Anyone Thinking of Dumping LEDS and going back to Halides

[oreo57]

point being, the sun is not a comparison to a kessil. No matter how you are comparing it. MH is closer to the sun than a kessil.

In what way? Spectrum possibly. As to angle not even close. suns rays arrive collimated parallel so ,arguably, the shadows Kessils throw is more "sun like" than your MH "light bath"..

 

[Aqualund]

In what way? Spectrum possibly. As to angle not even close. suns rays arrive collimated parallel so ,arguably, the shadows Kessils throw is more "sun like" than your MH "light bath"..

Aren't the sun's rays largely diffracted in many directions throughout the atmosphere? Hence why the sky is blue?

 

[oreo57]

Aren't the sun's rays largely diffracted in many directions throughout the atmosphere? Hence why the sky is blue?

Ever see a shadow???

anyways the point is diffuse light is from 25-5-ish% (vis. spectrum based) of the daylight reaching a point on the earth..approx..diff between "global" and direct in the above.
Shadow on the moon.. for fun:

 

[Aqualund]

The moon has no atmosphere.

 

[power boat jim]

The moon has no atmosphere.

So then LEDS would work as well on the moon as they do here. I would just recommend using them on the light side of the moon since the excess heat from a MH would be unwanted there.

 

[Coelli]

I am in contact with the guys at Unique fairly regularly and ALL of their sps raceways are 400w Radiums. Some of the lps tanks have leds and t5's but for their sps tanks....its all mh. You can also take a look at this link.....

http://uniquecorals.com/coral/sps.html

And you can take a look at this link: http://youtu.be/0e5H9Pler_Y, where the co-owner says their goal is to shift the entire facility over to Kessils.

As I said, I was actually there at the facility and talked to them specifically about Kessils. The guy in the video is the one I spoke to. I'm not saying that MH or T5 are bad. I am saying that LEDs are advancing and there are some great lights out there, Kessil being near, if not at, the top. It'll be interesting to see how the new Halos perform.

 

[markalot]

And you can take a look at this link: http://youtu.be/0e5H9Pler_Y, where the co-owner says their goal is to shift the entire facility over to Kessils.

As I said, I was actually there at the facility and talked to them specifically about Kessils. The guy in the video is the one I spoke to. I'm not saying that MH or T5 are bad. I am saying that LEDs are advancing and there are some great lights out there, Kessil being near, if not at, the top. It'll be interesting to see how the new Halos perform.

That was 2013, have you talked to them recently? They never came out and said it but I believe based on what I've read on that other forum that the Kessils are now used on non SPS tanks.

Here's a quote, this is from February of this year ...

On our "SPS" raceways, we run 400 watt, 20K "Radium" metal halides on light movers, about 12" over the waterline. We run the lights around 10 hours a day, I believe (I think we adjusted recently). We also run a few banks of T5's over parts of one of our "SPS" raceways. We don't use Radions on our raceways; we have them on one of our display mixed reefs.

They are an excellent, well-made aquarium light, but for our purposes, they are simply not practical, both in terms of cost, light spread, and the sheer numbers that we'd need to cover our 30-foot long raceways in a fashion that would meet our criteria for growth, color, and "time to market." We do use some Kessil A360's on one section of one of our "LPS" raceways, over the Chalices, Blastos, Favia, etc., but we don't use LED over our "SPS" systems at this time.

HTH,

Scott

 

[sunilp]

I recently removed my Ati hybrid and swapped for radions. The shimmer and color pop is hard to beat

 

[d2mini]

Ever see a shadow???

anyways the point is diffuse light is from 25-5-ish% (vis. spectrum based) of the daylight reaching a point on the earth..approx..diff between "global" and direct in the above.
Shadow on the moon.. for fun:

Like I said earlier, this doesn't translate to our little tanks.
Take a coral outside and see if you have any shadowing under noon-day sun.
And this argument is pointless for us. You don't want shadows on your coral if you want healthy coral and maximum growth. Period. So why would you want your Kessil or any other light to mimick the sun in this respect? Plus, the sun moves across the sky. Even if something is in shadow it won't be for long. In our tanks it will always be in shadow unless your lights are on some kind of light mover system.
MH in a good reflector will spread the light better than any LED unit of a similar size (you will still get your shimmer), and T5 will spread it even more. I don't care for all T5 lit tanks because I do like some shadows/contrast and the shimmer which is why I like to use the combo setup.

 

[broadwave]

I've been running the Radions on my reef for about 2 years now... I do like them for their sleek design as well as how they do not add any heat to the tank. However, my SPS corals just don't grow the same under them the way they did under MH/T5.

I'm doing a rebuild this summer and going old school back to MH/T5 lighting among other things. I guess I'll just use the Radions on my refugium

 

[oreo57]

The moon has no atmosphere.

That was the point, to show the difference (or similarity) to shadows on earth. And to show how "parallel" the suns light rays are..Shadows on earth are not "as black" because of atmospheric scattering but are still quite dark.

So then LEDS would work as well on the moon as they do here. I would just recommend using them on the light side of the moon since the excess heat from a MH would be unwanted there.

:thumbsup:

Like I said earlier, this doesn't translate to our little tanks.
Take a coral outside and see if you have any shadowing under noon-day sun.
And this argument is pointless for us. You don't want shadows on your coral if you want healthy coral and maximum growth. Period. So why would you want your Kessil or any other light to mimick the sun in this respect? Plus, the sun moves across the sky. Even if something is in shadow it won't be for long. In our tanks it will always be in shadow unless your lights are on some kind of light mover system.
MH in a good reflector will spread the light better than any LED unit of a similar size (you will still get your shimmer), and T5 will spread it even more. I don't care for all T5 lit tanks because I do like some shadows/contrast and the shimmer which is why I like to use the combo setup.

Well you have a good point but it translate to, without movement neither is "sun like"..The splitting hairs argument is "if" you move both lights in an arc (making them "sun like") which would produce the higher percentage of parallel rays? Most likely the Kessil. And due to the fact that it scatters less would probably be more "sun like" over time

If you said which light produces a "noon effect" of sun+scattering of light then the MH wins ..

Which one is better is not really part of the sun like in a sun/atmosphere sense so to speak..
So "sun like" (minus atmosphere) is really more of a "problem" to be dealt with than a plus..
Yea nit picky............and really should be ignored..

 

[sirreal63]

You do realize that parallel rays are not what we want?

 

[Coelli]

That was 2013, have you talked to them recently? They never came out and said it but I believe based on what I've read on that other forum that the Kessils are now used on non SPS tanks.

Here's a quote, this is from February of this year ...

Yes, the event was at the beginning of the year so around the same time. I did notice he said "not at this time" and it's a different guy (I assume the other co-owner) than the one I spoke to. I wonder if they're having a difference of opinion over there. Or, the cost (as seemed to be the primary focus of the post rather than quality of light) was just too prohibitive in the end for what they need to cover.

 

[Aqualund]

I have used the Kessils for applications exactly like theirs. I remember the giddy excitement I had when I started, only to follow the next year or so telling myself that the drop in vitality of my corals couldn't be from the Kessils. Eventually I switched to a mix, and have never been happier.

But like I've said before...leds seem to be just fine for LPS and softies. I personally cannot justify the use of led only over a varied sps tank. Too many of the varieties just do not thrive (unlike MH). I'm almost certain this is what they found too.

 

[FullBoreReefer]

My tank specs are in my Sig, anyways I currently run two AI Hydras, what if I added a 250w mh and use the hydras as supplements?

Any thoughts?

 

[redwhiteandblue]

My tank specs are in my Sig, anyways I currently run two AI Hydras, what if I added a 250w mh and use the hydras as supplements?

Any thoughts?

I'm doing this now and they hydra give off a good actinic. Lots 9f pop. My issues is the coverage. I have one hydra on each side of two halides so there is a sifferent color in the center of tank. I also have the 52s angled inward to help

It sounds like your plan should work perfect if u only have one halide

 

[FullBoreReefer]

I'm doing this now and they hydra give off a good actinic. Lots 9f pop. My issues is the coverage. I have one hydra on each side of two halides so there is a sifferent color in the center of tank. I also have the 52s angled inward to help

It sounds like your plan should work perfect if u only have one halide

Cool. My tank is only 36" long x 24" wide, so one halide in the middle and one hydra on each side is what I planned.

The hydras are on an AWM via apex, so I plan to ramp them up, back them down as the halide kicks on for a few hours, then back up when the halides turns off, then ramp down at the end of the day.

Make any sense? Haha

 

[redwhiteandblue]

Cool. My tank is only 36" long x 24" wide, so one halide in the middle and one hydra on each side is what I planned.

The hydras are on an AWM via apex, so I plan to ramp them up, back them down as the halide kicks on for a few hours, then back up when the halides turns off, then ramp down at the end of the day.

Make any sense? Haha

Yes it does. I have them running all day with my highest setting about 50% it compliments the radiums very well. Although I cannot speak long term success yet as I just switched 2 weeks ago

 

[jminick2]

anyone wondering I preordered the 250w 14k phoenix bulbs from aquacave suppose to be in the 1st. they got pushed back to "mid june"

 

[ffeschultz]

I just switched back to halides (400w xm 20000k). I haven't seen polyp extension and feeding activity like this in the two years of running reef breeders led's. Coincidence???