieces have little feathered polyp type things on them and bristle worms. I assumed since they were already "live" since they were not the dry ones on the shelf to cure myself. No? Most places in the tank I see the nems tenticles sway back and forth gently but maybe its not enough. Are you able to see the photos, how can I increase flow, but in a small tank and on a budget?