Who has really colorful acros under leds?

Im having a hard time seeing that big tank only using 10-15 gallons of gas to heat it for a year; that's little more than a gallon per month? Not saying you aren't doing something else to make heat; but my heater light is on a good bit after my lights go out. My gundfos circulation pump uses about 75w; any chance your controller tells you how often that zone is on, or are you just using a straight up Ranco/SetPoint unit for that? I guess not all that 1500watts of heat isnt just getting blown off; maybe that's all that the system when the lights are on, but what else is heating the tank when they aren't?
 
I dint think the original intent of this thread was to debate the color difference between different types of lighing... I for one have no issues with getting good color with LED's. I think MH has better color and I also like LED/T5 combos, and MH/LED combos better that just straight LED's...But I get good color...

My tank has been 100% LED from the start. However, There are some issues I went though that people blamed on the LED's and some issues I did have with the LED's that when corrected made all the difference. First there is mention of pastel colors or faded colors and people blaming the LED's or the Optics... In the correct light levels the fading or pastel colors has more to do with nutrient deprivation than weather the light is LED or MH or T5.... One must take the nitrate level into account then comparing the lights on different tanks...

Second, anyone attempting LED lights without the help of a PAR meter is guessing at best... What too bright of light can destroy in two weeks can take 8 months to recover... But many will blame it on LED's because they did not have the problem with their T5 or MH's... So a quick goggle on how high a 250 watt radium bulb should be and everyone is growing coral.... Switch to LED's and you now have a 900 PAR on what was 500 PAR and the next thing you know you have a bunch of nice skeletons sitting on the shelf and all your coraline has turned white...

I love the color on some of my larger colonies (except my green birds nest which I placed way too high). But they took 8 months to recover from nutrient deprivation. Once I got my nitrates up everything started looking beter... I have a bunch of smaller frags that have not colored back up yet but are well on their way. Again, once I got my nitrates up to about 2ppm...


When I was cooking my tank and all my coraline turned white and my palys turned grey I borrowed a PAR meter.... 900 PAR.... I learned and adjusted my light and 8 months later everything is looking better. Nitrates came up and the color is great.... I am now switching to full spectrum and it is getting even better...

I love MH.... But I will be an LED guy for ever I think...
 
MHG the intent of the thread really was to see some beautiful acros under leds, but as said before, only few posted pics.
your answer that you are still getting collor in your corals seens to be the most common pattern, I don't known if it's really getting collor or we must believe it's getting collors, I just say this because if you ask me my acros are colloring up too, but it's been like this for months... so is it colloring up or I just want to believe to???
 
Im having a hard time seeing that big tank only using 10-15 gallons of gas to heat it for a year; that's little more than a gallon per month? Not saying you aren't doing something else to make heat; but my heater light is on a good bit after my lights go out. My gundfos circulation pump uses about 75w; any chance your controller tells you how often that zone is on, or are you just using a straight up Ranco/SetPoint unit for that? I guess not all that 1500watts of heat isnt just getting blown off; maybe that's all that the system when the lights are on, but what else is heating the tank when they aren't?

I am recirculating hot water form my hot-water tank. I control it with an apex that does provide a graph of on and off cycles including amperage. In Michigan Winter is about 5 - 6 Months. The costs were estimated and Id say that $30 was on the high side to power the pump. Honestly I am too lazy to calculate it.

For cooling I have three 4 inch fans computer fans blowing out of the back of the canopy and 4 $10 wall mart clip on fans cooling the surface of the water. I keep my house 74-76 in the summer and the tank with the fans will stay at 79-81 and some change. This would be impossible with MH and T5. In my old 180 with 6 bulb T5 I had to run a chiller and keep the house at 70 - 72. Thx.
 
I dint think the original intent of this thread was to debate the color difference between different types of lighing... I for one have no issues with getting good color with LED's. I think MH has better color and I also like LED/T5 combos, and MH/LED combos better that just straight LED's...But I get good color...

My tank has been 100% LED from the start. However, There are some issues I went though that people blamed on the LED's and some issues I did have with the LED's that when corrected made all the difference. First there is mention of pastel colors or faded colors and people blaming the LED's or the Optics... In the correct light levels the fading or pastel colors has more to do with nutrient deprivation than weather the light is LED or MH or T5.... One must take the nitrate level into account then comparing the lights on different tanks...

Second, anyone attempting LED lights without the help of a PAR meter is guessing at best... What too bright of light can destroy in two weeks can take 8 months to recover... But many will blame it on LED's because they did not have the problem with their T5 or MH's... So a quick goggle on how high a 250 watt radium bulb should be and everyone is growing coral.... Switch to LED's and you now have a 900 PAR on what was 500 PAR and the next thing you know you have a bunch of nice skeletons sitting on the shelf and all your coraline has turned white...

I love the color on some of my larger colonies (except my green birds nest which I placed way too high). But they took 8 months to recover from nutrient deprivation. Once I got my nitrates up everything started looking beter... I have a bunch of smaller frags that have not colored back up yet but are well on their way. Again, once I got my nitrates up to about 2ppm...


When I was cooking my tank and all my coraline turned white and my palys turned grey I borrowed a PAR meter.... 900 PAR.... I learned and adjusted my light and 8 months later everything is looking better. Nitrates came up and the color is great.... I am now switching to full spectrum and it is getting even better...

I love MH.... But I will be an LED guy for ever I think...


In my 90 grow out system I had the same issue with nutrition during the onset of biopellets and bright LED lights. I turned down the LEDS, added 12 chromis and increased the feeding especially oysterfeast and the problem was solved. In fact I am willing to bet that most of the SPS related issues are water quality and nutrition from my experience.
 
I bet there are 10 times as many tanks out there under T5 or MH that DONT have colorful acros than under LED. LED's have been proven to work. Nobody can argue that. If you do then you have some research to do. Also keep in mind that light is maybe 50% responsible for the colors you see. Water quality and your additives are just as important if not more. Some fixtures are just cool white and royal blue.

*Removed*~dc

What I am not claiming is that LED, MH or T5 is better than the next. That is strictly personal opinion. They all work. Each has its own pros and cons.

But for the sake of this thread LEDs do work and they work very well even with just two colors. The more spectrum the better so if you have the option we see better results with more spectrum.
 
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In my 90 grow out system I had the same issue with nutrition during the onset of biopellets and bright LED lights. I turned down the LEDS, added 12 chromis and increased the feeding especially oysterfeast and the problem was solved. In fact I am willing to bet that most of the SPS related issues are water quality and nutrition from my experience.

12 chromis...you aren't messin around!! I have LEDs and very little PE. I always have 0 nitrates and am wondering if my corals are lacking nutrition as well. Conversely I heard PE would be greater in a starving tank as the corals are reaching to grab any food they can.

You have a great tank going there!
 
sure your tank is amazing, but almost 5.000 people readed the thread and less then a handfull could show something...

Thanks but You are building the relationship between how many pictures have been posted as your sample size and how many people have view the thread as your population to build your Claim. It has been some time since I took a statistics class, however, the data collection needs to be controlled and the sample size needs to be at least 12 for a meaningful conclusion. Furthermore, your message is being lost with misspelled words.

Nothing against you but in the bigger picture of things I have been reading posts for the past year, since I went with led, and it is this bad apple that ruins it for others. Please keep an open mind, share your opinions. But if you’re going to make a “blanket statement type” claim please back it up with facts. If you can do this I will be the first to rip off my LEDS and go back to T5. However, I am enjoying the cost savings.

While we are on the subject of Statistics one interesting fact is that 75% of those that view my tank (In person) make some kind of change and Id say that 75% of those swap out their MH or T5 with LEDS which I have happily provided a free a tank par measurement to assist on sizing the amount of commodity fixtures. I even had some old timers out here last week that moved to kessils and are cycling out of those to go with commodity as the par and coverage is much better at half of the costs.
 
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12 chromis...you aren't messin around!! I have LEDs and very little PE. I always have 0 nitrates and am wondering if my corals are lacking nutrition as well. Conversely I heard PE would be greater in a starving tank as the corals are reaching to grab any food they can.

You have a great tank going there!

Thanks, PE takes energy, If your corals are starving they might be lacking energy to extend. Id +1 on nutrition issue. What are 0 nitrate. I see mine at .02 and fight to get them higher with a ton of input. As my export is very high.
 
Thanks but You are building the relationship between how many pictures have been posted as your sample size and how many people have view the thread as your population to build your Claim. It has been some time since I took a statistics class, however, the data collection needs to be controlled and the sample size needs to be at least 12 for a meaningful conclusion. Furthermore, your message is being lost with misspelled words.

Noting against you but in the bigger picture of things I have been reading posts for the past year, since I went with led, and it is this bad apple that ruins it for others. Please keep an open mind, share your opinions. But if you're going to make a "œblanket statement type" clam please back it up with facts. If you can do this I will be the first to rip off my LEDS and go back to T5. However, I am enjoying the cost savings.

While we are on the subject of Statistics one interesting fact is that 75% of those that view my tank (In person) make some kind of change and Id say that 75% of those swap out their MH or T5 with LEDS which I have happily provided a free a tank par measurement to assist on sizing the amount of commodity fixtures. I even had some old timers out here last week that moved to kessils and are cycling out of those to go with commodity as the par and coverage is much better and half of the costs.

sorry if you thought I was being agressive towards you, trully wasn't my intention, I admit my english is very bad, but I believe there's no point to bring this up since I'm from Brazil and have no obligation to master your language, if you write in portuguese better than me I'll let you say something.

Again I'm not getting into statistics just a simple thought that it's a lot of people and should be among this amount more than 3 people who have nice acros unde leds. nothing fancy
 
Just my .02 on pics...it's
Been stated by many that pics under led do not turn out well at all, even using high end equipment, so I can understand why you get few pics. I know with my t5 fixture, it looks good to me in person, but under pics it looks crazy blue...
I wouldn't post pics in a thread like this if I couldn't get the pictures to accurately represent what I see in my tank...
 
Does this mean that we need 12 guys who have had 75% of the people over to their home want to switch to LED before this can be true? ...or that we need 12 people to post pics of colorful SPS under LED? If 12 is the magic number in a basic regression, assuming that any kind of basic control is in place, how can anybody conclude that any of the 2-3 tanks in this post are not outliers that not within even two, or three, standard deviations?

...back to topic, where are the rest of the pictures of colorful SPS under LED? Can we get to 12 people if they are so abundant?

...sorry, I am just being argumentative and unhelpful like the rest of these posts. I would like to see more pics of colorful acros under LED, though.
 
Just my .02 on pics...it's
Been stated by many that pics under led do not turn out well at all, even using high end equipment, so I can understand why you get few pics. I know with my t5 fixture, it looks good to me in person, but under pics it looks crazy blue...
I wouldn't post pics in a thread like this if I couldn't get the pictures to accurately represent what I see in my tank...

thats a nice argument, pics under leds are horrible.
I believe theres another aspect should be considered, I don't known if I'll say this right but please make an effort to understand, leds can create a false color, in ex. while they are on they reflect on coral in a way that makes look more colorful than it really is, I've seen coral cultivated under mh and t5 that when you take out of water are truly colorful and led corals that in tank had color and when took out of the led light looked faded
 
This is true under any high K lights unless you have good equipment - most entry and mid level cameras fail at higher K but are good near sunlight. I can take pics under any type of lighting that are accurate without even having to touch them up, but I also don't expect that everybody is tricking around with a 5D and a handful of L series macro and other lenses. If anybody has any that they want to share in my area, I would be happy to come by and get some pics for you.
 
TDB, your tank is absolutely breathtaking! Do you have a build thread anywhere? I'd be curious to read a bit more about the other equipment you use, husbandry, where you keep your water chemistry, etc.

As for the topic at hand, my tank is only a couple months old, so I don't have anything in the way of SPS, but I am planning to in the near future after I finish getting everything dialed in and stable, and once my refugium is up and running (waiting Dow 795 to cure now, should be another week or two).

On my tank, I'm running buildmyled.com LED strips as what amounts to a "mid-day" lighting source. They are 48", 76W strips using Phillips LEDs, each strip having twenty four 6500k whites, four 400nm UVs, sixteen 450nm royal blues, eight 470nm blues, four 525 greens, and four 660 deep reds. They are extremely bright, and have an appearance similar to a "10k" MH bulb. I have also added a 4x54W ATI Sunpower fixture, as after some reading I am of the opinion that LED + T5 is the best combination for me personally. I get the very full spectrum (including lots of light throughout the 410-440 range, where my LEDs were a bit underpowered), very wide spread, and a better dawn/dusk effect.

I tend to think that some of the issues people have with LEDs are tied to a relatively small amount of light in the violet to indigo range, as there are just not that many LED chips that pack much punch in those wavelengths. I think another issue is that LED light is very direct and focussed compared to T5, or even MH. It seems that light does not enter the tank at quite as many different angles, which I think tends to lead to some parts of a given coral receiving dramatically more light than others over the course of the day. Some light will always be reflected from sand, glass, and rock, but I don't think the light hitting many colonies is as evenly distributed with LEDs, especially with the relatively small number many people run over their tanks.

A lot of people buy a small number of very intense (and very expensive) LED fixtures, because they "look" bright enough, and often can't be run at 100% for more than a couple hours without toasting a lot of corals. My thinking is that TBD's approach results in much more even distribution of light, so that more parts of his colonies are getting the right amount of light, which leads to more consistent and intense pigmentation.
 
Does this mean that we need 12 guys who have had 75% of the people over to their home want to switch to LED before this can be true? ...or that we need 12 people to post pics of colorful SPS under LED? If 12 is the magic number in a basic regression, assuming that any kind of basic control is in place, how can anybody conclude that any of the 2-3 tanks in this post are not outliers that not within even two, or three, standard deviations?

...back to topic, where are the rest of the pictures of colorful SPS under LED? Can we get to 12 people if they are so abundant?



...sorry, I am just being argumentative and unhelpful like the rest of these posts. I would like to see more pics of colorful acros under LED, though.

No I was talking about making claims from statistics. I think it would be difficult to have a controlled data collection from a BB.

Agreed getting back on post and posting colorful corals under leds. Ill post one more pic before I unsubscribe. Not quite 12 people but I think it builds the claim of having colorful Acros under LEDS.

rd2013.JPG




I have a build thread on R 2 R for those interested. Thanks for sharing your opinions.
 
my cree retrofit leds produce good sps color (red planet, pink lem, purple digi, tri-color,wild blue/green acro, oregon tort,yr cauliflower,orenji,mystic sunset and others)
all of these show very "normal" coloration, except the oregon tort. the tort has greenish base color. (not at all like the mh tank i got it from). i can live with that.
here is the kicker- the pics under led stink! i need a very high end camera to get decent ones, and i'm not going to buy one just for that.
my wife has a cannon DSLR and it doesn't get good pics, either.
 
Hi TDB,

Hope all is well!

First, your tank is amazing! Your tank is a true inspiration to us all :) I know its off topic, but would mind telling us what you fed your yellow tang to get it to morph into that lovely shade of orange?

Thanks,
James
 
Hi TDB,

Hope all is well!

First, your tank is amazing! Your tank is a true inspiration to us all :) I know its off topic, but would mind telling us what you fed your yellow tang to get it to morph into that lovely shade of orange?

Thanks,
James

OP sorry to do this but this guy is like a flea(bag) that I cannot shake off.

Hi James,

Thank for the warm greetings. It is a much different tonality from the smack you talk behind my back to local reefers. In any event - You want to know why my Yellow tang has an orange hue? Ill answer that by posting one of your pictures from captive reefs which somehow you turned a fluorescent yellow glow stick into a golden/orange crown. Using your own photo in Image 1 you can see that your WB is all messed up which distorts your yellow. As others have mentioned it is near impossible to take good photos under leds. While my colors are not perfect they certainly look better than the “golden crown”.

Image 1

gold.jpg


I would invite you over to see the "orange tang" in person but many of the reefers locally including myself don’t like you and you’re not welcome. If anything else needs to be said I’d advise you to go ahead PM or better yet say your wise comments in person but please don’t turn this meaningful thread into a circus.

Warmer Regards,
Tommy
 
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