Zoa / Paly studies

[zoafarm]

I've been following threads and doing research on zoas/palys for the better part of a year. I also have multiple types in my tanks. From what I've read, many things effect growth rates...flow, lighting, nutrients, salinity, ect... It's also appears that certain zoas/palys like more or less of any of the above conditions. My question is:

Has anyone actually studied any of these factors as they apply to specific zoas or palys. For example, are Rastas different from say Captain Americas in any factors? Or are they all the same, and given the same ideal conditions the growth rates are identical or very close?

If anyone has studied this, I would very much like to learn. Thanks for your help!

 

[K-ROK]

I've been following threads and doing research on zoas/palys for the better part of a year. I also have multiple types in my tanks. From what I've read, many things effect growth rates...flow, lighting, nutrients, salinity, ect... It's also appears that certain zoas/palys like more or less of any of the above conditions. My question is:

Has anyone actually studied any of these factors as they apply to specific zoas or palys. For example, are Rastas different from say Captain Americas in any factors? Or are they all the same, and given the same ideal conditions the growth rates are identical or very close?

If anyone has studied this, I would very much like to learn. Thanks for your help!

I read somewhere that Zoas grow faster when they are not surrounded by polyps. For example...a frag on a plug will only produce new polyps on the outer edge, but a frag that has space in the middle areas will produce there as well - basically giving you twice as many polyps in the same time period.

 

[A. Grandis]

I've been following threads and doing research on zoas/palys for the better part of a year. I also have multiple types in my tanks. From what I've read, many things effect growth rates...flow, lighting, nutrients, salinity, ect... It's also appears that certain zoas/palys like more or less of any of the above conditions. My question is:

Has anyone actually studied any of these factors as they apply to specific zoas or palys. For example, are Rastas different from say Captain Americas in any factors? Or are they all the same, and given the same ideal conditions the growth rates are identical or very close?

If anyone has studied this, I would very much like to learn. Thanks for your help!

No, no scientific studies about the different influences on specific species of zoanthids' growth/ reproduction in closed systems. Not that I know of.

Grandis.

 

[zoafarm]

K-ROK -- Thanks, but was not really looking for information on overall zoa growth rate methods, but more specific towards individual types.

Grandis -- Ok...so no scientific studies. Do you know of any hobbist that might have studied these effects in their aquariums.

 

[A. Grandis]

If not scientific, what type of studies you're talking about?
People can say what they want online and many others will agree or not.
Even books have some info that many can say they are old and not applicable anymore.
Some things can work for some people but not necessarily work for others and every system is different anyway.
Some books even have their scientific references to try to prove their thoughts around subjects that aren't totally true for all closed system.
That is how the forums work. If not scientific people will discuss and doubt more than if is.
The bottom line is to have fun and know that this is just a hobby and do your best for the zoas.
It's very important to have your own experiences and to share with others to try improve constantly.

Grandis.

 

[zoafarm]

Agreed...and fun is definity the name of the game or just get out of the hobby. Too expensive not to enjoy. I guess my curiousity got the better of me one day. I was thinking zoas and palys are found at different levels with different light within the ocean, and wondered if any grew in one particular area or zone as it relates to a specific zoa/paly. For instead, do some zoas respond better to blue light spectrums because of their natural depth in the ocean, and if so, what zoas/palys fall in that particular zone.

 

[Smnparish]

I have seen "deepwater" zoas/palys for sale before, so those would probably be the ones from lower light.

However, each tank is different in which zoas respond best to it...one zoa will grow fast in one tank, but in the other that same zoa may not grow at all.

General rule is if it is expensive, it is a slow grower lol

 

[A. Grandis]

I could try to answer that...
They are found in many different environments and depths.
Some times you can find the very same species of zoanthids on rocks exposed to air during low tides, to depths of 30+ feet down.
Light spectrum is very different in those environments!
Same works with water flow and even dissolved nutrients, what people like to call "dirty water". But "dirty water" does not work well in closed systems.
Same for the water flow. You can find the very same species of zoa with very light to no water flow, and around very strong wave action.

That's the reason why many different types of set up can support corals, zoanthids, and so on...

Not all the zoa species can be that flexible though and that's when experiences come in.

To find the common denominator for the zoas you've got is the challenge and what makes it fun.

Grandis.

 

[KafudaFish]

I have seen "deepwater" zoas/palys for sale before, so those would probably be the ones from lower light.

However, each tank is different in which zoas respond best to it...one zoa will grow fast in one tank, but in the other that same zoa may not grow at all.

General rule is if it is expensive, it is a slow grower lol

Deepwater is a marketing term to make those color morphs seem rare/harder to obtain therefore their prices are higher.

However Japanese deepwater zoas are rare because they do not exist.


This may have changed in the last year(s) so I may be wrong but when the deepwater craze hit this was the case.

 

[zoafarm]

Smnparish - I've read the same thing, and everone's tank is different...so everyone should get different results. And I've heard that general rule , but let's take Purple Hornets for example...some people say they are hard to grow and have slow growth; whereas, in someone else's tank they may explode with growth.

So assuming I was strictly focused on Purple Hornets, what conditions make that particular zoa thrive. And are those conditions perfect for any other zoa or group of zoas, and not perfect for some other type?

 

[zoafarm]

Grandis - Thank you...that's a good start. So the same zoa shows up in different conditions. So maybe, adaption plays a big role and given time in any location with the same condition over time the growth rate would improve.

 

[A. Grandis]

Deepwater is a marketing term to make those color morphs seem rare/harder to obtain therefore their prices are higher.

However Japanese deepwater zoas are rare because they do not exist.


This may have changed in the last year(s) so I may be wrong but when the deepwater craze hit this was the case.

:thumbsup:

Well said!
There are deep water zoanthids in Japan indeed, but they don't belong to the current market for sure! To define deep water is another thing.
Those colorful zoas just have the "Japanese look" they invented and therefore are cartoon named as "deepwater Japanese zoas". Everything they call "deep water" means more money!!!! Because it should be harder to find/collect.

That's a good observation, that could be well related to his question.

Grandis.

 

[A. Grandis]

Grandis - Thank you...that's a good start. So the same zoa shows up in different conditions. So maybe, adaption plays a big role and given time in any location with the same condition over time the growth rate would improve.

My last post was to show you the possibilities in the wild and to give you a wider view of possibilities in closed systems. Not all the zoa species are found in different environments as I've suggested before, and therefore the experiences with them in aquariums would bring the truth to what would be the best case scenario in regards to growth/reproduction rates.

I would say adaptation is just the beginning to be able to support them in an artificial environment, in our closed systems, and to be able to do changes in stablished systems. The reproduction/ growth rates are not necessarily and/or directly related to the adaptation period. A well stablished daughter colony in system "A" could have much lower reproduction/growth rate than another well stablished daughter colony from the same mother colony in system "B".

In other words, the variables are so many that we can't just set a pattern or a definitive rule. It that would be easy many people would be rich! :bum:

Grandis.

 

[zoafarm]

"Deepwater" or some "CrazyName" may equate to money in the marketplace. But bottom line...they are only worth what someone is willing to pay, and my threshold is VERY low. I have lots of "CrazyName" stuff, and must make the marketplace mad because I give it away for almost nothing. So when I use names, I'm only giving a reference point to work from.

 

[zoafarm]

Thanks for the feedback Grandis. Much appreciated!

 

[A. Grandis]

"Deepwater" or some "CrazyName" may equate to money in the marketplace. But bottom line...they are only worth what someone is willing to pay, and my threshold is VERY low. I have lots of "CrazyName" stuff, and must make the marketplace mad because I give it away for almost nothing. So when I use names, I'm only giving a reference point to work from.

The point here isn't about how people are using those cartoon names, but how and with what intention those names were generated in the first place. Specifically talking about the "Japanese deep water" zoas.

I don't think KafudaFish was judging you in any way. I'm sure he will post if I'm wrong.

Grandis.

 

[A. Grandis]

Thanks for the feedback Grandis. Much appreciated!

You're very welcome!

If you add more of your thoughts perhaps others will post more info to enrich the thread.

Do you actually have a zoa farm, or that's just a name?

Grandis.

 

[Smnparish]

So it looks like you're gonna have to be the one to study this topic then lol....I'll buy the book if you ever come up with anything solid!

 

[A. Grandis]

So it looks like you're gonna have to be the one to study this topic then lol....I'll buy the book if you ever come up with anything solid!

LOL!!! :reading: :hmm4:

Grandis.

 

[zoafarm]

I have about 40 or 50 something different types in my tank. When I first started in the hobby, zoas/palys really caught my attention. I have since started moving more towards SPS, but I still maintain interested in zoas/palys. I'm currently setting up a frag system which will solely be used for zoas, and have been doing a lot of searching for even more information to make the system even more productive than my DT.

I've been very fortunate to be able to acquire some great zoas/paly at little to no cost. My real goal is to share the experience with those new to the hobby. So farming...yes...profit...no. Most, not all, stuff I share pretty freely to help others start up, and grow for me in case I have a system crash (cross my fingers it doesn't happen). If it does, hopefully some of those people will share it back.