2 ocellaris in QT, one swimming at tope with discolored tail

[flixxx]

Hello,

On January 25th I purchase 2 ocellaris fish that are in quarantine.

One of the clownfish started swimming at the top of the tank yesterday and stopped eating. He seems to be breathing quickly, it's hard to tell for sure in comparison with the other one.
This morning i noticed his tail is discolored (pale at the bottom) and the tips look "bitten"

The other fish is doing just fine, eating, swimming around.

What could the first fish have that makes him swim to the top, breathe heavy, lose his appetite and have a discolored tail?

The QT, Ammonia is at 0, Nitrite is at 0 and nitrate is at 0.2.

The QT is using a seeded sponge from the DT.

 

[Deinonych]

Can you post a picture? Discoloration could be a number of things. Are these fish wild-caught or tank-bred?

 

[flixxx]

Can you post a picture? Discoloration could be a number of things. Are these fish wild-caught or tank-bred?

Hey, thanks for the quick response, you and I are both following and documenting our CP adventures over at another thread. I was told they are wild caught.

I started with prazipro and was going to dose with cp in 10 days but now with this symptom I might have to fast track it.

I've attached the pics, I'm leaning towards brook and will immediately dose CP, I'm waiting for confirmation from the forum before I do anything though.

 

[HumbleFish]

If what you're seeing near the tail spreads to the rest of the body, and it looks as though his skin is peeling, I would say it's likely you are dealing with Brook.

If not, and only the tail is affected, then it's probably a bacterial infection.

 

[flixxx]

If what you're seeing near the tail spreads to the rest of the body, and it looks as though his skin is peeling, I would say it's likely you are dealing with Brook.

If not, and only the tail is affected, then it's probably a bacterial infection.

The whole CP gang is here

Can the loss of apettite, breathing fast and swimming at the top also point potentially to bacterial? If it is bacterial how do I treat it?

 

[HumbleFish]

The whole CP gang is here

Can the loss of apettite, breathing fast and swimming at the top also point potentially to bacterial? If it is bacterial how do I treat it?

A gram negative can; gram positives are typically not as harsh on the fish.

You can treat with a broad spectrum antibiotic such as Furan-2, or as Deinonych suggested to someone in another post - Seachem Kanaplex.

But the dilemma you are facing is if this is Brook, then you want to start CP treatment ASAP. 60mg/gal. I'm pretty sure you can mix antibiotics with CP. In fact, I think I've done it before. But alprazo would know for sure.

 

[HumbleFish]

Also, if you confirm this is Brook I wouldn't hesitate to adminster formalin baths in addition to CP treatment. A clownfish should be hardy enough to handle formaldehyde exposure. Just go to Wamart and buy some Quick Cure for the baths - it contains formalin.

 

[flixxx]

A gram negative can; gram positives are typically not as harsh on the fish.

You can treat with a broad spectrum antibiotic such as Furan-2, or as Deinonych suggested to someone in another post - Seachem Kanaplex.

But the dilemma you are facing is if this is Brook, then you want to start CP treatment ASAP. 60mg/gal. I'm pretty sure you can mix antibiotics with CP. In fact, I think I've done it before. But alprazo would know for sure.

Thanks, I don't fully understand your gram negative/positive quote at the top.

I will begin CP treatment immediately and skip the Prazipro. I'll monitor from there, personally i'd rather not do a formalin bath but if I see it getting worse by tomorrow i'll try it as a last resort.

 

[Deinonych]

But the dilemma you are facing is if this is Brook, then you want to start CP treatment ASAP. 60mg/gal. I'm pretty sure you can mix antibiotics with CP. In fact, I think I've done it before. But alprazo would know for sure.

You can mix antibiotics and CP - I've done it on a couple of occasions without incident.

According to Mrscribbled, 80mg/gal is required to eliminate brooklynella, similar to uronema.

 

[HumbleFish]

Thanks, I don't fully understand your gram negative/positive quote at the top.

Gram positive bacterial infection = very treatable, sometimes a fish's natural immune system can handle it without antibiotics; symptoms are generally mild

Gram negative bacterial infection = more deadly, more difficult to treat, fish usually have more severe symptoms

Of course, in a lot of cases it's virtually impossible to tell the difference between the two without a microscope. But IME gram negatives are more common with newly acquired fish, while gram positives can happen at any time.

 

[flixxx]

His tail is falling apart before my eyes

 

[flixxx]

R.I.P. he died so fast

 

[HumbleFish]

Sorry for your loss. In the postmortem pic, all that visually looks wrong with him is the tail rot. Is this what you are seeing as well? Or is there something else on the body that I am not seeing? Determining this will enable me to give you a likely cause of death.

 

[flixxx]

In the picture he is in freshwater, I tried to see if anythong would leave the body but nothing has.

The front where the white is has turned blackish, otherwise the rest of him looks fine.

Here is a better picture

I know his eye looks cloudy but I think that's just the flash from the camera. when I see him up close I don't see it being cloudy

 

[Deinonych]

I would lean toward fin rot/bacterial infection. I have had fish succumb to it quickly if untreated. Sorry for your loss.

Keep a close eye on the other clown.

 

[flixxx]

My water parameters were fine, the other fish seems ok. Could Prazipro have done this? I mean, is this something I'm causing?

I'm very disappointment in my LFS. I started in this hobby in November, and so far all my fish have died (except for the remaining ocellaris, time will tell).

The only reason I went back is because he promised to replace my fish free of charge. I've had a long chat with him about how I think his tanks are sick, many of his fish seem sick, I always find a dead fish also. They respond that ich and sickness is always present and there is nothing we can do about it. I'm hoping to get a proper QT regiment that successfully works here and I hope he will listen and take my advice. If not, i have to find a new LFS, and there aren't many in my area.

In the end, although it's a hard lesson, I've learnt the importance of quarantining and about new diseases/treatment. I just wish I'm successful at saving at least one fish

 

[Deinonych]

Highly unlikely Prazipro did this. It's one of the gentlest medications available for marine fish.

Regarding your LFS, I have experienced a similar dilemma. I was not satisfied with the condition of the livestock at most of my LFS, so I started buying online at LiveAquaria.com. I have to say that I have been extremely happy with my purchases there, and they offer a 14-day guarantee, no questions asked. I've had a couple of DOAs, but those are the exception, not the rule IME. You might give them consideration.

edit: just noticed you are in Canada...not sure if they ship across the border.

 

[flixxx]

Highly unlikely Prazipro did this. It's one of the gentlest medications available for marine fish.

Regarding your LFS, I have experienced a similar dilemma. I was not satisfied with the condition of the livestock at most of my LFS, so I started buying online at LiveAquaria.com. I have to say that I have been extremely happy with my purchases there, and they offer a 14-day guarantee, no questions asked. I've had a couple of DOAs, but those are the exception, not the rule IME. You might give them consideration.

edit: just noticed you are in Canada...not sure if they ship across the border.

I use liveaquaria for my research, heck I'm even signed up for their divers den newsletter. Unfortunately they don't ship here, I hope that will change soon.

The Canadian equivalent is j&l aquatics, shipping is 60$ though, very steep IMO.

My second ocellaris looks mad. Every time I go in the room he races up and looks like he's trying to yell at me... Poor guy, I wish I can tell him I was only trying to help.

 

[HumbleFish]

In the picture he is in freshwater, I tried to see if anythong would leave the body but nothing has.

The front where the white is has turned blackish, otherwise the rest of him looks fine.

Here is a better picture

I know his eye looks cloudy but I think that's just the flash from the camera. when I see him up close I don't see it being cloudy

Probably a gram negative infection. Unless the other clown gets Brook and proves me wrong. The weird thing about bacterial infections is you can get a gram positive that looks exactly like this, and the fish can recover on it's own without any antibiotics. IME; it's also difficult to say just how contagious a bacterial infection can be. Some will wipe out a tank - some kill just one fish, while the rest seem unaffected.

 

[flixxx]

Probably a gram negative infection. Unless the other clown gets Brook and proves me wrong. The weird thing about bacterial infections is you can get a gram positive that looks exactly like this, and the fish can recover on it's own without any antibiotics. IME; it's also difficult to say just how contagious a bacterial infection can be. Some will wipe out a tank - some kill just one fish, while the rest seem unaffected.

Thanks, can you help me get my "medicine cabinet" stocked?

So far I have the following:

Seeded sponge for QT
Prime just in case
CP for brook, ick and velvet
Prazipro for flukes and parasite

To get:

Seachem Kanaplex (AS you and others mentioned, this may have helped save my oscellaris)
Formalin <-- My walmart doesn't carry the bath cure product, any other canadian medication i can buy?

Is there anything else that is a must-have?