Made2Rock
Member
I'm an Oracle Database Administrator. It just isn't any fun waiting.
A Reefaholic's 1000+ Gallon Mixed Reef System Build
- Thread starter Dustin1300
- Start date
I'm an Oracle Database Administrator. It just isn't any fun waiting.
Dustin1300
Reefaholic
Could really use an Oracle/SQL DBA on my team at work in the coming months...I need some reefer support at work:lmao:
Dustin1300
Reefaholic
About 1.5 hours east. I'm just on the north side of Indianapolis.
Dustin1300
Reefaholic
I went ahead and upgraded. Second base module ready should something go awry. It's nice as you can set up dashboard with widgets exactly where you want them. I have lights, pumps, heaters, etc all organized in a better organized way and the frag QT separate too. Really not much outside of the dashboard has been updated from what I can see so far.
Here's a shot of my "current dashboard".
Here's a shot of my "current dashboard".
Dustin1300
Reefaholic
Dan, sent a PM back just now.
Dustin1300
Reefaholic
Hope all is still going well for you Steve. I love the widget, but not sure if I'll add a camera or not. I wish it would support a PTZ camera but only supports fixed which is not Neptunes fault since no networking company would actually come with a standard.
Even if everyone could come to a common ground I'm sure Cisco would come up with something proprietary:headwally:
Dustin1300
Reefaholic
I plan to figure out where all the sockets are for electrical this weekend and go ahead and pick up PVC and outlet boxes to start running them and get 12-2 wiring ran. Anyone think I'd have issues if I ran the Apex USB wires along with the power wires in the PVC with the power? Think it'd be a cause of concern with signal disruption?
Made2Rock
Member
This is a very complicated topic so let me start with the basics.
Current going thru a wire creates a magnetic field.
A magnetic field crossing a wire induces a current in the wire.
So yes one circuit can create "noise" that will distrub another circuit.
There are ways of fighting this and some cables do that. A cable that is a twisted pair will end up getting a equal amount of signal coupled into both wires and they cancel each other out. You'll also find cables that have the pairs of wires shielded. This is intended to fight this problem.
So what happens when you run wires together.... If it is your main pump it creates a large field that is able to cause a lot of trouble. On the other hand if it is a little powerhead the field produced is very small and will have a hard time causing anybody any trouble.
My guess, and I do not have a controller, is to just keep those items that use a lot of power away from the signal cable for the controller.
I do a xmas light show and have a good 100 amps running around the yard and cat 5 cables trying to talk to the different modules and I do have some trouble but I have found a 6" spacing fixes most of my problems.
One more thing PVC will not block a magnetic field.
Hope this helped.
Joe
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Dustin1300
Reefaholic
Joe, not quite the response I expected and did not see this yesterday. The wiring is Cat5e UTP but was just curious if others thought they would disrupt. I might post this in the Neptune forum and see if others have ran the wires with power.
dave.m
Active member
I used to run cable for Ethernet LANs and I can assure you Made2Rock is quite right. The same thing happens when people are running wire for sound systems, which I have also done: power cables cause noise in signal cables.
The simple rule of thumb is to keep the two types of wiring well away from each other. It may be too expensive for you to organize and run your cables through conduit, but you can still separate and bundle the two types of wire and keep their paths from crossing and well away from each other.
Dave.M
The simple rule of thumb is to keep the two types of wiring well away from each other. It may be too expensive for you to organize and run your cables through conduit, but you can still separate and bundle the two types of wire and keep their paths from crossing and well away from each other.
Dave.M
Dustin1300
Reefaholic
When running the cables can you cross them over one another? It has been a while since I had a networking class on cables and all the standards for running wire. I want to say that the recommendation was if they cross each other that they be perpendicular and not parallel?
dave.m
Active member
You can cross power cables with power cables and signal cables with signal cables, but try to keep power cables and signal cables as far apart as possible. It is proximity, not crossing, that will cause signal disruption, as explained by Made2Rock.Dustin1300 said:
Dave.M
Made2Rock
Member
Dustin,
Dave is right. you just want to try and keep these the "heavy juice" items away from the signal cables. What you want to do is to keep that magnetic field of one away from the other. If the wires have to cross then they have to cross but try and put space between them. I'm sure theApex has a reasonable tolerance to noice but you can help it out by keeping power cables away from those CAT5 cables.
Believe me, if you end up with a noise problem you'll have something that is odd and hard to put your finger on what is happening. Posting questions to others that do have an Apex will give you a good feeling on how well the Apex can tolerate these issues.
Joe
Dave is right. you just want to try and keep these the "heavy juice" items away from the signal cables. What you want to do is to keep that magnetic field of one away from the other. If the wires have to cross then they have to cross but try and put space between them. I'm sure theApex has a reasonable tolerance to noice but you can help it out by keeping power cables away from those CAT5 cables.
Believe me, if you end up with a noise problem you'll have something that is odd and hard to put your finger on what is happening. Posting questions to others that do have an Apex will give you a good feeling on how well the Apex can tolerate these issues.
Joe
Dustin1300
Reefaholic
Thanks AJ. Once I have water in the tank I plan to caulk around the inner rim between the platform and stand, followed by a thick coat of bartop on the top of the platform to keep any chances of wood rot, paint flake, and so forth minimal in the future. With the height of the stand and calculating volume it'd hold comes out to 35 gallons. Once I wrap up the basement finishing in the next couple weeks we'll be getting floor finished in basement. I want stained concrete with a nice slick finish but the wife insists we keep carpet in basement so with new carpet would really like to prevent any spills!
Dustin1300
Reefaholic
Dave and Joe, I really appreciate the advice. I've been doing some reading and typical home theater installations signal is operating at 2.83 volts. The Apex works at 12 volts....I'm not an electrical engineer but would guess that this 9+ volts should help to drive that signal and not disrupt as easily. I'll let you know what I find out on Neptune thread
Made2Rock
Member
Dave and Joe, I really appreciate the advice. I've been doing some reading and typical home theater installations signal is operating at 2.83 volts. The Apex works at 12 volts....I'm not an electrical engineer but would guess that this 9+ volts should help to drive that signal and not disrupt as easily. I'll let you know what I find out on Neptune thread
Dustin,
I do have a background in creating process control computer systems in the steel industry. I have seen the "noise" from motors blown up components the size of a hockey puck (and yes it was a motor, a BIG motor). Your aquarium is a tiny faction of the steel industry but the problem is real and there are other factors I left out of the picture to simply it. The big factor here is the impedence of the circuit carring the small signal. To use the stereo equipment as an example. Trying to cause trouble with the speaker cable is very hard to do BUT trying to cause trouble with the input to the amp is not that hard to do. The reason being is the speakers have a low impedence compared to the input of the amp so it takes a whole lot more "noise" to cause trouble with the speakers. My point here is to be careful mixing different environments (AC and signals). I can tell you that the impedence of your probes is extremely high and they take a lot of care in the cables they use on them for this reason. So while your apex may use 12 volts a small change of only a few millivolts may cause a .5 change in your pH.
Again, Neptune did a good job of with Apex but I wouldn't invite trouble by running the heavier circuits with the signal cables.
FYI - I am hoping to build a system about your size next year and do plan on using an Apex. First thank you for asking the question because I didn't think about noise. Here is what I will end up doing.
-- I will try and keep some distance between the cat5 and AC lines (basically I I will have 2 groups cat5 and AC lines). To me 6"-12" spacing will be fine but more will be better.
-- If they have to cross I'm not going to loose sleep over it but I will try to keep that spacing the best I can and make the cross this like this + where they cross and get back away from each other.
Basically why ask for trouble if you can put some space in there go for it.
Let me know what you find out from the Apex users
Joe
