Algae Scrubber Basics

[srusso]

I have been washing it with tap water during my weekly cleanings. Do you think that I should clean it more than once a week for a while?

That may help, also you could get a mandarin... I am guessing you dont have any fish that eat copepods? A sixline can also work...

Also vacuum your sump, and suck up as much of everything as you can. Then replace with fresh salt water.

 

[Travis1787]

My first try didn't go to well my pump is a mag 5 (500gph) my size screen would require 350 gph seemed like the flow was too much was flowing out way to much out one side of sreen not not as much on other side and on the end of the cut for the screen water was squirting out ... due to my space the water goes out of the sump don't don't if this is from the flow being to heavy or my cut maybe a tad to wide.

 

[srusso]

My first try didn't go to well my pump is a mag 5 (500gph) my size screen would require 350 gph seemed like the flow was too much was flowing out way to much out one side of sreen not not as much on other side and on the end of the cut for the screen water was squirting out ... due to my space the water goes out of the sump don't don't if this is from the flow being to heavy or my cut maybe a tad to wide.

Yeah, cutting your slot tube is the hardest part of making a scrubber. My suggestion would be to plan on cutting a few, then choose the best one. After the second try you will naturally figure out a technique and the third/fourth will be better than the others. Even if you think your second one looks fine do the third and forth anyway.

 

[Travis1787]

Do u want the cut to be as snug on the screen as possible or have some space on either side of the screen?

 

[JJ Ocean]

Well, I finally finished my ATS about 2 weeks ago and just got around to posting pics of it. Pics of it during the build are posted earlier in this thread. Overall, pretty pleased with how it turned out.

Overhead shot with the wet box sitting inside the dry box. You can see the two 1" bulk heads on the bottom. Spray bar & mesh are out of this shot.

Here the spray bar and mesh are inserted. The top lid and closing latch are not installed.

Here's a shot with it fully assembled as it runs (minus the union attached to the spray bar). I added a latch on the top in the middle that wasn't part of the original design. It was added to ensure the wet & dry box stay tightly together. A big goal of my design was to keep the light as contained as possible, so I can run this off photo-period from my DT (help keep Ph up at night). I have other tanks in my sump room with clown pairs and growing juveniles, so I don't want to light them up all night. ATS lights run 8pm - 2pm.

Here's a shot with it installed above my sump running. As you can see it is tight, but works as designed (top of pic, just right of center). It is fed from one of my manifold valves off of my main hammerhead pump.

Final shot of my mesh after 2 weeks. I did "seed" it with some algae that was growing in one of my tanks. Pretty much smeared it all over. No way to really tell if it accelerated the process since I don't have a "control" screen that I did not do this to, but logic leads me to believe it helped speed up the growth.

I'll post pics of the mesh further down the road.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Do u want the cut to be as snug on the screen as possible or have some space on either side of the screen?

You want a 1/8" wide slot. The screen material is roughly 1/16", maybe a bit less. You want the section of the screen inserted into the slot tube to be smooth - do not rough that part up. The screen should definitely not be snug to the slot cut. If this is the case then this is your problem. The water getting squirted at the end of the tube is an indication of this, and the water arcing across the screen at the source end would also indicate this.

 

[srusso]

Here you go, this is how you build your slot tube.

This should help... it was taken from this document which also explains building an ATS.

www.radio-media.com/fish/AlgaeScrubbers.doc

"Construction:

Pipe: A basic algae scrubber starts out with a ¾" (1.88 cm) pvc pipe, with a 1/8" (3mm) slot cut along the length of it (the slot is only on the bottom side; it does not go through to the top side). Mark the slot with a marker, and cut it with a Dremel or similar power tool:

Cutting this slot is actually the only hard part of building an algae scrubber. If you don't think you can do it, just ask another hobbiest to do it for you; a cabinet maker or model builder could also do it. It will probably take a few tries, so give yourself some time and some extra pipe to get it right. As a last resort, you could try using a drill to make a series of 1/8" holes really close together, and then use a file to open them all up into a slot. "

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

I set the tank up just a few weeks before the scrubber and used old live rock I had in my refugium for my 100 gallon tank (probably has been in the fuge for 2 or more years). At the time they did not have any algae on them but with in a few weeks they were covered, this is why I set up the scrubber. I dosed the iron due to the yellow color of the algae on my screen and now that u say it I was probably just feeding the algae in the display, so I will stop dosing completely. I have harvested a little at a time but will now do it on a regular basis. I do have a lot of flow in the display, because my return pump is a little too big for this tank, but is doing it's job and I don't want to have to buy a new one. I will definitely give all your (and srusso's) tips a try and I really appreaciate the advice.

I WILL BEAT THIS ALGAE!!!!!!:hammer:

So this rock came from a refugium - was the refugium provided light and did you grow macro algae or anything else in there?

I have been reading a bit more trying to figure out your problem. From what I now understand, it seems likely that your DT algae is eating up all the iron, and it may actually take more iron to get the screen to start taking over. But, before you do that, please tell me everything about your tank, including fish, corals, amount of LR, and if you can, post a few pictures.

Also, have you actually measured your screen flow, or are you just estimating by going off pump specs and calculations?

Post this info and we'll go from there.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Overhead shot with the wet box sitting inside the dry box. You can see the two 1" bulk heads on the bottom. Spray bar & mesh are out of this shot.

JJ, I have to warn you that you are going to experience problems with your inside box. That thing is going to warp like nuts, that's what mine did. The clear sides are going to bow outwards and probably have already started. Eventually it will get to the point where you cannot easily remove the box, because you won't be able to slide it out or lift it out. Cross-bracing fixes the problem (like an external eurobrace). But for your lift-out design I don't see an easy solution.

You might cut a notch on either side of the top of the light box and then get a mini bar clamp in there. That way it will still want to warp, but the clamp will keep the shape so you can get it in and out.

 

[pskelton]

Jeremy,

Do you only have light on one side of your screen? Thats what it looks like in the picture. If that is the case you will get a lot better results if you light both sides.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Yes, I forgot to mention that also. Thanks PS. A tank that has lots of DT algae needs a scrubber that can overpower it. Adding a light to the other side and increasing the flow as much as possible will help. Both of these could be temporary solutions, after the DT algae is gone it may not come back.

 

[JJ Ocean]

JJ, I have to warn you that you are going to experience problems with your inside box. That thing is going to warp like nuts, that's what mine did. The clear sides are going to bow outwards and probably have already started. Eventually it will get to the point where you cannot easily remove the box, because you won't be able to slide it out or lift it out. Cross-bracing fixes the problem (like an external eurobrace). But for your lift-out design I don't see an easy solution.

You might cut a notch on either side of the top of the light box and then get a mini bar clamp in there. That way it will still want to warp, but the clamp will keep the shape so you can get it in and out.

Floyd - thanks for the input. I have had zero warping to date, but I will keep tabs on it. If it was going to warp I think I would have seen signs of it already with 6 t5 lights running for 2 weeks. I only have 1/16th clearance on each side, so it wouldn't take much for me to notice. I also mounted fans in the box, so my internal temps may not have been what you experienced. To be honest, the design puts pressure on all the edges - including the top. The clear acrylic is essentially "pinched" by the dry box on all edges. The gap you see in the one pic you quoted completely goes away with the latch - that's the weight of the lights on the dry box flexing outward. The oustide "latch" also holds and puts pressure on the whole compartment - kind of like a cross brace. Warping is also very dependent on the clear acrylic thickness and the temp it is exposed to.

Again, I'll keep an eye on it and let you know how it goes. You are right though - warping is the biggest concern in a 2 box design.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

I see...I took another look at the pics. Still it would be something to keep an eye on. It looks like the top of the light casing on either side is in contact with the top edge of the inside box, then a 'clip' holds the light casing against the inner box. Is this what I am seeing?

You're right though, the fans might help keep everything cool. Acrylic tend to warp away from water (the wet side expands) and the heat on the other side would cause thermal expansion, so maybe providing air circulation as you makes a nice balance point and nothing happens.

Nice looking design by the way.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

JJ, what light fixtures did you use? I looked back at your older posts, looks like a retrofit kit?

 

[JJ Ocean]

I see...I took another look at the pics. Still it would be something to keep an eye on. It looks like the top of the light casing on either side is in contact with the top edge of the inside box, then a 'clip' holds the light casing against the inner box. Is this what I am seeing?

Yes, that's what you are seeing & what I tried to describe. The lights are Sun Blaze T5 HO light strips from sunlight supply. I also purchased the reflectors. You can actually daisy chain 10 together if you want. I just daisy chained each side of 3 together. The core application for these lights that I have seen is for lighting LFS's stock tanks. Great for lighting rows of tanks. I'll see how they do for ATS.

 

[jeremy-40]

So this rock came from a refugium - was the refugium provided light and did you grow macro algae or anything else in there?

I have been reading a bit more trying to figure out your problem. From what I now understand, it seems likely that your DT algae is eating up all the iron, and it may actually take more iron to get the screen to start taking over. But, before you do that, please tell me everything about your tank, including fish, corals, amount of LR, and if you can, post a few pictures.

Also, have you actually measured your screen flow, or are you just estimating by going off pump specs and calculations?

Post this info and we'll go from there.

Yes the live rock was in a fuge with macro growing,but did not have any algae on it when I first put it in the new tank. My tank is a 20 long lit with a 150 w metal halide. The 20 overflows into a 10 gallon set up under the display. The scrubber is fed from the overflow right now. I have about 20 lbs of live rock. 1 small maroon clown and a small bi color basslet (think thats what his name is). Coral in the tank: some green mushrooms, candycane coral, a few rics, hammer coral, monti, small birds nest, an open brain coral, a small toad stool leather, and an orange plate, and a few zoa's.

I have not checked the flow I know it's more than enough. The pump is a quiet one 2200 and I have to throttle it back due to too much flow a cross the screen. At the time there is more flow on this screen than on my other scrubber on my 100 gallon tank ( which is doing great).

Jeremy,

Do you only have light on one side of your screen? Thats what it looks like in the picture. If that is the case you will get a lot better results if you light both sides.

Screen is now only lit from one side and due to space I don't think I can light it from both sides.

Before:

After:

sorry the pictures are not the best, but the only camera I have right now is my IPhone. I know the tank looks horrible!!!!!

 

[srusso]

IMHO that is rock leeching P04... My rock has/had the same problem. It takes time for it to completely release, and a lot of people give up on rock and buy new. However I think its completely unnecessary, to do so... from the look of it the algae is slowly dieing on that rock. I tested this in my tank by going to the only LFS I really trust. (high-end store) Brought a piece of live rock from them popped it in my tank and in 3+ months it still doesn't have a lick of algae on it... Only a few patches left on my original problematic rock, it think its taken longer in my tank because of my extremely ghetto scrubber.... which is both flow and light deprived.... Still need to fix that....

 

[srusso]

Additionally, I now feel that your scrubber is working as designed. IMO you should clean your algae scrubber twice a week till the balance shifts to the screen. New growth uses more "fuel" then to maintain existing growth, so by cleaning more often your forcing more growth on the screen. It will help a lot if you keep the DT lighting to a minimum without messing with the corals too much. Just my 2 cents... I will post a pic of the test rock I am basing my opinion off of... The worst part is, you will never hear this from a LFS, all they say is... "oh sounds like you need this stuff..." or "we sell live rock for x dollars"

 

[jeremy-40]

srusso

I agree the rock is probably leaching and I agree my scrubber is working, but since its not growing green I feel it's not working as efficiently as it should. I don't get any hair algae on it at all, its more of a yellow, spongy type algea. I think if I get the scrubber to grow true green hair algae it would starve the algae on the live rock. I will try and clean it more often to see if it helps. Thanks again for the help!

 

[jeremy-40]

Here are some pictures at cleaning time, today. Don't let the picture fool you it looks a little green in the picture but it's more yellow. Its actually pretty thick this week and really feels kind of like wool. I just want it to be green maybe I am just being too picky. I only did a light cleaning today(lightly with my finger tips). I also pulled a very thick piece of hair algae from the display and threaded through two of the holes in the screen. This is only a test to see what happens with some green colored algae.