36g bowfront start-up: Just mere hours away...

[Newreeflady]

Well, I tested the plumbing for leaks with FW and found just one tiny slow drip that I was expecting at a threaded joint where the Oceanrunner pump output is actually metric and not truly 3/4". [The intake also had this problem, but the joint was tight not loose...]

So, i've just redone it and put some silicon. I am not going to retest it with FW. All other joints are fine so i've decided if it leaks i'll just stop the CL, open the union and deal with it at that point...

Anyhow, the tank is full with SW and i've got the heaters running. Soon i'll add rock and start up the main pump.

Here are some pix of the plumbing... (notice my sloppy job with the pvc glue, but hey, it holds.. )

Thanks again to all who gave advice and time helping me here.

Angela

 

[dannieboiz]

those check valve is going to definitely reduce a lot of flow. I'd reconsider those. Seems like you're making it into a corner unit? U paint the back too?

 

[Newreeflady]

Those aren't check valves, they are ball valves, and they are useful which is why I incorporated them. . .

off to start a new thread. I made an attempt with the overflow and i've been driven to insanity by the noise after just 5 minutes. . .

-A

 

[xinumaster]

can you take picture of the front side?

 

[Newreeflady]

Look ma... no leaks

Look ma... no leaks

So, there are some things that need to be addressed, but i've decided to match the drain flow to the return pump flow, and i've come up with a very quiet and seemingly stable system (i'm almost confident enough to leave the house...)

So, first i'll write a few notes:

This is a 36g aga bowfront corner aquarium. It is undrilled. I'm running two pumps:

Main:
OceanRunner 2500 for the main return. The drain is through a Lifereef overflow box. The sump is just a 15g tall aga tank with three bubble-trapping dividers in it.

Closed Loop:

OceanRUnner 3500 drains through a drilled out piece of pvc so as to disperse the suction making it anemone-safe. The return is through an OM Squirt to 4 loc-line.

Angela

 

[Elite]

I think you put the U tube on the wrong side of the box. You will have a flood if the overflow stop working after power outage. So make sure test that (several time).

Everything else looks good

 

[nasotang]

I'd also sugguest checking to make sure your sump can hold enough volume incase of a power outage. I havent used an an external overflow box, but if there is an outage and the power comes back on, could you tank possibly overflow from the added sump water since the U-tube/overflow is higher than the tanks waterline?

 

[Newreeflady]

Elite, yes, you were correct. I modified that when I turned the tank around. Now it will keep a siphon. The only worry would be if the overflow clogged up, then the tank would overflow.

naso, I did make sure the sump could hold the volume. After shutting everything down, the water level in the sump rises by only about 3" still leaving about 3" of room to spare.

Thanks Man, this thing is so quiet with the pump and drain flow matched. I left it for hours, it doesn't fluctuate at all in the overflow box. I am not sure why so many people don't like this idea. Honestly, it makes total sense to me... ahh, relaxtation.

NOW, I just have to figure out what i'm going to do about lighting. I have a Blueline 250W + 2 x 32W halide/pc combo pendant. Not sure how i'll hang it, or if it'd be better to build a hood.

Ahh, decisions decisions...
Angela

 

[Mr. Ugly]

Hey Angela,

Just make a habit of checking your siphon tube regularly. If you get a fish or snail into your overflow, you can block your siphon.

A more gradual problem that can sneak up on you.... if you get microbubbles in your tank, and the siphon flow is low to moderate, the bubbles can accumulate in the tube over a period of time. The flow decreases, and you may eventually lose siphon. Even if you don't, you can have a problem of the pump rate overrunning your siphon rate.

If you see the water level running higher than normal in your tank, check the overflow teeth and the siphon tube.

 

[Newreeflady]

Thanks, Norman.

I will be definitely keeping an eye on it. I actually was considering slipping a 2" drilled out pvc cover over the drain standpipe to block the turbo snails and such from entering. I would just need to be sure to clean this regularly, but as long as I make the holes just smaller than the snails it should have no flow problems. I think I might also want to put some eggcrate in the inner box.

I need to figure out if I want to mount this light over the tank. I'll probably hold it over the tank later to see if the overspill of light is too annoying. I could build a canopy, but that's another project, especially for a bowfront.

The flow through the sump is pretty decent, i'm no expert but i'll extimate maybe a little under 400gph. I'm not seeing any bubbles accumulating in the u-tube.


Angela

 

[Kinetic]

I'm not sure if this would work, but just a thought: if you apply some float sensors to our system, you could probably detect that your sump level drops below a certain level, meaning the siphon broke / got stuck, thus turning off the return pump. This can be done with units like the ReefFanatic level controller ($90). Just a thought? It might save you, though if the sensor fails, it may destroy you too =(

 

[Newreeflady]

Hi Art,

I think what i'm planning to do is to drill the overflow box for a 1" bulkhead so that if it gets that high due to a temporary pressure differential when the pump stops and restarts, it will drain through there until the pressure equilibriates.

The only fluctuation in the overflow box seems to be when I unplug the pump for a minute and then plug back in. When this happens the level in the box becomes unstable for about 20 seconds and rises. It doesn't flood, but i'd rather be safe than sorry.

So, on that note, do I need to bring this box to TAP to be drilled? I was able to drill acrylic on my patio, but since this is a box and not a board, i'm a little nervous as I don't have anything to clamp it in place with (drill press type thing?)


Angela

 

[dantodd]

Hi Angela,

I would suggest using two U tubes for siphon to give a lot of extra capacity and it won't fail even if one gets completely plugged.

Also, I am not a big fan of "balanced" drain. I use a modified durso that is completely silent running about 650 gph. and I'm confident it would do much more. I basically followed the durso design but use 2 ells to make the J and jsut drilled and tapped one of the ells for air escape. It really does work and has a lot of extra capacity.

As for drilling your box you can slip it over a 2X4 so that you are drilling onto a stable base.

 

[Newreeflady]

Hi Dan,

Well, I don't really need extra capacity in the drain. It has more than I need. I would consider two smaller tubes to replace the large one maybe.

I don't really understand why matching the drain is frowned upon. People seem to have been running overflows without durso if their system seems to be working without noise and such. This is the same idea, their pump matches their siphon rate well enough to not incorporate a lot of air, or sound like it is flushing.

I am really hesistant to set up the durso. I tried a couple of different air-incorporating designs and they are noisy due to bubbles in the sump, even after you quiet the drain. Whereas with the flow matching the drain, I don't hear anything (ahh, silence)

I haven't heard a good explanation for why having an overflow capacity matching that of your pump flow is a problem. The chances of a clog and flood seem the same as if you don't have it hooked up this way to me.

As for drilling, is there any way i'd crack this box? It's awefully expensive and I definitely can't chance that.

Thanks!
Angela

 

[dantodd]

Hi Angela.

It's not so much the matched drain. My 72 BF uses a matched drain. It's having a fixed drain that can be problematic if there are changes in the system. My 72 uses a float in the drain to match it. I am generally atisfied but the 100 I am building uses a durso and I like it much better. It's just my experience using both.

 

[Newreeflady]

How does that float work, Dan?

thx,
-A

 

[dantodd]

It is a float with a small hole molded into the top and a shaft that slips into the drain. The bottom of the shaft is open and cut at an angle. This lets some air escape the top of the float from the drain. The top of the drain is perforated. When there is no water in the overflow the float shaft fully closes the perforations in the drain. As the overflow fills and the float raises the shaft lifts out of the drain. The higher it floats the more drain is open. Once the drain is balanced with the overflow the float sits relatively still but will drop if the flow is reduced or raise if it is increased and thus keeps the balance.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[Newreeflady]

Pictures? Not sure i'm seeing this.

Thx,
-A

 

[dantodd]

no pictures. I have the overflow blacked out.

Basically the higher the float rises the bigger the hole into the drain gets. The lower the float the smaller the drain hole.

The overflow level keeps rising until the float is high enough that the hole in the drain is balanced with the water entering the overflow.

Make any more sense?

 

[Newreeflady]

Not sure I can envision the physical concept, but the sound of it makes sense. I'm not sure how this would work for me. I guess it would let more air in if the overflow level got higher, but the overflow doesn't get higher. If I don't close it some the overflow is much faster than the pump so, in this setting, the level never rises past wherever the standpipe is.

-A