_TOTW_ Water Flow and Zoanthids

[Creetin]

I keep my zoa's and palys in a medium flow not too turbulent.
I have roughly 40 times turnover, and where My zoa's are they get roughly 20 times turnover flowing past them.
I have found too much flow and you'll have polyps of zoa's and palys popping up where i dont want them. They release single polyps and float somewhere else.
My zoa's and palys are all very healthy and grow pretty fast.

 

[MiddletonMark]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6929513#post6929513 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by drgabe
Great thread, I hope this is the first of many great threads to come.

FYI folks
I've let this thread take longer than a week, it's taken a little to get going. [But it's going ]
I'm planning the next question, perhaps title it for longer than weekly ... expect the next one by the weekend.

As always, if you've got a great idea:
Send It!

 

[ckfazz]

I've noticed that once I made the MJ mod to allow more flow, my zoas have begun to grow more frequently and appear healthier. I would have to agree that most zoas like a higher flow but there is a point to which they have too much flow for my personal taste. I think that with too much flow, when the skirts begin to extend farther than normal, it is a sign that the zoas are "stretching" for other food sources besides light. I know that it is a debate wether or not to feed zoas but I have noticed a significant increase in growth since I started dosing phyto.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Great topic. In my experience, putting zoanthids in a heavy flow(100x) SPS system and watching their growth explode has been my most rewarding experience as a reefkeeper. It has me pretty much addicted to collecting any and all SoPac zoas I could find. 50+ and I'm still searching.

Only the caribbean palythoas require lesser flow IME. This could be because they have a taller body and are less streamlined. They show this by curling on the side where the flow is coming from, and sliming a little. I see this contradicted what others are saying about palys. Maybe something else was bothering them, I didn't have them for very long before I gave them away.

Other than that, I have seen only improvements in polyp size, color, reproduction, and overall vigor since I tried BB and set up some tanks with tons of flow, as high as a 115x TO rate. I think it may not be overkill afterall.

I believe it prevents sediment from settling on and around the polyps base or mat. I first noticed this on an old 29g tank with minimal flow. I would need to turkey-baste the zoas every once in a while or else they would begin to deteriorate.

I also have seen that random, pulsing flow is important for zoas just as it is for SPS. I use controlled Tunzes for most of the flow, and powerful static closed loops that are directed at the bottom of the tanks, spread out with 4 or 6 outlets. This keeps it swirlin on the bottom, and is key to a successful barebottom reeftank.

 

[JE's Reef]

When everyone is talking turn over rate, i would no a little more about this. I have a 75 gallon tank with a 50 gallon breeder used for a sump/fuge. My return pump has 720 per hour and Im getting a Seio this week that does 620 per hour. So that is 1340 per hour.So if I take 1340 devide it by 75 gallons it is about 17x. Is this the way to calulate this?
Thanks
John

 

[jjmatti]

thanks for whoever thought of this topic. I learned something..

I have zoo's all over my tank. High flow and low flow areas... The only zoos that I have seen spread to other rocks are the ones that get the most flow. In the next highest flow area I have a frag of zoos that looks great but do not seem to spread and grow very fast at all. I have three other frags in low flow areas and they seem to do "ok" but not really growing and looking as good as they can.
I am getting the feeling after reading this thread that if I put another Seio in my tank and readjust the flow of the tank I might get these guys to grow bigger and out of control..

Also .. in regards to the GSP's ... Everyone tells me how easy they are to grow. I have had 2 frags of them in the past and with no great success have they spread and look vivid green. Just one week ago I got a very small frag from a friend and placed it right in front of the Seio 620 I have in the back corner of the tank. They have been doing great and its polyps are almost always extended.

 

[Meisen]

Here is what I have observed in having kept (or cared for at least) zoanthid colonies over the years:

-there are definite differences in flow preference between species/varieties (note that the group is getting some taxonomic attention and some early evidence suggests that the current understanding of the group is way off). Specifically, the nice cotton candy pink variety with a connected coenchyme seems to prefer (need?) a lot of flow to keep from fouling. I keep them in high flow/high light and have good luck with them that way. High flow for me is about 30X turnover in a 120. On the opposite end of the scale, I have some Florida blues that curl up in the same conditions. I have nestled them down inbetween a couple of pieces of live rock on the bottom and their expansion is much better. As I think you have noticed Mark, zoanthids seem to have quite a bit of plasticity in their morphology. Zoas kept under high light/flow/low nutrient conditions tend to stay smaller and have longer and thinner tentacles whereas

Do you think that maybe these are nutritional and or diffusion adaptations? IE perhaps more flow facillitates higher diffusion rates so the polyps can minimize surface area?

 

[Meisen]

As far as the question of too much flow, I think its a given that that can happen. There are certainly areas in the ocean where zoanthids do not grow. In the wild, I have observed them to be quite plentiful in shallow areas with moderate to low flow levels. In channels where flow was significantly higher at roughly the same light levels, they were non-existant. Of course in nature there could be a million other factors involved too (competition from other species, predation etc).

In our tanks, I think that we have to experiment with each individual type (not just following the protopalyzoanthus/palyzoanthus/zoanthus seperation) to find out what works with a general trend being that zoas prefer calmer flow levels than many sps-dominated tanks provide. As we see more people running 100X and above for turnover, I think we will near levels of water movement (speedwise at least, not actual flow of course) that are above what many shallow-water and lagunal corals can tolerate.