Why are all my critters dying off?

[wyrmslayer121]

Hi guys, I need some help.

For about the past year, all of my corals and fish have started dying off. I'm now left with 2 clowns, 1 angel, 1 rose bubble tip anemone and lots of algae. I've done all the testing I can think of, and all my parameters look good. The tank has been established and functional for 10+ years, started by my wife.

Obviously something is amiss. Here's a picture of the anemone 1.5 years ago:http://imgur.com/kWlRPYe
Here's one from today: http://imgur.com/hQUPi7j

Habits:
5 gal water change weekly,
10 gal water change 1/mo
Hang on the back filter change 1/mo
Skimmer drained 1/mo

Hardware
Tank: 36gal bow front
~80lbs of rock
Skimmer-AquaC Remora rated at 75gal (reused from our previous tank, 75gal, downgraded when we moved apartments 3 years ago)
Marineland Carbon Hang-on-the-back filter
1 fan-Koralia 4
Lights-Marineland Reef Capable LED - 3' long
Water- made using an RODI unit that fills up 5gal blue water containers (like those for office water fountains). Water purity is checked and maintains a constant contamination of 2ppm or less.

Test results:
PH - http://imgur.com/Vj9GpPH
Nitrite - http://imgur.com/hRD0byy
Ammonia - http://imgur.com/oQVnvxQ
Nitrate - http://imgur.com/6JmPGUS
Calcium - Lost the pic ~ 450
Salinity - Checked using an optical doodad - 1.024

Tank picture:
http://imgur.com/5b1ehJn

Taken before a water change (done Sunday afternoons, picture exposure set at -2 to reduce glare)

Any help or direction would be appreciated. It's very hard to see all this time and money go down the drain.

 

[fishchef]

What are your parameters? dKH, Mg, PO4

 

[heathlindner25]

off the top of my head I'm thinking at your light

 

[lmforbis]

I'd agree. The marineland reef capable led lights aren't really reef capable. No way they can keep an anemone alive, yours looks like it's light starved. I have one of those lights I occasionally use on my QT but it isn't good for anything else. Mostly it sits in my closet.

 

[wyrmslayer121]

@Fishchef - I do not know. I don't have the test equipment for those. I'm traveling for business this week, but I'll stop and pick them up this weekend and I'll let you know.

@Heathlinder25 - I've had LED's for 4+ years. Not the exact same light bar, but the same brand and same model. I have had the power supplies burn out and Marineland will just replace the entire system if it's under warranty. I have made sure that the model they replaced it with was the same as the previous system. I have not had reef problems until the recent year/year and a half. The first picture of the anemone was taken under the same model light bar that I currently have, in a 75g tank. The anemone is also higher in the current tank than he's ever been before, leading me to believe that you would be right: not enough light. But, if the light is supposed to have a 10+ year life span, do the led's decay like regular actinic lights? And aside from lack of quality, why would they decay in 2 years?

@Imforbis - since I'm having such a hard time growing anything, I'm willing to believe that the lights are no longer giving off any useful light. You said that their lights aren't really reef capable, if this is the case, and I'd like to replace my lights, what kind of information will a different light manufacturer provide that proves they are 'better' than Marineland?

As a test, let's say I put the anemone's rock closer to the bottom of the tank. With him being as sick as he is, will he still try to climb up to get more light, or would he just throw the white flag and kick the bucket?

Thanks everyone for the responses. I've been scratching my head while my investment and toy dies. I miss all the colors of the reefs.

 

[fishchef]

Since your system is 10 years running, what lighting did you have prior to the last 4 years? Get a Checker for the PO4.

 

[CStrickland]

You might have a few different things going on, which is annoying to fix. A few things I noticed
1) like they said, the lights aren't strong (but that won't kill fish). You can get a new marsaqua 165 for $90 that'll be a huge improvement, but your corners will be a little dim in a bowfront. If you upgrade the lights go really slowly to acclimate the critters. Even in the right direction, fast changes can be rough.
2) it's a lot better to keep the rodi at zero tds. Those 2ppm can be anything, and bad stuff can accumulate over time from evaporation so only a little bit does add up.
3) that's a LOT of rock. While your powerhead is strong, it can't reach behind. I would think it's pretty gross back there.
4) hob filters need cleaning more than once a month. If your skimmer cup is taking that long to fill your waters either super clean or you could run a little wetter / tune it up.
5) those API nitrate tests are hard to do properly, and if they are done wrong they say you don't have nitrates. Maybe get a second opinion from a fish shop. Also, check expiry dates on all tests if they've been around a while.

For some old tanks, things just go down hill. I don't think anybody really knows why: the rocks soak up phosphates, contaminants in the water accumulate, waste and organics that we don't really have tests for accumulate, etc. Some tanks really benefit from a spring cleaning, or typhoon. You have to be careful about stirring up too much settled detritus, or shocking your critters some other way though. A huge water change, like 90%; a deep clean with a diatom filter; reaquascaping and blowing crap from behind the rocks; replacing the sand bed; or some combo; all have turned tanks around. There's a few threads on OTS or Old Tank Syndrome, but it's a problem most of us won't be able to keep our tanks up long enough to have to deal with. You can call it a badge of honor

Good luck!

 

[fishchef]

You might have a few different things going on, which is annoying to fix. A few things I noticed
1) like they said, the lights aren't strong (but that won't kill fish). You can get a new marsaqua 165 for $90 that'll be a huge improvement, but your corners will be a little dim in a bowfront. If you upgrade the lights go really slowly to acclimate the critters. Even in the right direction, fast changes can be rough.
2) it's a lot better to keep the rodi at zero tds. Those 2ppm can be anything, and bad stuff can accumulate over time from evaporation so only a little bit does add up.
3) that's a LOT of rock. While your powerhead is strong, it can't reach behind. I would think it's pretty gross back there.
4) hob filters need cleaning more than once a month. If your skimmer cup is taking that long to fill your waters either super clean or you could run a little wetter / tune it up.
5) those API nitrate tests are hard to do properly, and if they are done wrong they say you don't have nitrates. Maybe get a second opinion from a fish shop. Also, check expiry dates on all tests if they've been around a while.

For some old tanks, things just go down hill. I don't think anybody really knows why: the rocks soak up phosphates, contaminants in the water accumulate, waste and organics that we don't really have tests for accumulate, etc. Some tanks really benefit from a spring cleaning, or typhoon. You have to be careful about stirring up too much settled detritus, or shocking your critters some other way though. A huge water change, like 90%; a deep clean with a diatom filter; reaquascaping and blowing crap from behind the rocks; replacing the sand bed; or some combo; all have turned tanks around. There's a few threads on OTS or Old Tank Syndrome, but it's a problem most of us won't be able to keep our tanks up long enough to have to deal with. You can call it a badge of honor

Good luck!

Yes, Our system was about 10 years old and OTS is a reality. Just decided to break it all down and get out of the Hobby. You probably will need to do what is suggested in this post. OTS is something most don't realize.

 

[wyrmslayer121]

@CStrickland

1) Marsaqua 165: Do you think I'll need 1 set or 2?
2) RODI@ <2ppm: I'll work on cleaning out the containers. Original TDS was 0, so the 2ppm has gathered over time.
3) Lots of rock and ickness: The Powerhead is strong enough that we have it blowing horizontally with a slight decline (back of tank to the front). It took some time to a adjust the fan to a spot where it wasn't turning the tank into a hurricane and blocking the pump for the HOB. We only have 1 fan, it came from out 75gal previous tank where we had 2. Is the fan too strong?
4) HOB filter and Skimmer cup: Googling "run a little wetter" returns some interesting and unrelated information. Could you elaborate please?
5) API Tests: New kit, expirations are good. Ran the test two weekends in a row with the same results. I am not a chemistry major so it is a very good possibility that I messed up. I'll get a water sample tested.

OTS: We downgraded from a 75 gal last November. All rock was cleaned with a brush inside the old water after we removed the corals and fish. At the time of the downgrade, we replaced the sand and only used 10 gal of water from the old tank. Prior to this, corals were already starting to look sick and die off. If a tank gets OTS, does everything get thrown out and start from scratch?

Thanks for the info, this is very helpful and better quality that I've been able to get by doing research by myself.

 

[CStrickland]

I'm not sure the dimensions of your tank, but a 165w is good light for a 2 foot cube, so whether you need a second will depend on whether your edges stick out much further. Some people are satisfied putting low light coral at the margins, some don't like how it looks to have one bright light in the middle of the tank. There's a big thread in the lighting subforum all about the marsaquas that has great info and reviews.

The issue with a single strong powerhead is whether it is reaching the whole tank. Many people have better luck with a few weaker ones because you can control dead spots better. I happen to really like the SunSun brand that you can buy on Amazon or eBay for like $10 each. They don't last forever but at that price you can play around with diff flow patterns to prevent dead spots behind the rocks and in nooks, as food and poop settling there will compost into fertilizer for algae and the free phosphate they release can inhibit coral growth.

Whether you "skim wet" is just another word for how much water is in the scum the skimmer is collecting. I set my skimmer water level to produce something that looks like tea. If everything is happy, I make strong tea (darker), if things aren't going so well I raise the water level in my skimmer to make weak tea (paler skimmate, with more water in it). It's a matter of taking more stuff out of the tank, and hoping that your removing whatev is bugging the critters. All skimmers are diff, but when I make weak tea I get almost 8 oz (one cup) every day in my 55g.

When you get a second opinion, ask for results for: ammonia, nitrate, phosphate, alkalinity, calcium, and magnesium. And let us know what brand of test they use (some can read lower than others so zero isn't always zero).