Anthias ?'s

[UCReefer]

So i recently purchased what i was told to be five female lyretail anthias'. Today after gazing at my tank for an abnormally long period of time attempting to pick out which one would turn male(im pretty sure i found the dom one) I started to realize that all but one have elongated dorsal fins and of out of those four they all have longer tail spines as well. They are all colored as females but they also seem to be more pink/purple than most pics i can find, somewhat resembling male colors however none have the classic red spot on the pectoral fin..

After doing research on differences between male and fem lyretails, im starting to think i was sold a bunch of submales or dom females(not sure there is a difference)

Iv already noticed some aggression between the submales which i originally chalked up to pecking order and them figuring out whose the boss but now im starting to get a little concerned.

Also the only one that doesnt have the long dorsal spine seems to be far more shy than the rest.

Basically im wondering whether or not the group will work, or if they will just kill each other over time. The pictures below i pulled off google to attempt to better describe how mine look.

Thanks in advance RC

 

[TankStudy]

If they are similar to the ones in the pictures, those are females. Male lyres and sub-males will be closer to an almost red color. I have many females that are a reddish orange but none display that extra long spines a male would have.

 

[UCReefer]

Mine are more purple bodied with a fade to red towards the dorsal fin. Basically their top half is as red as the top of the dorsal fin in the second pic. But your saying that the long spike on the dorsal doesnt necessarily mean there male right?

Ill try to get pics tonight

 

[UCReefer]

Also the spines on mine are the same length as the ones in the pics

 

[Reefnub]

You have males and sub-males. Also, male lyretail's coloration ranges from red to a purplish color depending on region.
As long as their dorsal fin isn't fully developed, they're considered female or sub-males.
Should be fine. Only way to find out if everything will be ok is when one turns full male.

 

[woodnaquanut]

You might take a look at this thread:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2292641

I know nothing about Anthias, but looking at the pics of male and females on LA site, any elongation of the dorsal spine seems like you are getting all the females to transition to males.

 

[UCReefer]

Interesting thread, from my observations the breakdown of the harem is 1 soon to be male submale, 3 submales, 1 female. The female is definitely the most shy and timid, runs when i walk by and tends to hide while the others are swimming. While the soon to be male seems to be acting the part. The 3 submales dont seem to be too aggresive and once again "seem" to be acting like females but the fins and coloring really rub me the wrong way..

All in all it seems like it may work out i just wish there was one male, one submale, and the other three female but hopefully it will work out.

Do you guys think that the male will change colors still besides the pectoral red spot? I was really excited to watch the transformation now im starting to think he wont even look all that different... My camera phone is broken but im tryin to get some pics for u guys. Thanks again for the help

 

[woodnaquanut]

How long have you had these fish? 'TankStudy' says it takes three weeks for the transformation.

If you do have 1 female, 1 male and 3 submales it might be best to get rid of the three submales and let the male and female become dominate. Then look for some submissive females to add later.

Any chance you can return them to the store you got them from?

 

[UCReefer]

only for a week. I have 4 submales(ones with the dorsal spike) and one female right now, they all have the same coloring. The way one of the submales is acting leads me to believe that he will be the one to transfer to male.

I suppose i could wait for him to make the full transfer then reassess the situation from there. I have a feeling i will end up having to take the submales back but idk.

 

[falconut]

Not sure exactly what sex they are, but a while ago, I purchased two females and the larger one changed to what you have there. The two lived together fine, it never changed to a full male look, just like your photos.

 

[UCReefer]

damn thats what im scared of.. Well i guess i will know after a few more weeks whether or not one will go full male. If it doesnt then i guess the store just sold me four out of five males which is pretty lame..

Falconut Do you still have the anthias? how long after you bought them did it change? Also did the female have the same coloring as the male? What makes me have faith that they may not be all males is that the one without the dorsal spike(def female) still has same coloration as the rest with the spike.. But thanks for the input i appreciate it.

 

[UCReefer]

I was able to take a few pics, not the best cause the anthias are apparently camera shy as hell lol and my sailfin thinks hes a star. but it should give u guys a better idea.

And whats with the crazy low upload file size... had to downgrade the crap out of the pics...

 

[Reefnub]

I was able to take a few pics, not the best cause the anthias are apparently camera shy as hell lol and my sailfin thinks hes a star. but it should give u guys a better idea.

And whats with the crazy low upload file size... had to downgrade the crap out of the pics...

They actually all look like sub-males transitioning to male. The tail is becoming like a male already and if they have a dorsal fin I would consider these as 70% male. Just waiting on coloration to fully develop and the tail to become full lyretail

Then again I could be wrong ; )

 

[UCReefer]

ya looks like im gonna have to make a fish trap... also the lfs is gonna be getting a call here pretty soon lol. and ya the four with the dorsal fin also have the long pointed tails....

 

[UCReefer]

Well i found a few other threads on this topic and since it seems like there isnt really that much info on this subject i figured i would post them here to hopefully help the next guy.. Seems like there is a possibility that my harem of 1 female 3 submales and 1 male might work though there is also the chance it wont so idk... Ill try to keep the thread updated and get some cool pics of the transformation too.
Thanks again rc

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1531326

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=972936&highlight=lyretail+anthias+male

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1981727

There is some good info in there as well as some really cool pics of the actual transition from female to male

 

[ser_renely]

Thanks for the info.

I have three lyretails that I got about 2-3 months ago. They were small when I got them. I assumed they were females. One was a barely larger. Recently that one started to grow a bigger than the other two. It is darker with a small spike on its fin. No change to it other than that though, no spot on the pectoral fins.

I'll probably post my own post, bc I have a number of question on them.

 

[UCReefer]

ya just for an update on mine, One seems to be turning male but like yours still hasn't changed color on body or fin. Though his dorsal spike seems to be longer than it originally was.

Have you been noticing aggression? For me it seems like a pecking order but they do chase each other around from time to time. Almost always being started by the "most male".

I was really excited to watch the color change but i'm not sure if mine will as iv heard in certain situations they will stay dom submale and not turn full male. Will keep this thread updated and please post any other good threads on the anthias here as well as a link to yours if u started one. Thanks

 

[ser_renely]

More aggression than before, I think. A lot of dive bombing and buzzing the other two. The larges has a nick on his tail as does the smallest. I see a lot of activity at night and in the morning, not dominance but some sort of interaction.

The largest is not as dominant as I would have thought....but I guess I don't know what the lyretail does as dominance.

 

[ser_renely]

Here are some pictures of mine. How do they correlate with yours?

Largest is top right, can see the colour diff.

in center

size difference

Close up of largest.

 

[UCReefer]

The females look very similar but your male definitely has more color change happening so far, they look like their doing great.

I just got back from a trip and mine haven't changed much but the biggest one may be a little larger than before. Also after only watchin the tank for a day it seems that they are more comfortable with each other now though im not sure if that is just a fluke.