Alkalinity won't rise

[jasonmartin1313]

Hi all I'm at a loss and struggling to agree with what I'm reading online. I have a 450 gallon heavy mixed reef. I swapped from seachem products to BRS.i also added a trident with DOS at the same time. My Alk just keeps dropping despite upping the Alk more and more. I read in several places that overdosing can have this same effect yet I struggle to believe, but I give in. I just turned off dosing all together and started heating water for a water change tomorrow. I confirmed the trident readings with Hanna tests, they are close. What is going on? For background, I was dosing 3 cups seachem diluted in 2.5 gallons of water each, of which 117ml per day of calcium and Alk. Now on BRS I just kept upping the dosing as the Alk kept dropping. 150 ml of soda ash per day up until pulling the plug just now.

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[hegeh]

How are you dosing them? Are you adding them all 117ml at once?which may cause precipitation..
What are your Mg level at?

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[bertoni]

Is that 150 ml of the supplement solution? That should raise the dKH by about 0.7 units, assuming about 300 g of actual water in the system. This calculator might help with picking doses:

http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html

I would start by measuring the alkalinity of 5g of fresh seawater, and then dosing it up by 3 dKH or so, using the calculator to pick the dose, and see what the alkalinity kit has to say. Have you tried measuring 15-20 minutes after dosing? Do you have an estimate of the actual volume of water in the system?

Were you mixing the alkalinity and calcium parts together? That will cause them to precipitate to form sand.

 

[jasonmartin1313]

How are you dosing them? Are you adding them all 117ml at once?which may cause precipitation..
What are your Mg level at?

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I am using the DOS, it's Neptune's dosing pump, so spread over 24 hours. Mg is in the picture, currently 1404 and calcium 440. Alk 7.18


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[jasonmartin1313]

Is that 150 ml of the supplement solution? That should raise the dKH by about 0.7 units, assuming about 300 g of actual water in the system. This calculator might help with picking doses:

http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html

I would start by measuring the alkalinity of 5g of fresh seawater, and then dosing it up by 3 dKH or so, using the calculator to pick the dose, and see what the alkalinity kit has to say. Have you tried measuring 15-20 minutes after dosing? Do you have an estimate of the actual volume of water in the system?

Were you mixing the alkalinity and calcium parts together? That will cause them to precipitate to form sand.

I like the reality check with a bucket I'll try that, thanks


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[five.five-six]

That 20 year old calculator is still my go-to.

I'm so glad they haven't changed it. I'm nostalgic that way.

Is that 150 ml of the supplement solution? That should raise the dKH by about 0.7 units, assuming about 300 g of actual water in the system. This calculator might help with picking doses:

http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html

I would start by measuring the alkalinity of 5g of fresh seawater, and then dosing it up by 3 dKH or so, using the calculator to pick the dose, and see what the alkalinity kit has to say. Have you tried measuring 15-20 minutes after dosing? Do you have an estimate of the actual volume of water in the system?

Were you mixing the alkalinity and calcium parts together? That will cause them to precipitate to form sand.

 

[mrtint]

Hi all I'm at a loss and struggling to agree with what I'm reading online. I have a 450 gallon heavy mixed reef. I swapped from seachem products to BRS.i also added a trident with DOS at the same time. My Alk just keeps dropping despite upping the Alk more and more. I read in several places that overdosing can have this same effect yet I struggle to believe, but I give in. I just turned off dosing all together and started heating water for a water change tomorrow. I confirmed the trident readings with Hanna tests, they are close. What is going on? For background, I was dosing 3 cups seachem diluted in 2.5 gallons of water each, of which 117ml per day of calcium and Alk. Now on BRS I just kept upping the dosing as the Alk kept dropping. 150 ml of soda ash per day up until pulling the plug just now.

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When you up your ALK are you upping you CA dose also?
The numbers on the Trident reading aren't bad. What ALK are you trying to achieve? I run 8 ALK 450 CA and 1350 MAG.
The testing on trident appear to be 1/2 of where you started? Am I wrong? Is the drop in that screen shot over weeks or hours?

On a different note....... how do you like the trident[emoji16] I have one but am being lazy to hook it up. I have a apex classic with 4 EB 8's and 3 modules. I don't want to spend a day reprogramming my new Apex (still in box) so I can add the trident[emoji23][emoji23]


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[jasonmartin1313]

I have been dropping the calc significantly and upping the Alk significantly, not adding anything else. Hopefully this graph makes sense. I do like the Teident, it took a few days to become more accurate. It makes really nice graphs and ideally will control the dosing once I can straighten this out.

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[jasonmartin1313]

That 20 year old calculator is still my go-to.



I'm so glad they haven't changed it. I'm nostalgic that way.

Thanks to your idea I figured it out I believe...I'm running a QT tank so I've been taking water out of the DT every other day. It turns out my 275 gallon storage salt water is low on alk, it measures 7.6dkh. So here I am fighting the DT but adding 40+ gallons of flat water every other day. I've never measured my reef crystals mixes other than SG. I guess I'll have to start...

I started by taking 5 gallons out of DT, testing alk, then adding BRS to it and it worked so I knew I was chasing the wrong thing. Thanks for the help all, hopefully I got this.


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[five.five-six]

Thanks to your idea I figured it out I believe...I'm running a QT tank so I've been taking water out of the DT every other day. It turns out my 275 gallon storage salt water is low on alk, it measures 7.6dkh. So here I am fighting the DT but adding 40+ gallons of flat water every other day. I've never measured my reef crystals mixes other than SG. I guess I'll have to start...

I started by taking 5 gallons out of DT, testing alk, then adding BRS to it and it worked so I knew I was chasing the wrong thing. Thanks for the help all, hopefully I got this.


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Reef crystals are lower in alkalinity the reason being so that the advanced Aquarius can adjust the alkalinity to their liking. It's much more difficult to lower alkalinity than it is to raise it freshly mixed water.

 

[jasonmartin1313]

Well 7.6 is a far cry from 12 that I found online here. I have 100 gallons left. Curious to see what the next batch produces now that I have an eye out for it.

Anyone else have a fresh batch of reef crystals that they care to measure the ALK?


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[bertoni]

7.6 is too low for Reef Crystals, I think. That sounds like the salt settled badly in shipment, or a problematic batch. I don't think that Reef Crystals has ever been that low, as far as the target levels from the manufacturer.