Brooklynella clownfish infection question

[ViktorVaughn]

I recently purchased what I thought appeared to be 2 healthy ocellaris clownfish from my LFS last Saturday 10/26/13. After getting home, I added the two clowns to my 15 gallon QT and all seemed well. I fed about 2 hours later, one ate with gusto while the other one was very lethargic and uninterested in the garlic soaked PE mysis/S.F. Bay Marine Cuisine mixture I feed in the evenings. Initially I was not that concerned as I have sometimes had a fish that would take a couple feedings to start eating. He only hung out on the bottom right of the tank and wouldn't swim around very much at all on Sunday with no luck on getting the clown to eat again. Monday is when I first noticed visible problems with the fish and after doing some research I found out it was Brooklynella which sucks as it sounds like some pretty nasty stuff. His breathing was very rapid with minimal swimming and a bunch of mucus/sting like substance hanging off him. I added Mardel Coppersafe per the directions to get the copper to therapeutic levels. Copper treatment seemed hit and miss from what I read but was all I had immediate access to, no store sells Formalin near me. I gave the visibly infected clown a freshwater dip for 5 minutes which appeared to dislodge all of the mucus like substance that was hanging off of the clown. He did not eat again all day Monday and was unfortunately dead Tuesday morning when I woke up. The second clown still appears unaffected which is strange as from what I have read, this is a pretty virulent and nasty disease. The clown still swims normally, breathes regularly, eats well and has no visible signs of Brook. When I diagnosed the issue to be Brook, I ordered Formalin online as it appears to be the only successful cure for this nasty disease. I will not have the Formalin until Saturday.

Some questions regarding the remaining clownfish and formalin treatment:

1. Should I proactively treat with formalin via a dip or should I wait and see if the fish is infected first as formalin seems like some harsh stuff?

2. What are the interactions between copper and formalin? Will I need to change water to reduce copper levels back closer to 0 before doing any treatment?

3. Is it possible for one clownfish to get Brooklynella without the other catching it as well?

Thanks for the help, I would hate to lose the other one as well.

 

[Speeddemon7]

With brookynella you usually only have 72hrs and the fish is either near death or is dead. I have had great success with ich-x by hikari using their dip recommendation in treating brook. I recently lost a fish in quarantine to Uronema marinum which is very similar. I didn't have ich-x so I ran to Walmart at 12am to get what ever I could. I found they have quick cure which is formalin based. The fish probably would of made it had it not been attacked by my trigger which was also in quartine both were new arrivals. Best of luck to you! Try and get your hands on formalin ASAP. Every book I have said copper doesn't have much if at all of an effect on brook or Uronema marinum.

 

[Mrscribbled]

Formalin seems to be the best treatment, I prefer daily hour long heavily aerated baths, never mix with copper. It is a deadly combo.

 

[ViktorVaughn]

Ok thanks, I was thinking copper and formalin would not mix very well at all together. Seeing as how both seem to be pretty stressful on fish, can't imagine good things would happen when the two are mixed. So, should I keep changing water to get Copper levels to nil? I am wondering if it is needed to get the Copper levels close to 0 ppm before trying out the formalin. Or, is it acceptable and safe for the fish to lower the Copper levels from the current therapeutic level to around .10 ppm in the QT, than transfer the fish to a formalin bath after which the fish would be placed back in the QT with minute copper levels?

 

[Deinonych]

Best way to remove copper IME is Seachem Cuprasorb. You should be able to pick it up at your LFS. Amazon carries it as well. I assume you have a copper test kit already. I would completely remove the copper before starting Formalin treatment, even if it's a bath.

 

[Newsmyrna80]

Best way to remove copper IME is Seachem Cuprasorb. You should be able to pick it up at your LFS. Amazon carries it as well. I assume you have a copper test kit already. I would completely remove the copper before starting Formalin treatment, even if it's a bath.

+1
I treated a flame angel for brook by doing formalin dips every other day for 5 treatments. He pulled through no problem. Be sure to aerate for a least a couple of hours. Also I didn't have formalin at the time so I used Quick Cure. You should be able to get it at Walmart, LFS or Petco. I know Petsupermarket carries it but I don't think there is one in Aurora.
In the case of your surviving clown I would still treat with dips but maybe only do 3 treatments if no symptoms.

 

[Mrscribbled]

Poly filters (brand name) work great removing copper also, carbon as well.

 

[ViktorVaughn]

Best way to remove copper IME is Seachem Cuprasorb. You should be able to pick it up at your LFS. Amazon carries it as well. I assume you have a copper test kit already. I would completely remove the copper before starting Formalin treatment, even if it's a bath.

+1
I treated a flame angel for brook by doing formalin dips every other day for 5 treatments. He pulled through no problem. Be sure to aerate for a least a couple of hours. Also I didn't have formalin at the time so I used Quick Cure. You should be able to get it at Walmart, LFS or Petco. I know Petsupermarket carries it but I don't think there is one in Aurora.
In the case of your surviving clown I would still treat with dips but maybe only do 3 treatments if no symptoms.

Thanks for the replies, exactly the information I needed in regard to copper and formalin reactions and whether or not to perform formalin dips even if no symptoms of brook appear. On a side note, I assume that when the clownfish died of brooklynella the parasite dislodged from the dead clown and is now in the water. Should I add formalin to the QT a couple days after copper levels read 0 ppm for a longer, prolonged bath to rid water of the brooklynella parasite? Just in the lower concentration for prolonged formalin bath treatments?

Poly filters (brand name) work great removing copper also, carbon as well.

Nice, i'll look into that, it would be pretty easy as I currently just have a HOB bio-wheel filter with some filter floss on the QT.

 

[Louis Z]

So if I was to use quick cure . At which dosage would I use in a formalin bath. The directions recommend 2 drops per gallon as a normal dosage. Should I search for hikari brand if I already have quick cure? The reason I ask is that I would like to get some Fiji barberi clowns from LA in California. I assume wild caught . I do have chloroquine and prazipro on hand. I am familiar with the tank transfer method also. So I am asking what all of you would do day one of QT. I will not watch first then treat but will treat prophylactically . Haven't ordered them yet so what is your opinion?

 

[Speeddemon7]

Usually you do 1 drop of quick cure per quart of water for a bath. That's nearly the exact same amount of formalin as if you we're using the hikari in the bath. The bath should be at least 15 minutes and no more then 60min. I usually shoot for 30min.

More info here
saltaquarium.about.com/od/ichparasiticdiseases/ht/treatbrooklynel.htm

 

[guserto4]

Brook is nasty stuff. I introduced a lemon peel and after a few weeks in DT it suddenly fell and took my mated percs with it. Didn't get to diagnos/treat in time. No more 2 week QT observation for this cowboy.

I would definitely treat the other clown in QT as suggested. The last thing you want is that stuff in your DT.

Good luck!

 

[geckoejon]

thanks for sharing! there was some valuable info in these post. i have a new little black and white clown that appears to have brook. breathing fast, lethargic, and slime strings. i have been trying copper, and performed a fresh water dip this morning. tonight, i am going to give it clean water, and then try a formulin dip.

 

[Newsmyrna80]

Thanks for the replies, exactly the information I needed in regard to copper and formalin reactions and whether or not to perform formalin dips even if no symptoms of brook appear. On a side note, I assume that when the clownfish died of brooklynella the parasite dislodged from the dead clown and is now in the water. Should I add formalin to the QT a couple days after copper levels read 0 ppm for a longer, prolonged bath to rid water of the brooklynella parasite? Just in the lower concentration for prolonged formalin bath treatments?



Nice, i'll look into that, it would be pretty easy as I currently just have a HOB bio-wheel filter with some filter floss on the QT.

Sorry...very important info....I put him in a clean, new tank after each dip. Of course temp, salinity and pH were matched to prior water parameters.

 

[ViktorVaughn]

Brook is nasty stuff. I introduced a lemon peel and after a few weeks in DT it suddenly fell and took my mated percs with it. Didn't get to diagnos/treat in time. No more 2 week QT observation for this cowboy.

I would definitely treat the other clown in QT as suggested. The last thing you want is that stuff in your DT.

Good luck!

Thanks, I have dealt with ich in both freshwater and marine tanks and after seeing brooklynella for the first time, I am amazed (or horrified really) at how fast acting and deadly this parasite is. Hate to see ich pop up in display tanks but I would be mortified if brook got introduced into my DT.

thanks for sharing! there was some valuable info in these post. i have a new little black and white clown that appears to have brook. breathing fast, lethargic, and slime strings. i have been trying copper, and performed a fresh water dip this morning. tonight, i am going to give it clean water, and then try a formulin dip.

For sure some very useful and pratical information. I would recommend you get on the formalin treat ASAP as the same day I noticed my ocellaris showing signs of brook, I treated with copper and a freshwater dip and it was dead a day and a half later. The freshwater dip even dislodged all the visible mucus crap hanging off the poor clown which I thought would make it a little easier for it to breath and maybe pull through, but, no luck. Good luck with your clown, let me know how your treatments go.

Sorry...very important info....I put him in a clean, new tank after each dip. Of course temp, salinity and pH were matched to prior water parameters.

So if you did say five treatments, you would have 5 tanks running? I am wondering if doing a dip in a gallon of formalin treated water followed by being placed back in the QT with a low dose of formalin for a prolonged bath would be sufficient.

 

[Newsmyrna80]

So if you did say five treatments, you would have 5 tanks running? I am wondering if doing a dip in a gallon of formalin treated water followed by being placed back in the QT with a low dose of formalin for a prolonged bath would be sufficient.

No just one tank at a time but I have 2 QT setups. My procedure was
1. Prepare the dip using water from the QT he was in, while aerating...
2. Set up a new QT (matching parameters)
3. set up a small bucket with water from the new QT to rinse the fish after the dip.
4. Dip the fish.
5. Put into the new QT
6. Tear down old QT and sterilize
7. 2 days later do it all again
I did not use formalin as a bath in the QT because this stuff is so noxious. The dips are tough enough on the fish without adding on more exposure. I had a great outcome just using it as a dip.

 

[ViktorVaughn]

Right on, thanks for the informative steps. I just performed a dip on the clown about 2 hours ago. I just took two 1 gallon water jugs and mixed up some salt to match the quarantine level's SG. In one jug, I added formalin per the instructions on the bottle and added an airstone in the jug. I put the clown into the water jug with formalin and performed the dip, during which time the clownfish seemed to do just fine and swam around the entire time. After the dip was done, I transferred the fish into the other water jug with just plain saltwater for a rinse and than added the clown back into the QT. Hopefully these preventative dips will prevent a brooklynella infection in the remaining clownfish and it will have a nice long life.