Any Millepora keepers AND Algae Turf Scrubbers?

[scolley]

I've got a relatively "young" mixed tank. No softies beyond GSP. My LPS are doing very well. And my SPS are doing OK. Not killler. But good.

However I've got a millepora that shows zero PE. When it arrived from the vendor it was bushy. But within a few hours in my tank that was gone.

My levels are very stable due to my frequent testing and automated dosing. Levels at the moment are:

KH: 8.4 dHK
Ca: 445 ppm
Mg: 1335 ppm
NO3: unmeasurable with Salifert kit
PO4: unmeasurable with Salifert kit
​

I've got very, very little algae that is visible. I do have some new birdsnests that have a few tiny spots that appeared after I recieved them from a vendor. IMO these are just spots of shipment-induced die-off that have have had advantageous algal colonization. Bottom line... my tank is pretty much algae free.

I do run an apparently aggressive skimmer. But I do not run carbon or GFO.

That said... I run an ATS. It is clearly RIPPING NO3 and PO4 out of the water, based on the clear need to clean it at least on a weekly basis, and the zero NO3/PO4 readings in an algae free tank.

So... it's my understanding that millepora - in particular - like water that is a shade "dirty". And maybe that's why I've go such poor PE. And an ATS - if properly set up - does not allow dirty water.

Are there an ATS users out there that have other experiences? Have you used your ATS to bring your system down to what is practically a ULNS, and still retained good Millepora PE?

Thanks.

 

[29reef]

I'd test the po4 with a checker rather than a color change system, they are much more accurate at finding dissolved phosphate. Once you have a good idea of where it's at try and keep it a little over .00 and you should be fine if the others stay the same.

 

[scolley]

Thanks Brian! I'll get a checker. I assume you mean ones like the Hanna's...

But how far north of 0.00? 0.001? 0.01?

Thanks for the help.

 

[NewBostonConst]

what fish do you have?

 

[29reef]

I would say between .03-.06

 

[scolley]

what fish do you have?

At the time I posted this I had 5 tiny red spot glass cardinal fish, one tiny neon goby, and one orange lined cardinal fish. Its so small a fish load to be next to no fish in a 40g system. Why is that relevant?

 

[scolley]

I would say between .03-.06

Cool! Thank you. Will try that. No doubt will mean running the ATS fewer hours per day, but that's easily done.

Thanks. Will post results.

 

[sabbath]

I'm looking to do a similar filtering method buy adding a small 5"x5" ATS. I have a good skimmer but am running Prodibio with it. I have some 2 month old Acro frags. They have good PE but the blue one went brown on me. I have it pretty high up as well. The yellow one is holding its color but no growth yet. I'm nervous about the Acros not liking the ATS.

How is your flow. I read that they like a lot of random flow as well.

 

[scolley]

How is your flow. I read that they like a lot of random flow as well.

The flow on that mille cranks. 14" away is an MP10 is pointed right at it. And on the other side of it is another MP10 that is pointed almost directly at it, but is only 4" away. The distant one runs at 100% most of the day, the close one 80%. The close pump is "anti-synched" to the distant one which is running in the Vortech "Reefcrest" mode.

All that says is that the coral gets good blow on one side, of random intensities through out the day. And whenever the random flow diminishes in intensity, the slack is made up in abundance from the other direction. Throughout the day, the direction of the blow randomly changes from one side to the other.

Pretty good, reasonably random, flow without being polyp ripping.

 

[scolley]

I would say between .03-.06

You know... based on your recommendation I ordered a Hanna checker. But in the light of a new day... that sounds high. How's your nuisance algae?

 

[sabbath]

Just a thought on po4 testing. I have the Hanna po4 ppb checker. It always reads 0 and I have a little algae. So I don't bother testing anymore.

 

[scolley]

Just a thought on po4 testing. I have the Hanna po4 ppb checker. It always reads 0 and I have a little algae. So I don't bother testing anymore.

How are your nitrates? Most algae need phosphate, nitrate, carbon and potassium. Some quantity of carbon's always going to make it into your water from the air around it. ?With a reading of zero, it appears phosphates is the limiting factor for your algae. As in you have enough of everything it needs but the phosphate, so it just sits there stripping all your phosphates out of the water before there's enough for a reading. You might want to check you nitrates.

 

[sabbath]

How are your nitrates? Most algae need phosphate, nitrate, carbon and potassium. Some quantity of carbon's always going to make it into your water from the air around it. ?With a reading of zero, it appears phosphates is the limiting factor for your algae. As in you have enough of everything it needs but the phosphate, so it just sits there stripping all your phosphates out of the water before there's enough for a reading. You might want to check you nitrates.

Thats interesting...No3 is 2.0 per red sea pro test. I do wonder what will happen when I add the ATS and the No3 goes to 0. I suppose no algae and I will need to feed corals with something. Hay maybe your acros need food?

 

[scolley]

Thats interesting...No3 is 2.0 per red sea pro test. I do wonder what will happen when I add the ATS and the No3 goes to 0.

Actually that zero phosphate reading is going to be limiting even if you have an ATS. I've seen a number of people with ATS's that have that problem.

So if any one of those macros (N, P, K, CO2) can limit algae growth, how can you drive BOTH N and P down to zero? I wish I knew. But that's where mine is, and stays.

I gather - but don't know - that the ratios that algae (and all plants) need of these macros are pervasive. At least N, P, K anyway. And that when one gets too high (like N in your case), then something could be out of wack. Like maybe feeding a food that is unnaturally high in nitrates. But that's just my understand. Please don't take it as fact.

Hay maybe your acros need food?

My other SPS are doing fine. Good PE on everything but that Millepora. I feed every nite with the skimmer off for 5 or six hours. They're getting food.

 

[sabbath]

I wonder if you could use more Iodine or something? I dose Iodine and strontium to nsw levels. Here is a few zeo guide listings that say that they help PE. Throwing it out there as I have been thinking about dropping Red Seas A & B (My Nitrate contributor I think) and trying Zeo's Coral Vitalizer.

Iodide Complex
Intended use: Color enhancer, aid crustation molting
Positive results: Lower death rate during crustation molting, PE
OD Symptoms: Yellow corals turn green, darkening of SPS, increase of cyano if they are already established in the system

Coral Vitalizer
Intended use: Coral food
Positive results: Coral growth, PE
OD Symptoms: Brown film

K-Balance Potassium (Strong)
Intended use: Raise potassium levels, increase growth and coloration
Positive results: Natural K+ levels (380-400mg/l) , increase in several colors, PE, thicker tissue, growth
OD Symptoms: Burnt tips, darkening, algae growth, brown film

 

[scolley]

I wonder if you could use more Iodine or something?

Thanks that is something that might help, except two things...

1) I've got great PE on my SPS. Just not on that one Millepora.
2) That's something that MIGHT help. Or not. I'm more interested in things that someone might KNOW is wrong, rather than just trying stuff in hopes of improvement.

Thanks for the suggestion though.

 

[scolley]

I would say between .03-.06

Well that does not appear to be my problem. I say that because my new Hanna Phosphate checker arrived today. And I ran two tests. One gave me a result of 0.04 ppm, and the next gave me 0.08. Given that the tests are supposed to have an error of +/- 0.04 ppm, that puts me in the suggested ballpark.

On one hand, that's more PO4 than I thought from my Salifert test kit. So I'm clearly a long way from ULNS.

But on the other hand - an abject lack of Phosphates is not why I have poor Millepora PE.

Bummer. Sounded like 29reef was onto something.

 

[waqas_01]

Hey, I have a 55 gallon mixed tank and my millis seem to be doing the best among the sps. I'm running an ATS, skimmer, carbon, and live rock in terms of filtration.

The other sps seem to be showing a bit of colour again after a period of browning, but that was due to flow issues and lighting placement (I think).

My softies and lps seem to be holding up great. I've been running the turf scrubber for approximately 6-7 months now. My total water volume is approximately 65 gallons, and for that I'm running about a foot squared for the ATS (single sided only). Bubble magus NAC6 skimmer. Approximately 60-70lbs liverock. I can try snapping pictures if anyone's interested.

 

[scolley]

Hey, I have a 55 gallon mixed tank and my millis seem to be doing the best among the sps. I'm running an ATS, skimmer, carbon, and live rock in terms of filtration.

Thanks. So do your Millis have good PE? And what are your phosphates?

Thanks.

 

[landy]

this may be way off, but how many different milli's have you tried?

I have some milli's that take off and look great, while others do much like what you describe. I have come to the ignorant conclusion that some coral's will tolerate my tank and others won’t, regardless of species.

landy