Brooklynella Disease

[bnb180]

Help!

I just did something stupid. I recently purchased two ORA clown fishes and a flame angel fish. The 2nd day the clown fish started to swim like crazy. It died the following day. I think it has the Brooklynella disease. The 2nd clown is showing the same problem with slime on the skin. The flame also died.

My tank is a 220 gal established for over 3 years. I have other fishes such as hippo tang, yellow tang, purple tang, chromises...they all have been with me for awhile now without problems. I have noticed some signs of the disease on the blue tang. My gramma loretta of 2 years also died. I have lots and lots of corals.

Question is do I need to take all the fishes out and treat them as having the brooklynella disease? Or do I let them be hoping that since they have been in the tank for so long, they will survive. Anything that I can treat in the main tank?

It is a lot of work to remove the fishes as I would have to remove all the rocks and coral. Any suggestion will be appricated. I think I already know the answer, but I thought I asked. for options.

Lesson learned: sometime I think I know more than I do. I should of have quarantined them.

thanks,

Jim

 

[romsoccer12]

i think this is iFISCH's time to shine

 

[JamesJR]

You probably should just set up a quarantine tank now and move the fish to that.

 

[bnb180]

Is there absolutely no choice? I just set up the QT, but I fear that taking down the tank and catching all the fishes (20) will cause more stress and harm than riding this out.

Plus, it would take at least four hours to remove all the rocks and corals (30+). If I dip them in the Formelyn 3, that would be stressful too.

I guess I'm trying to not do it and hoping there are other options. Food to build up their immune systems? In tank treatment without harming the corals and bio life?

thanks for your comment.

Jim

 

[romsoccer12]

they will not overcome brook. you need to QT them

 

[JamesJR]

Of all the treatments I have used to treat brook, formalin dips have consitently given me the most success and this requires that you be able to quickly remove the qt tank to treat them during the dips. This will be next to impossible in a display tank and more stressful in the long run.

 

[traveller7]

Fish get brook, if that is what we are dealing with. Corals and the other invertebrates are not suitable hosts for the parasite(although brook can move tank to tank with inverts, shipping water, etc). Hence, invert's stay in display, fish move to a hospital tank.

If it is brook and you do nothing, some fish are more tolerant of brook then others, but you can bet some will die.

Based on the limited information provided no one can properly diagnose brook as the culprit. In fact, swimming "like crazy" is not typically brook behavior.

 

[sedor]

I recently lost a Six Line Wrasse to what I diagnosed to the best of my knowledge as Brooklynella. The fish shouldn't be swimming like crazy. They will start to become very lethargic and you'll notice they won't eat. The most obvious is the massive amounts of slime all over them. Its pretty obvious. I'm with everyone else, you need to QT ASAP. Maybe you can do some reading and put together a quick DIY fish trap and cross your fingers you get one of the infected ones in the morning. It took 2 days to take down my wrasse. The disease kills quick. It did not however spread to any of my other fish. Its only been a couple weeks though, I could be wrong about that last statement.

 

[traveller7]

Slime is not typically the first signs of brook, but some fish live long enough to show it. Had a large pair of maroons show such stringy streamer hanging off slimy dorsal surface and dorsal fins, but most clowns are dead before that stage.

Heavy breathing, exaggerated swimming in place, lack of eating, etc., typically show themselves first.

A good description of the disease and treatment:
http://atj.net.au/marineaquaria/brooklynella.html

 

[bnb180]

Thank you. I caught the clown fish (percula) on Sunday. Dipped him with formalin 3 for 60 minutes. Immediate improvement. I was worried about him making through the night. But in the morning he was fine. He is eating a little, though I did see him spit out his food. He is in the QT.

Some of the instruction on the net said to dip him for 5 conscecutive days. Some said to skip a day before dipping again. I have dipped him again today. Anyone have a comment?

I have said this was brooklynella, but what if it was ick? I can't really tell the difference. The clown fish had some slime, but the other fishes is just white dots. Any comments?

thanks,

Jim

 

[traveller7]

Hepatus tangs have long been seen as "ich" magnets. In my experience, the only way to treat them effectively is with hyposalinity for ~6 weeks on first arrival. After that, all fish and new introductions must be QT(inverts) and hypo'd(fishes).

Formalin can provide temporary relief from a number of parasites. Long term effect varies.

More detailed description of "white slime", location, picture, etc, would be helpful.

In such a situation, I would consider a full water test, using a new test kit as well.

 

[Sistom]

Jim,

I feel your pain...I did the exact same thing and after losing a few fish I did manage to save the majority and they have been in my QT for almost a month now.

I never noticed any spots on mine, but I'm pretty sure my new clown was the one that introduced the Brook. I also did the formalin 3 treatment for 5 consecutive days and it really didn't seem to be as stressful on the fish as some people described. Just make sure you keep an airstone in your bath and you should be alright.

Here is a link to my Brook thread from last month (http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1653269). There is a LOT of good information in there. One of the RC members recommended to try a product called Revive by Fish Vet to treat my DT. He claimed that it was safe for corals/inverts but I didn't care to risk it and ultimately decided to just wait the 6 weeks before introducing my fish to the DT again.

Good luck! Hope things work out for you!

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1653269

 

[bnb180]

Thanks Sistom.

I have read your thread and it sounds very similar to my situation.

My problem now is to catch all my fishes. I have 22 fishes, but 11 of them are chromises. I have tons of rocks, with many corals. That is why I'm hoping to not to do this. As I keep an eye on my tank, to see if the condition gets better. I have UV and 5 cleaner shrimps. Does that help?

As for the description of the problem, my clown fish that died had a film around its body. It did not look like it was falling off. The other clown had the same look but not as bad before my treatment.

I have a purple tang (small) that only have dots. The hippo tang (large) has more dots (lots). Anything I can put in the display tank to control the outbreak? Does the Revive work?

Can't see anything on the other fishes.

Six weeks in the QT? That is a lot of fishes in a QT. Any suggestion? Water quality will get bad pretty fast. I do have a 100 gal tank and a 55 gal tank. Should I separate them, but when I put them back together they will fight. Skimmer while in the QT?

Thanks everyone for your help.

Jim

 

[Sistom]

I really don't have a lot of experience with Brook and the majority of what I did learn was through that thread. If you could take some pictures of your fish in question I think other RC members may be able to identify whether its truly brook, or ich, or a combination of the two. From what I've read, Brook will stay in a tank up to 6 weeks and is pretty deadly. Most of the fish in my tank were not showing immediate signs of brook other than the one clown. I was actually considering waiting it out to see if the others started showing symptoms and then I just broke down and decided to treat them all. It's hard to tell whether they would have made it or not since I did that and I guess I'll never know. In total I lost a clown, 2 purple firefish, a royal gramma basslet and a yellow watchmen goby. Another twist to my story is that all of those fish were recently purchased and placed into the tank together with my other fish. None of my other fish showed any symptoms or died as a result so it's really hard to tell if the stress and brook combination killed them or what.

As far as your situation. It's hard to say. I was really against removing all of my fish for the same reason's you stated. It was a PAIN! But I did get creative and made 2 seperate "traps" and was able to remove them all with out moving any of my rockwork. One of the "traps" consisted of draping some wedding veil mesh ($1.99 a yard) over my rock work with only one door way cut in it to let the fish out of the rockwork. I let the fish get used to the mesh overnight and when I came home from work I fed them, blocked the door to the rockwork and caught them with a net. This worked for all of my fish except my sneaky wrasse. For the wrasse I removed the netting around the rock work and made a simple trap with some mesh that I laid on the sandbed and when I placed a food pellet on the mesh the wrasse went for it and I yanked the trap up...It worked like a charm (pretty proud of myself after 4 days of trying to catch him with the other method)...I can provide a drawing of how it worked if your interested (materials were wedding veil mesh, fishing sinkers and fishing line).

With the amount of fish you have, it's going to be a hassle no matter how you do it. Right now I have 9 (less than 3 inch) fish in a 20 gallon long tank and they don't seem to mind. They are all peaceful and I just bought a 50 gallon HOB filter to keep things clean. I do 10% water changes a week but they probably aren't necessary.

As far as an "in-tank" treatment goes, all I can say was that Revive by Fish Vet was recommended for my (fishless) DT, but it sounded like you really need a high concentrated bath for the fish to be effective against Brook. The Revive was mainly to kill off the remaining parasites in the water and since I didn't try it, I cant advise whether it works or not.

Hopefully some of that helps...Definitely try to take some pictures if you can!

 

[bnb180]

Sistom,

Thanks Sistom again for your info. If you have pics or directions on how to build the fish trap that you can show me would be great.

I just tried taking pic of the infested fish, but on camera nothing shows up.

I bought a bunch of chemical today, No-Ich, Revive, melafix stress coat, ick attack by Kor.

Does anyone have any experience with them that they can share.

I'm still keeping an eye on the fish and thinking of ways to get them out, but hoping that some of the treatment will help. Specifically, the no-ich and ick attack that can be used in a reef tank.

I won't do any chemical treatment until I research the product first, but I moving closer to doing something.

thanks,

Jim

 

[Sistom]

The only medicine I've used on my fish are Formalin 3 and Furan-2. Both were used in a hospital tank so I didn't have to worry about any corals/inverts...

The only thing I can stress is to read each medicine and be 100% sure it is reef safe before adding it to your DT. Even then, I would be VERY cautious, maybe do a search on google for other peoples experiences/uses...

As far as my netting techniques...Here's a quick drawing of how I made my net (your mileage may very with this technique but it worked flawlessly for me).

1. Cut an octagon (or a circle) out of the mesh material about 3-4 times the size of the fish you intend to catch.

2. Cut 8 pieces of fishing line the same length.

3. Attach all 8 cut pieces of fishing line to the outside of the netting in a circular fashion by crimping the mouth of the lead fishing weight over the mesh and fishing line.

4. Tie all the strands of fishing line together over the top of the net we are forming and add another singe length of fishing line for you to pull on.

5. Attach a slightly heavier weight to the bottom of the netting (centered).

What I did was lay the mesh out on the bottom of the tank with the lines leading out of the top of the tank to a handle (screwdriver). I placed a pellet of food in the middle of the netting and waited. My fish were very hesitant to go anywhere near the netting but they got used to it pretty quick being on the bottom and hardly visible. Just have patience and wait for the fish to go in the middle of the net and pull up QUICKLY! You would be surprised how fast that netting wraps around the fish! Like I said, it worked awesome for me and I don't know how else I would have caught that wrasse without tearing my tank apart. Not the most humane way to capture fish, but I really didn't have a choice.

Let me know how things turn out!

<img src="http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/198307Fish_Trap3-med.jpg" />

 

[bnb180]

I like the idea. This might work. I will try it.

I did dose with Revive yesterday after reading through tons of stuff online. With all the lights off for about 2 hours, I dosed with 1/2 dosage of Revive. It turned the water yellow/orangish. This morning my corals look ok, but the light was not on yet. I will check on them when I get home.

Thanks Sistom for your help.

 

[Sistom]

Did you use the Revive by Fish Vet? Or Revive by Two Little Fishies? Where did you end up finding it?

I recently picked up the Revive by Two Little Fishies for dipping new corals before adding them to the DT but its only to be used as a bath. Heard it was good stuff...

Also, When I was feeding my fish in the hospital tank today it looks like one of my clowns is showing signs of ICH! He had about 6 spots on him and possibly 1 spot on the other clown...I couldn't believe it! Then I saw him "scratch" himself on a tank ornament and knew he had something for sure. I'm assuming its ich and luckily I stocked up on meds the last time and immediately started my first treatment of Super Ick Cure by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals (Treats Ich and White Spot Disease). Turned the water Teal/Green. The box says it only requires two treatments so hopefully that will take care of it. I'll let you know how it goes!

 

[bnb180]

Sorry to hear about your fish. How long has it been in the QT? Water quality good?

I used Revive by Fish Vet. The corals still look good. Of course this is day one and I only used 1/2 a dosage. There has been no change to the fishes in the DT.

The only thing is that it did not say how often to dose. Since I only used 1/2 dosage I am considering the second half tonight. Does anyone know?

I did not realized this, but I bought a 16 oz bottle and I will have to use it all. I have a 200+ gal tank. This could be pricy if I need to dose for a while. But worth it if it works.

Good Luck and wish your clown fishes get better.

 

[Sistom]

Try sending a PM to RC user 1geo. He was the one that recommended Revive by Fish Vet. He may be able to give you some first hand experience with the stuff.

Glad to hear your treatment is going well so far though! My only concern is that Revive is only going to treat the water of free swimming parasites and not be concentrated enough to actually cure the parasites living on the fish. Not sure what the bottle says exactly since I never ended up getting that product.