Best choice for summer. Chiller or In Window air condtioner? Cheaper way?

[MarineGirl411]

Hi everyone,
I am getting prepared for the summer here. Last year was really bad. 105* highest My freshwater got up to 82. It doesn't have MH and it is a 150 gallon system, so it has a lot of room to spare. I expect the reef to get much hotter. I didn't have the in window air conditioner unit on, all the time, last summer. My question is, what do you believe would be cheaper and more dependable? Buying a chiller (if so what one?) or leaving on the in window air conditioner unit on all summer? I just don't know how expensive it would be as I've never done this. Most reliable? Also, I have 3 fans in my canopy 2 are 5in computer fans, and the other is a 4in fan. My temps right now, fluctuate. Highest it's been is 79*. I mainly keep LPS, but will start keeping clams, and some Monti's and maybe a few SPS. Would like your opinions.

 

[JR719]

There are a lot of factors here... If it were me, I'd wait to see what the max temp is in the tank thru the summer. Your fans may keep the temp down at the expense of top off water (cheaper than a chiller). If you can keep it at 82 your doing good.

When you say window unit, do mean a suppliment cooling for the room, tank or main house cooling? If it is in the window blowing on the tank all the time as a suppliment, your heater may run more, both going is higher electric bill. If you were to modify your window unit to be a "chiller" and using a controller, that would essentially be a dedicated chiller for your tank and provide no cooling for your house. This is a bit of an expense as you need specialized equipment to complete the task of conversion.

To get down to the cuttin', if you keep your house cool enough, the fans will do the trick. You just need to find out how cool to keep your house so the fans will be able to keep the tank temps down. If you find that you need to keep your house really cool to lower tank temps, I would suggest going the chiller route.

If you go the chiller route, any chiller will do so long as it's rated for you tank size. I myself, won't do another reef without one. I usually keep my house a little warm and keep a few windows open when the temps are fair. Sometimes fans just don't cut it. You do have to remember, chillers do blow hot air into your house and cause your air conditioner to run more. The hotter your house, the faster your tank heats, the more the chiller runs.
Try to shoot for between 79 and 82 in the tank.

 

[maroun.c]

To me I wouldn't be able to use a chiller as the heat outside will fry it out. as to having it inside the house, it will cause lots of noise and heat realeased in the house.
I guess the best option would be to run the hose air conditioning or have at least an air conditioner in the room the AC is in. keeping the room temperature at 70-75 and depending on your fans effectivness will lead to tank temperture of around 80. You will have to play around with different temperatures to decide on which one keeps a tank temperature of around 80. the advantages is that you get a cool room to sit in in hot days, your always feeling fresh watching yoru tank, you don't feel really hot while doing maintenance on your tank or taking pictures of it. in case of failure (mostly AC not running) there is little risk of killing the tank as the heaters will kick in and it takes a long period of cold to affect the tank seriously. most chances are you'll notice it. However if a chiller fails (mostly fails to stop) the effect will be much more.
Some choosehaving a chiller and an AC for security when one fails.
Still I'm describing exrtreem heat locations and you may not need such measures.
guess you'll have to try all solutions and try to calculate the cost of each.
For me it's really easy the AC has to be on non stop day and night from June-october. and at night time all year long, so cooling a tank wouldn't be an added cost.

 

[Sk8r]

Maroun has a good point: in the ways of physics, heat has to go somewhere, and unless you are venting it to the outdoors, it contributes to house heat and only makes life more miserable.

Look into a high-efficiency window or wall unit: figure you can lower the temperature to bearable---BUT---you'll have to do it 24/7, which is pricey, energy-wise. With a fan running over your water surface, encouraging maximum evaporation, you'll find the tank is benefitting from the dryer cooler air a window unit produces. But to get max benefit, your unit has to be in the same room as the tank.

Another really decent alternative, if you're in an apartment or otherwise unable to install a wall or window unit from the outside, is the rollabout: these cost about 500 at Lowe's or Home Depot, weigh like a window unit, but are on casters with a clothes dryer-style hose that vents out a window. They're pretty efficient, though not as efficient as a wall unit in either cooling or energy use. A window clamp can solve your security issues with one of these.

 

[oceandrops]

If you decide for a chiller I have 1/3 JBJ Arctica for sale.

 

[MarineGirl411]

Hi,
Actually the unit that is in the room with the fish tank is an in window ac. I am not sure how much it would cost to run 24/7. That is why I was trying to figure out what would be the best thing. A Chiller or the Window AC? I never thought of the chiller producing that much heat itself. I wouldn't think it would, but now I know. =) Not sure what to do. I do live in an apartment. Oye

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9382164#post9382164 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Sk8r
Maroun has a good point: in the ways of physics, heat has to go somewhere, and unless you are venting it to the outdoors, it contributes to house heat and only makes life more miserable.

venting a chiller inside a dwelling would be similar to venting a window AC unit inside. It doesn't make any sense. You need to vent to an external/remote area in both cases.

 

[melev]

I have a fishroom that gets very hot, especially in the summer. I have a 8000 BTU air conditioner in the wall of the fish room. It uses 800w when the compressor is running, and I keep the fishroom at 79F. That keeps my reef at 81F, or less.

All night the a/c doesn't run but the fan runs. The room gets very wet due to condensation, so I'm considering adding a vent fan to pull that moist air out during the night.

The window unit cost me $142 and has lasted two years so far. It would be good to know how much the chiller costs, and how many watts it pulls when it is running. That is the best way to figure out what is the better choice.

For the off-months, I run fans over my tank. And in the winter, I don't use the a/c at all.

 

[MarineGirl411]

the chiller I was looking at costs 320.00. It was going on ebay for cheaper, but I didn't get it. The watt draw on that chiller was 300watts. Thank you melev. I've been to your website quite a few tims. Maybe I'll try the A/C to start off with. Just wanted a back up plan. I've got micro's blasto's, ballys, and a monti. I know the monti would be fine, just worried about the blastos and micros. Let me know. TY.

 

[Sk8r]

Marinegirl, you'd be surprised how much a really highpowered fan can do to cool a tank, if in the sump area. When I taught, on a really hot day, some miscreants ran outside through the sprinklers, soaking themselves, then reported to class: no airconditioning in the building on this sweltering day in the 90's, but fans blowing in the classroom. After about 20 minutes, their lips were turning blue and I had to dismiss them to the nurse: that's what evaporative cooling can do. Apply it to your tank, and you can get some real advantage, the penalty being mega-evaporation and replacing a lot of water.

Also, reverse your day-night cycles, so your lights aren't on during the high heat of the day. Your reef doesn't care which side of the world it's on.

 

[Mark426]

Run the window unit and see how your tank temps are, IF the temps are ok...then stay with the a/c. The chiller may use just as much electricity as your window unit, so where is the savings, plus you were ready to shell out 300+ for a chiller and that buys lots of additional electricity. Go to any store that sells new window units, look at the yellow tag that is on the a/c, it gives you the average cost of running the thing. Might have to do some math, but I bet you will save money with a window unit + a major bonus…YOU will be cooler too.

The only way justify a chiller (from a financial standpoint) is if your apartment air conditioner "used within reason" wont keep your tank temps where you need them.

 

[wooglin]

Just get a Pacific Coast CL-280. I have one on my 75 with dual 250 watt M/H and dual 110watt VHO. They run 300 bucks are just 1/10 of a horse and have a very efficient compressor. I have had mine for over 3 years and it is still running strong. I keep my tank at 74 degrees, and when the A/C went out on our house it tool the repair guys two days to get it fixed. It was 95+ in the house. The tank never went over 80. Now the chiller ran 24/7 those two days, but it was all good.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9389241#post9389241 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Sk8r
Marinegirl, you'd be surprised how much a really highpowered fan can do to cool a tank

Agreed. Don't underestimate the power of evaporative cooling. A $14 box fan blowing across the surface of the water can lower the aquarium temperature significantly. If your sump is covered, uncover it.
FWIW- I once ran a chiller. I sold it. The last thing you want to do is make your living space hotter. Air conditioning was a better solution. AC lowers humidity (as well as temperature) which in turn enhances evaporative cooling. In many cases AC (coupled with fans if necessary) is the best solution for high summertime temps. Unless you can vent the chiller to the outside or a remote external area outside of your apartment I wouldn't invest in one.

 

[USC-fan]

frozen coke bottles in sump FTW!!!

 

[wooglin]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9390586#post9390586 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Gary Majchrzak
Agreed. Don't underestimate the power of evaporative cooling. A $14 box fan blowing across the surface of the water can lower the aquarium temperature significantly. If your sump is covered, uncover it.
FWIW- I once ran a chiller. I sold it. The last thing you want to do is make your living space hotter. Air conditioning was a better solution. AC lowers humidity (as well as temperature) which in turn enhances evaporative cooling. In many cases AC (coupled with fans if necessary) is the best solution for high summertime temps. Unless you can vent the chiller to the outside or a remote external area outside of your apartment I wouldn't invest in one.

What do you do if your AC breaks in the middle of the summer when its 100 degrees outside, and its going to take two days to get the part? Do you watch everything in your tank die as the temp rises to 90+?

That was the driving factor that pushed me to get a chiller.

As for the heat its a net effect. It helps heat the house in the winter, and does not help in the summer.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9390788#post9390788 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by wooglin
What do you do if your AC breaks in the middle of the summer when its 100 degrees outside, and its going to take two days to get the part? Do you watch everything in your tank die as the temp rises to 90+?

this is what I do when that situation happens: turn off the halides and run some fans. I do the same when a chiller fails

 

[xtm]

I would go ahead and use a chiller.. most units are very silent and are barely noticeable when they're ON. The problem with a window A/C is that you cannot accurately control them based on the tank temp. Chillers are pretty much automated to turn on if the temp rises above the desired level.. you want to have this temp stability in your tank.

I live in So Cal and it DOES get around 120'+ here during summer and I found that the best solution for me is a chiller, not an AC unit.

Also, don't 'ghetto-rig' your tank with those box fans. Not only they look aesthetically awful, they also make things complicated and messy. Get a chiller, plumb it properly, and get done with it. Do it right the first time.

JMO

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9391016#post9391016 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by xtm
I live in So Cal and it DOES get around 120'+ here during summer and I found that the best solution for me is a chiller, not an AC unit.

I agree with doing it right the first time, however:
Spokane, WA and upstate NY have a different climate than SOCAL and Kentucky. We don't get many 120 degree days here, and unless my thinking is way off- neither does Spokane.
We rarely crack 100.
No doubt a chiller is the "ultimate" solution to controlling chronic high aquarium temps and people in warmer climate should have one, but marinegirl has a case where I don't think it's practical to install a chiller vented to the outside (she's living in an apartment). A chiller vented to the outside of her apartment might be more messy than installing a window AC unit. The fans are only used in emergency situations in cooler climates. (I don't have to use any fans here if I run AC during hot spells). She hasn't mentioned if she's keeping really sensitive corals, but most SPS will be fine at 84 degrees for a short period of time as long as circulation is good.

I'm going to edit in:
this is a case where joining a local reef club can help out a lot. You can see what others in your particular region are doing to deal with the weather conditions you will be experiencing.

 

[Mark426]

Re: Best choice for summer. Chiller or In Window air condtioner? Cheaper way?

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9381867#post9381867 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by MarineGirl411
My question is, what do you believe would be cheaper and more dependable? Buying a chiller (if so what one?) or leaving on the in window air conditioner unit on all summer?

As usual the thread has gotten off track, the key word is cheaper....she doesnt want to spend alot of money on a chiller or the additional costs to run it. I still say, try the a/c and see what happens, she can always spring for the chiller if all else fails.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

The current TOTM in Reefkeeping online mag uses no chiller:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-02/totm/index.php

Avoiding the use of a submersible pump can help to lower high aquarium temperatures.