180 gal apartment/condo inwall tank

mazda2002

New member
Hello,
my name is Marc, I will start by talking about my SW experiences. My first experience was a desaster for a few reasons. I used tap water, didnt have a skimmer, too little rock, bad measuring equipment and too many fish. I expected it to be as easy as freshwater...

My second experience was a nano reef. It went well for 8 months with little to no mortalities, had no skimmer and relied on weekly water changes and some liverock for filtration. As a result of me skipping a few water changes and a coral eating worm, I lost some corals. After some equipment failures, I decided to go with a FO aquarium for a while. Ive now had my 77G FO aquarium for about a year. Its time to go bigger and back to reef!

Biggest lessons learned:

- Automade what you can, carrying buckets is a PITA and ruins hard wood floors.
- Skimming makes your life much easiers
- Live rock is a must, but hitchhikers must not be let in the tank.

I will be talking alot about budgetting, my main concern about building this tank is being able to afford it. (I wont be adding this one to a credit card)

Originally, I wanted a 300g+ system thinking that I would run out of space too soon, but after a few calculations, I decided to limit my aquarium size to a 72x24x24.

My budget:

I have 600$ in my bank account and am expecting to spend approx. 100$/week over a period of 9 to 11 months. I am also anticipating approximatly 40$/month on electricity and 25$/month on water changes once the system is running.

The plan in one paragraph.

Make a base, buy an aquarium, use my 77G as a sump/refuge. I'll add some rock, a DIY skimmer or two, pumps and piping. Then all I have to do is make a hole in a load bearing wall and install my aquarium in it.

Heres the first drawing:

condo1.bmp


It will be flush with the wall in the living room and protruding 19inches in my office.

Its getting late, Ill write more on this tomorrow. Peace.
 
Then all I have to do is make a hole in a load bearing wall and install my aquarium in it.

You make it sound so easy lol.

The budget might get blown on the hole.

Might also pay to check about any building by-laws with regards tank size.
 
Im trying to get my hands on the plans of the building, but from what a co-owners has told me it shouldent be ''too'' bad. It's a wall with 2''x4'' every 12 inches. Basically, i would make an opening the same way I would make a window opening.

I estimate the set-up at around 2000-2500 pounds, thats like having 5 people stand on each side of the wall. (or at least thats how im gonna try and sell it to the administrative council)

I pulled out my co-ownership decleration to look at the rules. There is nothing regarding aquariums, but it is stated that I cannot have any animal thats not a cat or dog and that I can not have more than two animals. It also says that any animal that is considered a newsance by the administrative council has to go.

One other problem regarding the co-ownership declaration; the drywall is common ground and there for, I must have permission from the administrative council just to take down some dry wall. Ill have to run everything I do threw the administrative council.

Since this is a new co-ownership, the same person owns more than half the condos. I hope my project isnt gonna stop before it starts.

Thank you Waynem, I will defenetly need to pay more attention to how I deal with the legal aspect of this build.
 
Heres my shopping list, im still missing a good way to make water changes automatic and a way to controll ph automatically:
(Am I missing anything else?)

My estimates are in canadian dollars and from mail order sites.

Ro/Di unit-------------------300$
Base Rock------------------500$
Aquarium-------------------1000$
Live rock--------------------300$
DIY aquarium stand------200$
DIY hole in wall------------200$
Pumps-----------------------800$
Sand-------------------------470$
Lighting---------------------1125$
Initial salt-------------------100$
DIY skimmers---------------600$

I already have a decent collection of test kits for the basic stuff as well as a tunze auto top-off, water healers and 60ish pounds of live rock.

Thats a gran total of over 5500$ and would take me over 12 months with my budget, but im hoping to find some deals and some second hand stuff to help me out.
 
Just a quick skim on your projected expenses, looks like you could cut down in a few area's. The hole in the wall should be near free unless you need some tools. I just purchased 100 lbs of dry marco rock for $322. I'll pick up another 10lbs or s to help seed it. Right there you should be able to shave off at least $500.

Any reason why you're going with a DIY skimmer? $600 will get you a pretty nice used skimmer on here.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14421626#post14421626 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by 2004jetta
Just a quick skim on your projected expenses, looks like you could cut down in a few area's. The hole in the wall should be near free unless you need some tools. I just purchased 100 lbs of dry marco rock for $322. I'll pick up another 10lbs or s to help seed it. Right there you should be able to shave off at least $500.

Any reason why you're going with a DIY skimmer? $600 will get you a pretty nice used skimmer on here.

I came up with that number with the fallowing math, but if its less than that, I wont complain :)

150 lbs = 405$ *1.2(to turn to canadian funds) + shipping

as for the choice of the skimmer (like anyhing else on this project) can be changed.

I was thinking of making a skimmer with a 5 gal. water jug and s sedra 5000 Needle Wheel pump.

links to the pump and DIY:

http://www.aquacave.com/detail.aspx?ID=1395#Reviews

http://diyproteinskimmer.blogspot.com/

ASM rates a similar sized skimmer (using the same pump) for a 350g tank.

heres a link to a ASM skimmer: http://www.fishtanksdirect.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=553

I will defenetly want a lot of fish. The idea is to create 2 or 3 skimmers and I will turn them off one by one if there isnt enough organic material in the tank for the 3 skimmers.

Basically, it looks like the best bang for the buck, but if I find a better deal, id be all over it.
 
I started drawing the stand. I based the design this web site.

http://www.idahoreefs.org/Tank/BuildLargeStand_2.asp

Then changed it slightly to fit my 77g and now I gnow im going to have a serious space issue.

The tank is already drilled in the bottom, so I plan on plumbing it to an external pump.

IDK were im going to put the skimmer tho. (not to mention reactors and stuff)

STANDANDSUMP.bmp


a layer of 3/4 inch plywood will cover the unit. On to of that a decorative covor.
 
Wow. That's going to be a nice tank. I hope you live on the first floor though because I'd be leary of having such a big tank on the second floor up. I bought separate insurance when I had a 100 gal at my complex because I didn't want a lawsuit on me if the tank leaked and caused water damage on the floors below.
 
mazda2002, Looks like a good project.

I have some questions on your budget. What you have so far might not be too far out of line, but I don’t see anything for Controls or electrical, what about saltwater mixing? What are the plans for water top off?

The hole in the wall might cost you a lot more depending on the rules that you must fallow and permits.

What is your electric rate/KWH $40 might not cover it depending what you install. Does it get hot up there in the summer time? What do you keep your house at for a temp in the winter? (heating/cooling the tank)

Stick to buying good used stuff will help and save you a bunch.

The 180 tank is pretty common and you should be able to find one for $300 - $400. I don’t know your local market though.

Do you have other space for water storage and salt mixing?

I would look at trying to make the front of the stand more open so that you can get the sump in and out without having to remove the tank. You will thank yourself for this when something needs to be changed or repaired and you don’t have to take the whole system apart to fix it.

Skimmer suggestion.

MSX250 from marine solutions this skimmer is a big bang for the $$$.

Skimmer Link


I currently have one of the msx200 on my 125gal and plan on using 3 of the MSX300 on my 1200gal system that I’m building.

Mr.Biggs
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14434096#post14434096 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Mr.Biggs
mazda2002, Looks like a good project.

I have some questions on your budget. What you have so far might not be too far out of line, but I don’t see anything for Controls or electrical, what about saltwater mixing? What are the plans for water top off?

I have yet to find something that rly suits my needs and budget, but if all else fails, I will be wiring my tunze top-off to a selenoid connected to a RO/DI for top-off. I would also use a bucket to premix water and do water changes with a pump. (I'm hoping I can find something to automate water changes) For electronics, I

In the next picture, you can see were my washer/dryer closet is and in back of it a closet in wich I can have acces to water and drain. This is were I plan on installing the RO/DI unit and top-off mechanism. I would run tubes and wires from that closed to the tank.

closets.bmp
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14434096#post14434096 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Mr.Biggs


The hole in the wall might cost you a lot more depending on the rules that you must fallow and permits.

What is your electric rate/KWH $40 might not cover it depending what you install. Does it get hot up there in the summer time? What do you keep your house at for a temp in the winter? (heating/cooling the tank)

I'm going to find that out next week, im going to try and get my building permit as soon as I hear back from the co-owner. (permis is 50$)

The electrix rate here is 0.054$/KWH

I used the fallowing data to calculate:

1 48inch, 8neon wide T5 ballast (432watts) and a 400W MH for clams and coral in the bottum.

a return pump of 166W and closed loop mixing pump of 350W

With lighting 14 hours a day and pumps 24.

In my present tank, I dont heat the water at all, I keep my apartment at 22deg C. (72F). I didnt account for heating in my math. (maybe I should of?)

I dont know what the final lighting will be as one neon and one ballast would look kind of silly. (also not sure how adequate it would be?)

overall, we probably dont have more than 20-30 ''hot days'' in the summer. There is a big cealing fan in that room as well as two windows. Im hoping that will be enough for cooling. Temperatures can reach up to 90F on a very hot day.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14434096#post14434096 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Mr.Biggs

The 180 tank is pretty common and you should be able to find one for $300 - $400. I don’t know your local market though.

Do you have other space for water storage and salt mixing?

I would look at trying to make the front of the stand more open so that you can get the sump in and out without having to remove the tank. You will thank yourself for this when something needs to be changed or repaired and you don’t have to take the whole system apart to fix it.

Skimmer suggestion.

MSX250 from marine solutions this skimmer is a big bang for the $$$.

Skimmer Link


I currently have one of the msx200 on my 125gal and plan on using 3 of the MSX300 on my 1200gal system that I’m building.

Mr.Biggs

There is a LFS that can get some Jinlong tanks for pretty cheap, I I dont gnow if the bottom of the tank is tempered. It also has rounded corners on one side.

There seems to be vry little info on the web on these tanks except theyr built in china and the sailsman was of no help. Has anyone tried these tanks?

The sump will be removable by removing the decorative covor and sliding it out the side.

That skimmer looks awsome and the price is rly nice. Thanks for the suggestion, I may just go for that.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14435576#post14435576 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Brandon1652
The Seavisions "Dialyseas" basic unit will run you about $3200, but it is definately worth the money for what it does. This unit was featured in the December 2008 TOTM.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-12/totm/index.php

Wow, seems rly overpriced. Theyr website doesnt say much on how the salt mixing mecanism works or the electronics.

This sounds like it might be a good DIY project, I got an Idea on something that might work. (ill post a sketch when i get around to drawing it)
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14429320#post14429320 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by chem-e
Wow. That's going to be a nice tank. I hope you live on the first floor though because I'd be leary of having such a big tank on the second floor up. I bought separate insurance when I had a 100 gal at my complex because I didn't want a lawsuit on me if the tank leaked and caused water damage on the floors below.

Yha good point, Ill need to see if im covered for it. I do live on the second floor too. Thats y im not going with a DIY tank.
 
Personally, I wouldnt. Coralife isnt the greatest. Used 400w ballsts for ~$100 per, 400w Radiums for ~$200 for the set, and you can use Spider reflectors for $30 per new. Youd be happier with that in the long run, I believe. I Started with a cheaper fixture (current usa), and wasnt impressed at all. Fixtures give the cool all in one status, but unless they are elite manf. (giesemann, ATI, ELOS, etc) then theyre just not worth it.

But to answer your question, no, that shouldnt be enough light. I wouldnt go with less than a 250w halide, and preferably a 3x400w
 
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