Something to consider regarding big groups of bartletts in captivity:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1132189
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1132189
Anthias
- Thread starter TampaReefer79
- Start date
elegance coral
They call me EC
Same thing in my tank. Right now, I only have one sub male, or female turning male, lyretail and one midas. I noticed the midas harassing the anthia a little bit, but didn't think much of it. Then I noticed the pectoral fins on the anthias are tattered a bit on the edges. I was hoping that getting several female anthias would spread the aggression out or stop it. How many lyretails do you have?
Two females and one male, but honestly, he gets into spats with all the anthias species. He's kind of a jerk
sanchoy
New member
375 gallons is plenty of room to add more than 1 male per species. Again, try to stay at least at 1-10 ratio of male/female.
From my experience, anthias will automatically create their own social network of pecking order. Where the weakest will not survive. The strong will control the weak and the weak will control the weakest. To the point of death to a few depending on how many anthias there is. Example: you have 10 anthias. all 9 will attack the weakest 1. Taking 9 blows from other fish everywhere you go creates a highly stressful environment. After awhile the weakest one will hide and be reluctant to come in the open to get food. The weakest one will become even weaker and die.
From my experience, anthias will automatically create their own social network of pecking order. Where the weakest will not survive. The strong will control the weak and the weak will control the weakest. To the point of death to a few depending on how many anthias there is. Example: you have 10 anthias. all 9 will attack the weakest 1. Taking 9 blows from other fish everywhere you go creates a highly stressful environment. After awhile the weakest one will hide and be reluctant to come in the open to get food. The weakest one will become even weaker and die.
elegance coral
They call me EC
Two females and one male, but honestly, he gets into spats with all the anthias species. He's kind of a jerk
LOL Have you noticed any damage to the anthias?
I had one back in the day that didn't bother anyone. It just hung out in it's favorite hole in the rocks. I got this one about two weeks ago and she's a nasty little fish. She's always out in the open, and she even bites me every time I put my hand in the tank.
TampaReefer79
Premium Member
Good info folks! Would the anthias be most comfortable without ANY large fish in the tank? Or would a tang or 2 make them group up tighter?
And how would you purchase them? 25 at once, or buy them in waves? I guess I could qt them in a 150 gal rubbermaid tank, or my 6' 180 qt but think either option might be too small. Maybe I can buy 10 at a time and qt them?
And how would you purchase them? 25 at once, or buy them in waves? I guess I could qt them in a 150 gal rubbermaid tank, or my 6' 180 qt but think either option might be too small. Maybe I can buy 10 at a time and qt them?
IME the species discussed here so far are fine with large fish.
While all at once is ideal, realistically, it's not always possible. Just buy females each time, and you should be OK. You will have the squabbles, and some losses here and there... I think that is inevitable.
TampaReefer79
Premium Member
Peter: The link you provided is a good read so far. I read the whole first page, with the rest left for later as I am on my way out the door...my better half is scowling at me as I type this...but was wondering about this idea from jmaneyapanda:
"I kept five in a heavily stocked 120 for a while. I bought all five from a LFS and they were all very small (1.5 "). One turned into a male and they stayed that way for about 2 years. When I got my 210, I put them in, and they all turned male, and started picking each other off, until now I have 0. Perhaps it was totally conincidental, but I think is does have to do with densities and heirarchies. In my 120, they females couldnt avoid the male. But in the 210, there was room, and I think biology defeats common sense. The "urge" to become a male was greater than the sense to stay a female and stay alive."
Maybe I can avoid the females changing into males by overcrowding them? Also, what kind of live rock structure makes them feel at home?
"I kept five in a heavily stocked 120 for a while. I bought all five from a LFS and they were all very small (1.5 "). One turned into a male and they stayed that way for about 2 years. When I got my 210, I put them in, and they all turned male, and started picking each other off, until now I have 0. Perhaps it was totally conincidental, but I think is does have to do with densities and heirarchies. In my 120, they females couldnt avoid the male. But in the 210, there was room, and I think biology defeats common sense. The "urge" to become a male was greater than the sense to stay a female and stay alive."
Maybe I can avoid the females changing into males by overcrowding them? Also, what kind of live rock structure makes them feel at home?
elegance coral
They call me EC
I hope I'm not stepping on your toes Tampareefer. Maybe you would like to know the answer to this as well.
How long does it take for a female to turn male?
How long does it take for a female to turn male?
TampaReefer79
Premium Member
Not at all EC. I've never owned an anthia and would actually like to know about them BEFORE I do. 
I've had Bartletts get along with Bicolors, Olives, and Borbonius. My biggest problem, in fact, was the Bartletts getting along with themselves given their propensity to turn male and then wreak havoc upon each other, not to mention several of the corals by chasing one another repeatedly into them. That said, out of an original shoal of 12, my last one finally died early this year at age 9. I replaced them with a shoal of 17 Bimacs but found I missed the Bartletss so I added 9 small ones. The Bimacs slaughtered all but one of them within days. Lesson learned there.
I currently maintain 15 Bimacs (2 males, 1 blind in one eye from aggression, 1 other male killed, one female died of 'natural causes'), 1 Olive, 2 Borbonius, and one little Bartlett who desperately tries to convince the Bimacs that he's one of them.
I'd like to add a few more of a different species but I don't know which.
I currently maintain 15 Bimacs (2 males, 1 blind in one eye from aggression, 1 other male killed, one female died of 'natural causes'), 1 Olive, 2 Borbonius, and one little Bartlett who desperately tries to convince the Bimacs that he's one of them.
I'd like to add a few more of a different species but I don't know which.
tom obrecht
Active member
If I can add my $.02...you should easily add 20-25 no problem in a 375. I think some consideration should be taken on what kind of tank you are planning. As some of you know I had roughly 50 anthias of various species in a 260. Would I recommend adding that many fish to a system that size...no. I did however have an addiction at that time :spin2: and kept adding different species. I fed a ton and the fish did well. The tank had all softies and the corals seemed to like the feedings and did just fine with the added nutrients. Not sure in todays super clean sps systems you could feed that heavy and get by with it. I think you could add a number of different species in say groups of 4-5 and have a great display of fish.
TampaReefer79
Premium Member
Seriously?
LamboBoy
New member
Last week I added 1 male and 6 female Lyretails in my 55g QT. There were some squables between females but no big deal. Four days later I added 3 more females and noticed more vicious fighting than before but that settled down 2 days later. Planning to add to my 300 DT after observation and if needed treatment.
Curious to see how they behave once in a bigger tank and how long they will hide since they are relatively small compared to the fish I already have in the tank. Will keep you posted.
I agree that you should get all females and let them figure out which one or ones wants to turn into males. Expect extra fighting if you add more females into a tank that already has females like mine did.
Curious to see how they behave once in a bigger tank and how long they will hide since they are relatively small compared to the fish I already have in the tank. Will keep you posted.
I agree that you should get all females and let them figure out which one or ones wants to turn into males. Expect extra fighting if you add more females into a tank that already has females like mine did.
