Zeolites

[reefgeezer]

Update

Update

I stopped adding MB7 7 days ago. I also took the Zeovit stones out of the reactor and placed them in a filter bag. They are now placed in the sump so water flows through them, but not as actively as in the reactor. Did the same for the GAC. I have also increased the carbon source from 1 ml to 3.5 ml per day.

I'm rinsing both the Zeovit and the GAC in the sump daily. That process clouds the water for an hour or so. The LPS corals, zoas, mushrooms, etc are larger than ever. The SPS corals remain unchanged. The water is also extremely clear.

I still can't detect phosphates with a Salifert kit and nitrates remain unchanged @ around 10 ppm. I'm still in the increasing phase of the carbon dosing process. I haven't seen a great increase in skimmer output yet so I'm attributing the clear water to bacteria colonizing the GAC and Zeovit. I think the better looking LPS and other corals are due to the mulm that is added to the water when the substrates are rinsed.

I had some cyano issues when dosing the MB7. The cyano has disappeared since stopping it. A few spots of GHA had also popped up but have stopped growing and are beginning to disappear. I think maybe I misused the MB7, so I don't want to slam the product, it just didn't work for me.

More later...

 

[henrystyle]

Im interested in running zeolite just for the coral feeding. I currently run purigen, pure power phosphate remover and I have a refugium on my 120g sps tank. Bio load on the tank i very high.
Good idea?

 

[bertoni]

I don't see any reason to believe that the zeolites are going to help any more than any other similar type of media or live rock. They might allow more surface area per unit volume than live rock, but so do many other artificial media.

 

[Bugger]

So we could theorecticly just shake our canister filters everyday add some of there products and come away with the same sytem benefits as zeolite and zeovit. I like the idea that the zeolites remove ammonia even if it only removes it once. Is ammonia worth testing (I dont anybody that does test for it). How long does it take bateria to convert it to nitrite and then nitrate. I think ammonia is always persent at some level in every reef tank. If the Zeolites work then they would safe-gard the system from it every six-weeks which is interesting.

 

[bertoni]

Zeolites can't adsorb ammonia in saltwater because of the high ionic content.

I agree that there will be some ammonia present in the water column. I don't know what the level might be in our tanks. We generally don't have test equipment precise or accurate enough for measuring such levels. I don't know what the various throughput rates for converting ammonia to nitrate might be, but it seems fast enough that a high ammonia level is only a concern when something drastic has happened to the tank.

 

[Bugger]

by Randy Holmes FWIW, IMO it is not in doubt that some zeolites can bind ammonia. Tim Hovanec discusses it here:

So why do you think it cant do it in salt water?

 

[bertoni]

The zeolites work by binding ions, specifically, cations when the target is ammonia. The problem is that seawater has so many ions that the odds of ammonia being adsorbed are rather small. This thread has some details:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=133912

 

[Bugger]

by habibI did a few quick experiments with a zeolite , if I assume that the information from the supplier is correct and is actually zeolite and not something else.

The amount used was approx. 10 gram of zeolite per 100 milliliter of water so that would equate to approx. 2 pounds (1 kilo) per 2.5 gallons (10 liter).

It lowered the ammonia concentration in both tapwater and seawater.

The effect in seawater was much lower but still significant.

For both seawater and freshwater the time to see the effects was many hours.

I also measured nitrite and nitrate and it can be excluded that the decrease in ammonia was caused by transformation to nitrite or nitrate.

I can't exclude that the observed decrease in ammonia was due to incorporation into bateria because neither the waters nor the zeolite and containers were sterile and also not the set up.

However, the samples using zeolite were compared with controls.


Since they were just quick experiments I would not feel comfortable to give the amounts of ammonia removed.

 

[bertoni]

That's a kilo (2.2 pounds) for every 2.5 lbs of water. It's not going to be practical to have that kind of ratio in a real system. Also, the absorption rate is very slow, and bacteria are likely to consume it first in a real system.

 

[Bugger]

Yeah but he dident mention how much ammonia he used. he could of used tons of it. And he mentioned that bacteria dident convert it to Nitrate

 

[bertoni]

His results are relevant if you're trying to reduce the ammonia in a test tube. His point was that zeolites might (or might not) enable enhanced ammonia processing in a tank. Either way, ammonia processing is not an important issue in a running system. It's not clear what you think you can accomplish with zeolites in a real system. I think you should read more of the thread.