Automated water changes?

reefbroao

reefbroao

New member
I'm looking to automate my water changes. How is this normally done. I'm thinking of just using a dual doser to import and export water daily.
 
I use a Genesis Renew. 5 gallons a day, 1 gallon at a time. The Renew is by far the best for automatic water changes in terms of accuracy, easy of use, flexibility and speed. You can set it from 1-99 gallons a day, week or continuous. If I want to do a 40 gallon water change or any other number, I push the button to select 40 gallons, push a button to select continuous and hit start. It will do a gallon in and a gallon out every 2-3 minutes. If I want to do 5 gallons a day or any other number, I push the button to select the number, then push the other button to select daily and then hit start. It will split that volume up over the course of 24 hours. Because it uses precise metering bins, it's always 100% accurate. Prior to the Renew, I used a dual pump Litermeter which worked well but like any peristaltic pump, it was slow and needed maintenance. You also have to calculate the volume whether it's by converting ml to gallons or calculating flow x time to figure out the gallons per minute or hour. The Renew takes all the math out of it and if you need to do a larger water change in an emergency or in a pinch, it's as simple as determining how many gallons you want to change, pressing a couple buttons and hitting start.

Because of it's cost, it's not for everybody but for those of us with larger tanks, it's a GREAT solution that can't be beat!

This is my mixing station. The tank on the left is RODI and the one on the right is mixed salt water. Between the tanks you can see the Renew controller. Above the tank on the left, you can see the 1 gallon NSW Renew 1 gallon metering bin.
image_zpsffsdj5lp.jpg


You can see the waste water metering bin on the wall behind the refugium.
image_zpszmp0h2qu.jpg
 
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I would love to have setups like that but right now i'm renting and my fish room is on the second floor. I've been isolated there by the lady so I cant run any plumbing.
 
I am a firm believer that daily water changes are far better then either weekly or monthly. Don't want to start yet another debate on this, but I have yet to see or hear any evidence why daily wouldn't be better.

I do 6 liters (~1.5 gal) on my 80 gallon tank daily using an Apex DOS.
Storage container in basement about 10 feet down, 10 feet over from tank.
Waste goes back down to the washer drain.
Works great.
 
The Genesis system is the maybach of awc systems. Next step down is using something like stenner pumps or the DOS. I have the DOS set up on my new system and I love it. I have the luxury of a fish room so keeping storage which makes it all easier but unless you have a really big system and need to accommodate large water volumes you can still employee any of these systems in your situation.

I'm changing 10 gallons a week on my system. The dos runs Monday to Friday so I have the weekend to mix up new water. Total water volume is around 200/225. I have a 20g brute which is used to hold my NSW. The OSW goes down the drain. All I have to do is turn on my RODI unit once a week, throw in the salt and turn on a pump to mix it. No heating. The mixing pump is on a timer and come on a few times a day to keep the water airated.
 
reefbroao said:
without an apex will the dos preform water changes alone?
Click to expand...

No. The DOS requires the Apex to function. A dual head Stenner pump controlled via a timer or a Litermeter III and a slave pump would be a great alternative. The Stenner is a much more robust pump that is damn near bullet proof but it's very noisy too. The Litermeter is a great alternative. It's calibratable, requires minimal maintenance and has a built in controller. Prior to the Renew, I used a Litermeter III for many years for my AWC. They are great pumps. The only down side is that they are slow and not ideal for larger bulk water changes.
 
I've got one of these on a timer, runs several times a day.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/222056260802
Just add a second head.
No problem running AWC on my 200g tank with another 150g in support.
One head pumps out from one part of your sump while the other head pumps fresh saltwater into another part of your sump.
These pumps are meant to run 24/7/365 if needed. Stainless steel rollers, bullet proof motors, rebuildable. Great option for AWC even on somewhat larger tanks.
I just run a 1/4" water line from my saltwater storage tank to the pump head, and another 1/4" water line to a drain.

Here's a pic of mine. (the smaller pump on the right is ATO)
i-7knjJ9H.jpg
 
How do you all handle your ATOs? I was going to go witht he DOS and simply kill the power to my ATO while the DOS ran but with these other pumps how are you doing it? Just pumping new in at same time you extract to keep steady water level?
 
soulpatch said:
How do you all handle your ATOs? I was going to go with the DOS and simply kill the power to my ATO while the DOS ran but with these other pumps how are you doing it? Just pumping new in at same time you extract to keep steady water level?
Click to expand...

With a Stenner dual head or Masterflex dual head, that isn't an issue because water goes out at the same time water is going in. As such, the sump level should never change during the water change.

With a Litermeter III, water is first removed then the other pump adds water. You could however reverse that process and add water first, then remove water. That would raise your sump level ever so slightly for a moment before the 2nd pump kicks on which wouldn't impact your ATO. The litermeter only removes a tiny bit at at time because the LM controller breaks the total water change up over a 24 hour period and will do small increments dozens of times a day. As such, it's likely to only be a mouthful at a time. Thus the level won't change much anyway and may not impact your ATO as a result.

With my Renew, I have my Apex programmed to require the ATO float switches to be activated for 3 consecutive minutes before turning on the ATO pump. This allows enough time for the water change to finish and won't activate the ATO as a result. It also insures that my ATO only kicks on when the water is truly low and not simply because the float switches bounced in the water. This is the same method I would use if I were using the DOS for my water changes. Heck, in my case even if it did my ATO did kick on during a water change, my sump and refugium are large enough that the little bit of fresh water wouldn't make a difference int terms of salinity and it would evaporate anyway. Genesis also offers and ATO controller (Genesis Storm) that works in conjunction with the Renew and pauses the ATO controller when the water change is taking place.
 
soulpatch said:
Hmm good idea with the delay on the floats.

If I went genesis I would get the whole system for this reason.
Click to expand...

If you have an Apex and it controls your ATO, there isn't much need to get the whole system. The ATO delay works just fine for that purpose and also solves the issue of the ATO turning on and off in rapid succession because the floats are right on the ragged edge of switching from open to close or vice versa and also eliminates inadvertent sump turbulence from activating the ATO.

The other advantage of the Apex controlled ATO is that you can have the ATO pump run for a minimum amount of time. Lets say as an example it takes a .25 gallon drop in the sump level to activate your ATO. Then it takes 5 minutes for the ATO pump (I use a peristaltic pump) to add .25 gallons. You can have your ATO stay on 7 minutes so that it gets an extra little bit of water. While that little bit of water may not seem like much, it reduces the amount of times the ATO turns on and off each day and insureds the water level is increased enough that The level isn't right at the float switches threshold of changing states . In my case, I run my ATO pump for 15 minutes at a time. While it might only take 8 or so minutes for my top off to complete (if that), the 15 minutes insures my ATO doesn't come on as much and the additional water from my 90 GPD Stenner ATO pump doesn't impact my water level enough to be visually noticeable.
 
d2mini said:
I've got one of these on a timer, runs several times a day.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/222056260802
Just add a second head.
No problem running AWC on my 200g tank with another 150g in support.
One head pumps out from one part of your sump while the other head pumps fresh saltwater into another part of your sump.
These pumps are meant to run 24/7/365 if needed. Stainless steel rollers, bullet proof motors, rebuildable. Great option for AWC even on somewhat larger tanks.
I just run a 1/4" water line from my saltwater storage tank to the pump head, and another 1/4" water line to a drain.

Here's a pic of mine. (the smaller pump on the right is ATO)
i-7knjJ9H.jpg
Click to expand...

U got a link to the other head?

How'd you install it?
 
I use a tunze but could put a float to control that outlet to do same concept you are going through. Though I do like the ROC thing Genesis has so I dont have to refill my ATO container ever.
 
Bent said:
U got a link to the other head?

How'd you install it?
Click to expand...

I don't. Just search ebay for used Easy Load heads that run L/S 17 tubing, or whatever size tubing you are running in the other head. But most use the 17 because it has the 1/4" I.D. which uses common fittings.

I got a pair of the longer threaded bolts directly from Cole Parmer. Don't remember how much but it was pretty cheap.
 
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