220 Inwall - Plan

[weatherson]

Bryan,

I don't believe your thoughts on alleviating some head pressure are correct. My understanding of vertical-height head pressure would remain the same for the same given amount of flow. It's a gravitational issue which would remain whether one, two or five vertical pipes. At any given time, you will still have the same volume of water above the pump of which it must fight gravity against. Larger pipe diameter to a point and the minimizing of tight bends (a 90 compared to two 45's) will provide greater rewards in flow rates.

The layout looks good so far. Another possibility to consider would be the addition of a OM 4-way at the return pump or tank top with four individual tank return lines. I'd also second the thought of keeping the in-prefilter box returns for additional drains and do the returns over the tank top. I've converted mine to this to gain flow rate with some weir alterations.

Joseph

 

[bheron]

Lonnie - thats a good point to consider: moving the new fish twice would surely cause an extra round of stress. I guess I'm hoping the last move would be very minimal: I wouldnt have to acclimate them at all b/c they'd already have been in the same exact water source. I would just shut off the lights in the display and then transfer the fish in a net to the display tank. Thats what I was hoping!?


Joseph - thanks for the feedback. Hmmmmm, I was completely unaware thats how it worked. ie - I figured for sure if you had 5 pipes versus one pipe of the same diameter it would take 5 times the effort to push the same amount of water up the 5 pipes as it would through the 1. Wow. That does change everything.

Got it, so I'll stick with the two verticals and split them where its most convenient.

Also, I'm definitely preserving the filterbox holes for future outflow. Right now, I'm planning on using the mag18 return flow, along with 2 Tunzes to take care of the flow. I really dont want to do any type of closed loop or extra devices, like an OM-4 way right now.

Thanks for all the feedback! I have the weekend free so I'm planning on building the shelves in the back room and....maybe begin the plumbing.

 

[weatherson]

But... you wouldn't use five pipes of the same diameter of the one pipe. The five pipe scenario would include five pipes whose total inside diameter equaled that of or was just slightly greater than the inside diameter of the single pipe. We're talking total volume of water within the pipe(s) that gravity can affect. Granted, friction and turbulence will play a part but this can be compensated for with slightly larger inside diameter pipe and creative plumbing. At least, this is how I understand it all.

 

[bheron]

right. true point. but in my case my two scenarios were:

A) two 1-inch dia. vertical PVC pipes, that split at the sump and each ran up a side of the tank, 30", to the top

or

B) one, 1-inch dia. vertical PVC pipe running from the sump, 30" up the back of the tank, then splitting off at the top. the split is still there, but instead of 2 30" verticals, only one.


Now, maybe a part I missed is that, with scenario B the pipe is NOT 1-inch, but would have to be bigger to accomodate the flow. Is that what you meant?

hmmmmmmm I'm getting this.

 

[weatherson]

Dependent on the flow required but yes, that's what I was referring to.

 

[bheron]

Got it. Thanks!


My next question is in refernce to the bulkheads. I have yet to measure the diameter of the openings in the bottom of my tank, but once I do I have to decide what bulkheads to use...


I've seen so much dialogs on here in reference to all different types of bulkheads. I just need to connect the dursos through the bottom of the tank.

where do I start?
want to keep it simple an inexpensive.

 

[melev]

Standard bulkheads that are threaded on the inside (inside the tank) and slip on the outside (where the plumbing will hook up to drain/return) is what I use.

The Durso has a threaded fitting screwed in at the bottom, and the Durso standpipe is pressed into this. I did the same for the returns actually.

 

[bheron]

Cool. Is this something I can get from Home Depot? PVC?

Also, is there a gasket and/or sealant like silicone? My only experience with bulkheads is with plumbing my 18 gallon rubbermaid fuge.

 

[agarza]

Hi, not much of a poster but a captive reader, your setup, planning and patience are awsome. Congrats.

Check this page for durso information, you can order from them but there's also a DIY guide. www.dursostandpipes.com

Cheers

 

[melev]

Yes, everything you need is at Home Depot, except for the bulkheads themselves. Those you can buy online or locally from your LFS.

I don't put any sealer on mine, because new bulkheads have a new pliable rubber washer. The Durso isn't glued at all, just pressed together.

 

[Airman]

What a read

What a read

It took me awhile to finish reading this thread. I don't have the patience that you have. I would want to do anything in two weeks. There were several things that I want to comment on but I don't want to talk about some that was talked about 5 pages ago. I will continue to read *** you post.

 

[bheron]

agarza - thanks so much! Monterrey, huh? Awesome I learned so much simply by "lurking" on some of the great threads on here. occasionally I'd chime in. thanks for the tip on the durso site. i'll have to check it out. and thanks for the kind words and for stopping by!

melev - darn, i was just by my LFS tonight but didnt stop in. the only one that might have it would be the one thats about an hour away. what, exactly, am I looking for? is it a special type or name of bulkhead? I would've thought Home Depot would be the answer. oh well!

Airman - thanks alot! please, feel free to comment on anything done so far, or planned to be done. thats how we all learn! thanks.

 

[melev]

Here is one: http://www.marinedepot.com/md_viewItem.asp?idproduct=FT1115
From this page: http://www.marinedepot.com/a_ft_2.asp?ast=&key=

Don't be surprised if the exact same thing costs double at the LFS.

 

[weatherson]

Bulkheads... ah yes. Here's a can of worms for you. Unfortunately, there are huge differences in quality between different bulkheads. The Marine Depot units have been discussed before and the reason is that they are of poor quality. First of all, they have fine threads. This alone is not a bad thing until you factor in that the tightening nut these come with fit loose at best. The two factors together creates a potential for the nut to pop over threads and instantly loosen and inevitably cause a leak in your system. Not good at all.

In an area as critical as your prefilter boxes, I prefer a heavier, course thread unit not unlike what Aquatic Eco Systems offers. It is schedule 80, has course threads, a nut which is fatter than most (more threads) and a thick quality gasket. Here's a link:
Top Quality Bulkheads at AES
These are more expensive than the average bulkhead but again, safety and peace of mind are sometimes more expensive to achieve.

I have threaded bulkheads and more specifically, threaded on the prefilter box-inside side. This allows me to unscrew the Durso and empty the prefilter box occasionally when I clean it out. With just the bulkhead at the bottom, debris on hte inside bottom is easily stirred up to be evacuated. I also have glued the Durso riser pipe to a male threaded coupler at the bottom that mates up to the bulkhead. This allows the unit to be unscrewed.

 

[thardy]

not bad

 

[melev]

One thing to keep in mind between the Sch 40 and Sch 80 bulkheads is that the 80s are thicker, and thus the hole size may not be large enough to accomodate the bulkhead. I've only used the normal bulkheads, so I can't say what size you'd need. Maybe Joseph has some hard numbers for you.

A 1.5" bulkhead needs a 2 3/8" hole for the bulkheads Marine Depot sells. The Schedule 80 would not fit that and still have a 1.5" diameter drain.

 

[Airman]

Bryan,

It looks like you changed the location of the refugium. I thought it was going to be above the 15 gal QT and use a J-tube to allow pods access to the main tank so they would not have to go through the impeller of the pump. If you are going to have it under the main tank why not just have a little bigger sump with a section in the sump for the refugium?

 

[bheron]

RE: Bulkheads

Wow, this is exactly what I was hoping for! I know there's so much out there and its not something I would delve into myself without checking first.

Marc, Joseph - thanks for the links!!! I will order online here since you guys have direct experience. Joseph, thanks for the brief tutorial. Yes, this is an area I dont want to skimp on. I'm actually going to stop by Home Depot today, just in case, to see what they have. I dont think I'll find anything in the schedule 80 range. Thanks so much for the head start!


- I first have to carefully measure the size of the holes in the bottom of the tank. With the AGA MegaFlow, each of the 2 prefilter boxes has two holes drilled, one each being larger than the other. Based on what it comes out to, I'll decide what kind of bulkhead to get.

- Do I use the same type for the set of holes I'm not using at this time?


I'll give an update on what I find.

Airman - yes! very astute of you to notice! youre right, I took out the top refugium from the design. As you mentioned, yes, I was planning on having a Fuge above the display for the propogaiton of pods that would easily flow via gravity into the display. that was the plan. however, after looking at the room I'm not sure if I can fit the 18g rubbermaid up there with enough room to be able to see and work inside it - ie: it will be really close to the ceiling. I ran into that with my old, 75g setup: the fuge was in such a tight spot that I couldnt see into or work in the fuge. It was rough. So, I decided to put it in a more managable area. I based this on the thought that the pods will still make it back up to the display through the Mag18 impeller. I believe they should be ok.
Also, I also decided not to have a Fuge section in my sump. I originally planned to do so, just for kicks, but have now decided to leave it open for a) flexibility purposes, and b) more room to kill off microbubbles! My fuge is going to be my current 75G display -- so I dont have any other options right now.

But....now that you have me thinking about it, I dont need a large 18g rubbermaid above the display, I could use something much smaller and achieve the same goal. Hmmmm, you have me thinking. Maybe I'll employ a small, mini fuge for the pods and stuff above it.

Thanks for the input everyone!

More to come, hopefully soon!

 

[bheron]

Update - nothing at Home Depot!

 

[melev]

Yes, Home Depot and Lowes do not sell bulkheads, nor do plumbing supply, sprinkler businesses, or pool suppliers. If you can find a place that makes hot tubs, they might have them.

The larger hole is your drain, the smaller one is the return.