20g SPS reef, need help along the way!

[Picano]

Hi all,

I'm relatively new to this forum, not really new to reef keeping. I've been keeping saltwater aquariums off and on for six years now. I'm really getting into SPS corals, for the challenge of it. Since my last attempt at keeping SPS corals alive failed miserably - I'm looking to this forum to help me out with this build.

Now, I know that hard coral need three main things: Lots of light, Lots of water flow, and clean water conditions.

I have a decent light - a 4x24w T5HO by Nova Extreme and my other corals seem to do well under it. Let me know if this is enough light for hard coral, or if I need to get something better or maybe even LEDs? I would like to stick to T5s. I'm willing to upgrade to a different fixture if necessary.

For water flow, I'm going to temporarily use a Koralia 240 nano and an oceanic 700. If someone wants to, please talk me into paying for a Vortech MP1. I'm hearing really good reviews and people say that they are miracle pumps for SPS corals. Is this true?

For the clean water conditions part, I am currently running an algae scrubber - however, it's not cutting it at the moment. My tank looks dirty, and algae is starting to build up and I'm not impressed with my DIY scrubber. I'm going to build it inside an acrylic box later on. HOWEVER for this updated system, I want to run an Octopus skimmer.

Here's the current setup:

20g tall tank
10g sump
rio 1100 return pump
small algae scrubber
Koralia 240 nano powerhead
external overflow
4x24w T5HO lights
40 pounds live rock
30 pounds live sand

Livestock:
2 tomato clowns
1 bicolor blenny
1 cleaner shrimp
5 blue leg hermits
5 astrea snails
1 nassarius snail
1 monti cap
shrooms
halimeda...
various marine life

In the next post, I am going to list what I want to do, and what I need suggestions for. Also, I have pics of my new stand and sump and need some advice on.

Please help me! I have never really been successful at SPS corals, but they are my absolute favorite corals of all time, and I will do anything to keep them happy and healthy!

 

[Picano]

Here's what I want to do with the new setup:

SPS dominated tank, no sand and only two small piles of live rock. I want my SPS corals to thrive, and I want the bottom of the tank to be encrusted with either some type of hard coral, or a soft coral like zoas or GSP. I want to have equipment that I can use for the 75g that I have my eye on in the future, and have that 75g as an SPS dominated tank as well.

I am looking at protein skimmers in the $200 to $250 range that can fit in-sump. So far I have my eye on two different kinds of Octopus skimmers. I was wondering if anyone had any other suggestions/brands/ideas.

I'm looking to purchase an Auto top off system as well for this tank. I have room underneath the new stand to set a 5.5g aquarium for an auto top off system, and was wondering if anyone would give me some recommendations?

I also have room for an algae scrubber, phosphate reactor, carbon reactor, and a calcium reactor. I would absolutely love some advice on some brands and use of calcium reactors. I've never used one, and I am intrigued about how they work and what they do. I also know that I need a system that is pretty much set, monitor and don't have to tweak often.

 

[Picano]

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii295/SnakeBlitz33/IMG_0202.jpg

These are pics of it when it was a couple months old. Nothing to look at - boring. Nothing out of the ordinary. Painful to look at.

Please help me transform it from this into something extraordinary!

 

[Picano]

Here are a few pics of the new stand that I built, in it's progress shots. Enjoy.

Dimensions: 18 1/2" x 50 1/4" by 37 1/2" tall.

 

[chrishayes]

I feel first off that you are in the right place to find success with your new tank!

RIght off the batI say you need to remove your shrooms. THey will wither and die in low nutrients and if you are unsuccessful in keeping low nutrients, they will take over.

Now to the equipment. Skimmer wise you need to look to a small footprint one to fit in your small sump that will be large enough to run your 75 later on. Id go with a swc or bubble maggus for their small footprints. THey fit your budget as well.

Pump wise, go for a mp40 right off the bat. You can dial it down for your current tank then bump it up for the 75. Itll save you money in the long run. The pumps you have now wont cut it. You could go with the mp10 but it wont do you much good with your upgrade.

lighting is ok for that size tank. Im a halide guy so I cant give you advice on bulb combo but changing out the bulbs will give you more par than the factory bulbs but your fixture itself is good not great.

Control is key in a sps tank. A starter controller is affordable and will give you heat and cooling control right out of the box. this is essential. The tighter you keep the temp to a set point the happier the tank will be. Later it will help to control everything you want it to.

cal/alk/mg control is a top priority youll need to pick a method and hit the books learning about it. Two part is the easiest and cheapest right off the bat. You will have to test(test kits are another must) regularly to know your dosing amount, then you can manually dose that or go for dosing pumps that you can control with your controller or you can set them up with a simple digital timer.

Theres the basics and by all means if I skipped something I appologize and feel free to add it in anyone. As you go youll have many more questions so feel free to ask. Just realize a lot of the gear for your tank will be personal preference that everyone will reccomend something different so YOU need to do the legwork and make your choices with the help of the gang here if needed. I think you shold read through lots of build threads to get an idea of what youre up against here and to see what equipment does and doesnt work. Good luck

 

[Picano]

The aquarium sitting on top in the last pic is actually the 20g long sump. I haven't baffled it yet because I don't really know which skimmer I am going to be going with yet. I need to make sure I have enough room.

Also, the cabinet is so large on either side so that I could acommodate two side cabinets for electrical equipment as well as food and other supplies. That cabinet may or may not be in the works in the near future. I say may not be... because I'm thinking why not upgrade to a 75g tank since I have a stand built for it? I like a 75g... and a 90g would be a little too tall for me to work in really well. But, what size would ya'll recommend?

Also, I have a question about my return pump. I am currently using a rio 1100 and an Eshopps PSK Nano external overflow. I don't know how much longer I am keeping this aquarium, but I would like to go ahead and get a mag 7 for the 75g tank, and just throttle it back some and put a relief valve on it for my little 20g that I have now. I would also like to run a few pieces of equipment from the return line... a phosban reactor, an algae scrubber, and possibly a feed for a recirculating octopus skimmer... unless I get some other recommendations.

I'll assume that I know nothing about keeping hard coral, and that I'm starting fresh. I need advice, please.

 

[Picano]

Yeah, I've been reading the threads on here for a few months now! I'm getting some really good ideas but there's a lot of unanswered questions that I have... since I am choosing to go a different route this time than my normal coral tanks.

In the new tank setup, I don't plan on keeping any softies. I just thought the GSP growing on the bottom of the tank would look cool. I plan on this tank being barebottom, so I can get a lot more flow. I guess I will look into getting an MP40 used, if I can find one for my price range. First off the bat, I need to get a decent protein skimmer. Here are the three skimmers that I am really liking and looking at:

octopus nwb30 for 150g (needle wheel)
octopus dnwb 110 for 125g (recirc skimmer)
octopus super SRO 1000INT for 125g (in sump w/ bubble blaster pump)

I would think that going any higher, like a Diablo 2500 on a 75g tank would be too much and wouldn't skim efficiently, don't ya'll? I fell in love with the Diablo, but someone told me that on such a small tank, it wouldn't be effective.

The only real difference between the nwb30 and the 1000INT is the pump. The design is basically the same. So, if you had to choose between the two which one would it be? I mean, I know it's up to me, but I would like someone to chime in. I've heard good things about the bubble blaster pumps recently.

The recirc skimmer is if I want to mount it out of the sump to make room for other equipment.

Should I insulate my stand to keep the temp more well regulated?

How hard is it to drill glass? I was considering drilling the tank in one corner to make a home made overflow. Anyone know if the back glass of a 20g high is tempered?

 

[mrbigshot]

the major brands 20h's rear glass is not tempered, drilling should be ok but to be sure let us know the manufacturer. im doing nearly the same thing right now. your thread was shadowing my thoughts.

im using a glass-holes supernano overflow box nad the return for now is a 500gph odyssea waterpump plumbed to a 3/4 glass-holes lock line return. seems to work ok. my aga 20h drilled pretty easy, ive drilled every tank ive owned so far and this one was no surprises.

i ordered one of those sc65 skimmers to try out, looks like a bm knockoff for a great price. i did however plan on using a octo 160 cone when i was baffling my 10g sump so i left enough room for the upgrade if need be.

 

[Picano]

I have no idea what manufacturer it was. I bought the thing at Petco to save a buck. lol. Can someone give me some tips and tricks on how to drill glass? Does Home Depot have glass hole saw bits? Should I use a battery powered drill or a corded one? Is it better to use glass cutting oil or can I just use vegetable oil? Sorry for all the questions. Oh, one more - What size bulkhead would be best, a 3/4" or 1"? I think I could do all this in one day if I just had the materials available...

My little Rio 1100 pump may not cut back on if I unplug it! I'm scared that I'm not going to get it to turn back on if I cut it off in the move. I guess the first thing I need to do is figure out which return pump I need for my 20/75 and get it, then move my tank over to the new stand when my sump is built. I guess next would be to get a decent skimmer.

I'm thinking of a few different designs for my live rock pile. I think I'm going to put most of my live rock in the sump, and only make two little piles in the middle of the display tank. I don't want any sand in the tank. I know for a fact that I can't buy a MP40 outright, so I am going to get the oceanic 700 powerhead temporarily and save up for the MP40 later.

Would it be better to get one MP10 for my 20g tank, and then buy another one when I get my 75g tank?

Thanks for the info!

 

[Picano]

Never mind. The glass bit costs too much, when I already just have the external overflow for free. I know it's peace of mind an all, but it's just not in the budget.

The 75g, though, will be reef ready.

 

[Alex T.]

Some glass bits are under $10. Even if you don't have $10, if you have a good relationship with your LFS they might loan you theirs...or possibly another reefer close to you. I borrowed one from my LFS. Definitely use a cordless drill. There's much more control and they tend to be lighter. And. you would be using water to drill the glass so a cord could cause a little shock if your careless.

I'd get the MP40 if the funds allow, but I'd also take some of the rock out to allow for maximum flow and ease of maintenance. Even in a high flow tank, a lot of rock work can make some dead spots that you won't be able to reach. Plus, it would allow for more water volume, which in your case is at a premium in such a small volume to begin with. It's so much easier to attempt SPS in a larger water volume that you're starting more in the intermediate level of SPS difficulty with your setup. I'm not saying it can't be done, but it's not the easiest route. Drilling the tank is really the best option. You'll be glad you did and wished you did if you choose to go with the external overflow box.

 

[Picano]

I'll drill my next tank. I could get a $10 drill bit, but not the $85-$95 ones I see on the internet. I'm going to have to really think about it. I would really like to get the whole thing moved on the new stand by Christmas.

For now, I have to use what I got as far as powerheads are concerned. In the near future, I might be able to swing for an MP10. No one else thinks that two MP10s would be better in the larger tank? It's about the same amount of money for two MP10s as it is for one MP40.

Yes, the live rock will be two really small piles of rock in the middle parts of the tank. Maybe 10 pounds? and the rest is going in the sump for extra biofiltration. I'm considering brushing and basteing all the live rock in my tank in a tub of saltwater before I put em' in my sump/tank. Just an extra precaution. Thoughts, anyone?
I'm also banishing all of my hermit crabs to my sump. I got a few hermit crabs that are terrorizing my tank. I'm done with hermits.

 

[Picano]

I have a 5 g sterilite brand storage tote I was thinking about using for the auto toP off system. Does anyone have any objections? Anyone know if it's reef safe?

 

[chrishayes]

Look no further than G l a ss h ol es for your bit and any other plumbing. Even look at their nano overflow. It comes with the bit and everything need for a fairly decent overflow and the best thing is that its like 50 bucks. Since youre a diy guy like myself you could just get one of their cheap bits and some bulkheads then bulid your own overflow out of glass or plexi. Not hard to do and cheap too. Id go with a larger bulkhead so that you can reuse it on the future tank.

As to the pump, we are all pushing you to a larger pump that can be dialed back because youll just end up wasting money in the long run if you go with smaller useless pumps for a 75. Two mp10s is just not enough for that size tank unless you have other ph's which looks bad and just adds more equipment and cost. most times in reefkeeping you have to spend more to save more. ALWAYS buy quality and the largest thing possible to avoid having to repurchase stuff along the way. It WILL save you money promise.

DO the same with the skimmer. Go big and high quality right off the bat or you WILL buy another one...

As to your tote, theres no reason you cant use it. I see it all the time. Just check the symbol on the bottom and reference it with google to make sure its food safe or it may leach chemicals which is no good.

 

[Picano]

Dang. Ok.

I'll look into that bit set and overflow kit. You are right, I am a big DIY guy. Lol.

I wonder how I will break the news to my wife about buying a $450 powerhead. Lol.

I'll also check out that symbol thing on the tote. Thanks for the heads up.

Is there anything I am overlooking?

Would someone recommend me getting the octopus diablo skimmer or not... For a 75g?

 

[chrishayes]

Im not sure on that particular skimmer but a buddy of mine has the nwb110 and its a great quality skimmer. The pumps arent the best but its good enough. You may replace the pump every now and then but thats aceptable to most folks on a budget. As long as the body is quality and replacement parts are available id consider putting it on my own reef.

SO can you tell me exactly what your plan is. Like you ARE using a 20 long right? and a 10gal sump?

 

[glennr1978]

Before buying any mp10's, make sure that they can handle the thicker glass of the 75g. If you can get an mp40 I would definitely recommend going that route. However, its gonna look HUGE in a 20g.

 

[Picano]

I might either go with the nwb110 or the nwb150. I'm thinking about the 150. If that means I have to replace the pump once every couple of years, that shouldn't be that bad to deal with.

I'm using the 20g high tank as my display tank for now. I'm going to get that nano kit, I think, from GH, like you suggested. The 20g long is going to be the sump. The 10g sump that I have now will be converted into an algae scrubber. Within the next six months, I plan on upgrading to a 75g.

 

[Picano]

Glenn - I will make sure of it. Thank you for the heads up.

I have another question - would it be a good idea to paint the bottom of the tank white? Kind of like a false sand bed?

 

[Picano]

I looked at these 5g totes that I bought, Sterilite brand. They are number 5 plastics. Here's some info I found on them:

Number 5 Plastics
PP (polypropylene)
Found in: Some yogurt containers, syrup bottles, ketchup bottles, caps, straws, medicine bottles
Recycling: Number 5 plastics can be recycled through some curbside programs.
Recycled into: Signal lights, battery cables, brooms, brushes, auto battery cases, ice scrapers, landscape borders, bicycle racks, rakes, bins, pallets, trays

Polypropylene has a high melting point, and so is often chosen for containers that must accept hot liquid. It is gradually becoming more accepted by recyclers.


I figure that if it's good enough for holding food, it should be reef safe.

So, does anyone have some auto top off unit recommendations? I want something that's not too complicated and maybe comes with a pump.

Is the same true with calcium reactors? The more you pay, the better quality it is?