Turningdoc
New member
IMO Don't run copper unless absolutely necessary. Did it once at 4 wks, "just because" w cupramine. Caused bio filter loss, ammonia spike, and death to everything. Wish I had just waited another 2-3 weeks and been happy.
Basic Quarantine FAQ's
- Thread starter Jacob D
- Start date
Maivortex
New member
IMO , if I am going thru all the trouble of quarantine before the DT, i am treating the QT tank. The fish can show no signs of Ich for >8 weeks but still be carrying it. If you dont treat the QT tank you will introduce ICH into the DT. I dont buy in to "the wait and observe" part of QT fish if we all know that fish can carry ich and show no signs.
Also, I dont understand the tank transfer method. Perhaps I need to read more of Snorvichs blog. How do you leave attacking life stages of Ich behind when the ich on the fish are all at different life stages, some are dropping of to the bottom and some have just settled on the fish.....Can someone explain this for me?
Also, I dont understand the tank transfer method. Perhaps I need to read more of Snorvichs blog. How do you leave attacking life stages of Ich behind when the ich on the fish are all at different life stages, some are dropping of to the bottom and some have just settled on the fish.....Can someone explain this for me?
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I treated prophylactically with cupramine in my qt on a seemingly healthy fish. No problem with an ammonia spike. Started ramping up the dosage slowly. By the time I got to half the desired level the fish(purple firefish) started showing signs of stress. Did a large water change, put the carbon back in the filter to get the cupramine out and in 12 hrs the fish was dead. Needless to say this made me re-think the strategy of treating in Qt when there is no sign of disease.
Deinonych
New member
The only stage on the fish is the trophont (feeding) stage. Trophonts feed for 3-7 days then drop off to become protomonts. Tank transfer exploits the life cycle by getting rid of all stages except the trophont stage. Eventually, all of the trophonts will fall off during the TTM timeframe, leaving none to reinfect the fish.
Oh boy, arguments to both sides. My first batch of fish I performed 8 weeks in QT with cupramine for 4 weeks and I lost a few fish too. Not sure if that was due to treatment or just that they were sickly coming in. Especially with having an Angel in this batch, I'm certainly second guessing.
Giovanni
AKA Flippa
Copper acts a neurotoxin as well as affecting other systems. Most of the time if the fish dies related to Copper it will respire rappidly, not feed, and have directional confusion. Eventually it will act like it has a seizure, bounce all over the tank and immediately sink to the bottom fins fully erect not breathing. Just before this happens some but not all fish will display directional confusion swimming into things and many times will try to swim down even though it is on the bottom. If you see the seizure, remove the fish from the copper and place it in front of a power head so that water is moving through its gills for oxygen/CO2 exchange. When the fish starts breathing on its own place it in a small container with an air stone and keep it dark. It will not swim correctly or even hold its self upright for hours. I have saved two fish like this. One 8 inch naso tang died weeks later refusing to eat and the other 5 inch blue face angle has survived over 6 months.
Hey guys .. After reading through this and wondering about QTng all rock, snails, coral , etc. I'm thinking for non-fish QT could it work just as well to do a Lugols or Hyd peroxide dip for these rather than having a full on QT for everything?
Since ich needs fish to feed on and most rock and coral are housed separately from most vendors and the trophent stage is about a week would it even be possible to spread ich from these sources?
Maybe my thought process is flawed so please help me On this.
Is Lugols safe for all non-fish dip procedures?
Since ich needs fish to feed on and most rock and coral are housed separately from most vendors and the trophent stage is about a week would it even be possible to spread ich from these sources?
Maybe my thought process is flawed so please help me On this.
Is Lugols safe for all non-fish dip procedures?
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Hey, just read through all this.
I got hit by bad outbreak of ich/velvet about 3 months back (see other thread), and this was the first time in more than 10 years in the hobby. I was more or less wiped out.
I am now reintroducing survivors from my Hospital tank as DT was fish-free for 3 months.
So I am now faced with the dilemma - QT or not QT, or rather, HT or no HT? I have started with a new angel fish from the LFS and have treated with copper as can't go through the Ich thing again. Planning on treating for 10 days and then move over to DT.
Not sure on the agreement here, thoughts? And should I treat for bacterial as well?
Thx
I got hit by bad outbreak of ich/velvet about 3 months back (see other thread), and this was the first time in more than 10 years in the hobby. I was more or less wiped out.
I am now reintroducing survivors from my Hospital tank as DT was fish-free for 3 months.
So I am now faced with the dilemma - QT or not QT, or rather, HT or no HT? I have started with a new angel fish from the LFS and have treated with copper as can't go through the Ich thing again. Planning on treating for 10 days and then move over to DT.
Not sure on the agreement here, thoughts? And should I treat for bacterial as well?
Thx
Deinonych
New member
10 days is not long enough to ensure the fish is free of parasites, namely cryptocaryon. The consensus here is 4 weeks of Cupramine at 0.40mg/l to ensure the parasite has gone through its entire life cycle and is eradicated. I personally don't treat for bacterial infections unless symptoms are present.
No.
Deinonych
New member
No, copper only affects the free-swimming theront stage. It does not affect the feeding (trophont) or encysted (tomont) stages. This is why keeping therapeutic dosages consistent is so critical, especially at night when the theronts are released.
jalisco
New member
I can't believe how many times I changed what I was going to do while reading this. I also can't believe people have the audacity to not read the entire thread and expect those nice enough to share years of heart break and success to answer questions already covered in the same thread.
Thank you to everyone who has shared. Before I read this I was about to make a 5 hour round trip to buy a complete running 60 gal with LR, sand, filtration and led lighting for $200 to use as a QT and HT. I was going to use the live rock in my 29 DT, sell/give away/throw away the live sand as not my color preference.
Now I plan on starting my DT with CaribSeaโs Arag-Alive and Aquaroche and/or RealReef. Use a 20 gal HT and treat every fish that will tolerate it with Cupramine and prazi and another 20 gal for fishless quarantine of corals and macro.
Can inverts be quarantined in the same tank and at the same time as the corals and macro? Can I just put coral, inverts and macro directly into brand new just cycled DT/sump 8 weeks prior to introduction of fish?
Thank you to everyone who has shared. Before I read this I was about to make a 5 hour round trip to buy a complete running 60 gal with LR, sand, filtration and led lighting for $200 to use as a QT and HT. I was going to use the live rock in my 29 DT, sell/give away/throw away the live sand as not my color preference.
Now I plan on starting my DT with CaribSeaโs Arag-Alive and Aquaroche and/or RealReef. Use a 20 gal HT and treat every fish that will tolerate it with Cupramine and prazi and another 20 gal for fishless quarantine of corals and macro.
Can inverts be quarantined in the same tank and at the same time as the corals and macro? Can I just put coral, inverts and macro directly into brand new just cycled DT/sump 8 weeks prior to introduction of fish?
mbauma
New member
Ok, looking for suggestions.
QT background, it is a 20 gallon long with water from my DT. It has heater, pvc tube, HOB filter with bio wheel and bare bottom. Also has ammonia alert in it. I assume the wheel section will turn color if it's at that level. Mine has not turned any color yet, but the package said could take a few days to register.
I have a new 140 gallon tank with 1 yellow wrasse and a cleanup crew. I have 3 lyretail antheas in QT since Tuesday. They came from LA/DD and look great and have been eating frozen mysis since day 1.
Do I just
1. observe them for 4 to 6 weeks and put them in DT
2. treat with Prazi in QT using prescribed methods and put in DT
3. treat with cuprimine in QT using prescribed methods and put in DT
4. treat with both in QT and put in DT
I have read through everything, just looking for a consensus I guess.
Thanks,
Michael.
QT background, it is a 20 gallon long with water from my DT. It has heater, pvc tube, HOB filter with bio wheel and bare bottom. Also has ammonia alert in it. I assume the wheel section will turn color if it's at that level. Mine has not turned any color yet, but the package said could take a few days to register.
I have a new 140 gallon tank with 1 yellow wrasse and a cleanup crew. I have 3 lyretail antheas in QT since Tuesday. They came from LA/DD and look great and have been eating frozen mysis since day 1.
Do I just
1. observe them for 4 to 6 weeks and put them in DT
2. treat with Prazi in QT using prescribed methods and put in DT
3. treat with cuprimine in QT using prescribed methods and put in DT
4. treat with both in QT and put in DT
I have read through everything, just looking for a consensus I guess.
Thanks,
Michael.
RuggerReef
New member
I want to setup my QT tomorrow. I have just about all I need besides a few odds and ends. I know that is suggested that the back, bottom and sides be painted black. I was wondering if I could paint them a dark blue? I have a spray can of navy blue paint with nothing to use it on.
For me, the issue is contrast which makes observation a bit easier. Nothing magic about a specific color.
It happens all the time, especially in this forum. We have various stickies that give a lot of useful information, yet people want the same information rewritten. But life goes on, we are here to try and help.
Badlands25
New member
Currently treating my fish in a 40b with cupramine. Not sure if it's just ich. Only 1 fish out of 3 had a second symptom which was fuzzy patches. The ich looked different on purple tang than on wrasse . Lavender tang never had signs of anything. My question is after a few weeks of copper should I treat for a bacterial or fungal infection or will cupramine handle everything. Also what is the best copper test kit. I use API and have a hard time telling the colors
Sleepingtiger
Member
tired of ich. i will start to quarantine my fish from now on.
so after reading through this,
the best method for the fish in my DT is to do a tank transfer method.
question, the life cycle calls for trophont to fall off and become the protomont for about 2-18 hours before attaching itself to a surface and become tomont. wouldn't it be better to let the protomont attach itself to the surface before moving the fish to a new tank. Maybe do the transfer in the evening giving the protomont a chance to cyst. If you transfer in the morning, you might get some of the water that contain the protomont and spread it to the new tank. It will then cyst and gave a chance to turn therphonts and reattaching to the fish. I am not questioning the method, just trying to get a clear understanding.
also, why should i let the tank go fallow for 72 days? since the protmont, tomont, and therphonts phase is max 35 days in room temperature.
so after reading through this,
the best method for the fish in my DT is to do a tank transfer method.
question, the life cycle calls for trophont to fall off and become the protomont for about 2-18 hours before attaching itself to a surface and become tomont. wouldn't it be better to let the protomont attach itself to the surface before moving the fish to a new tank. Maybe do the transfer in the evening giving the protomont a chance to cyst. If you transfer in the morning, you might get some of the water that contain the protomont and spread it to the new tank. It will then cyst and gave a chance to turn therphonts and reattaching to the fish. I am not questioning the method, just trying to get a clear understanding.
also, why should i let the tank go fallow for 72 days? since the protmont, tomont, and therphonts phase is max 35 days in room temperature.
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