I think you guys are not understanding the situation here. It's basically like you inviting 15,000 people to your house and setting some rules. Then a couple people break the rules a little bit and you let it go. Then 14,998 people see that the rules can be bent a little bit and they give it a try. There will always be the people who don't bother trying to bend them at all but there are others on the opposite side of the scale and everywhere in between.
So maybe only the 1,000 most extreme people decide to push the limits and start throwing trash on the floor or something simple. Pretty soon your house looks like crap and you are getting mad. Then you have to put your foot down and get mean with everyone because of the few that couldn't follow your rules like use a trash can EVERY TIME. Now you have to kick the rude ones out and treat everyone else like potential rule-breakers so they don't get out of line.
It is impossible to monitor every single post in every single forum but there are a lot of mods here to help get that job done pretty well. Sometimes a person is censored for something that was not really breaking the rules but it appeared to be possibly outside of the rules. Like the guy who posted about "who likes signed baseballs?" but never offered anything for sale. It seemed like a simple discussion but could have been interpreted as someone trying to find a buyer for baseballs on a reef forum so they just closed it.
It's obvious that someone reported that thread as a violation so it's not really the mods fault.
There is someone watching our specific forum and reporting anything that could possibly look like a violation. I don't know who or why but as long as you don't break the rules who cares who it is. There will always be people who complain about things behind your backs.
When Paul got his thread closed it was offensive to some (he had been a member on RC for 5 years and only had 20 posts or something)
When Peter's thread got closed it offended others. He had been a member for a long time also with a low post count.
I'm sure neither of them even realized they were breaking the rules but it doesn't give them any excuse to be treated differently.
According to the rules of RC they were not "contributors" to THIS community. They were BOTH board members for YEARS for C-SEA and did a lot of GREAT things for the club but were not active here.
That is a requirement for posting a For Sale thread here. Plain and simple.
As far as asking GEO to intervene goes... He is a fairly new mod and is one of the many moderators trying to keep the place clean and running smoothly. To ask him to put his name on the line and try to change the rules for one club is asking a lot in my opinion. He is a great guy but why would you want him to get involved in something that will get ugly quickly?
It is almost as if you have a friend who just became a cop and you decide to go have 3 drinks one night. You get pulled over and you are BARELY over the legal limit. The cops WILL take you in for a DUI guaranteed. Then you ask your buddy "the new cop" to try to get the rules bent for you and get you out of trouble or change the rules to make it OK to drink as much as you had in you so next time you don't get in trouble.
Probably not going to happen and probably going to make your friend very uncomfortable when you ask because he either has to tell you to get lost or tell his new co-workers that he disagrees with the rules. Either way it looks like a lose-lose situation.
As far as getting our own forums going again... I think it was a good idea a couple years ago when we did it but it takes a lot of work by the administrator (Chris or someone else?)
It is an unpaid job with lots of headaches like "hey my password won't work". Who's gonna fix that? Then you need someone to read every post and moderate the new forums and the same thing happens there with where to draw the line. Do you let everyone say whatever they want or is there some wavy line we need to draw that cuts some things out but leaves others offended?
It is not easy but could be done.
Also, there were guys complaining that they had to post everything in 2 forums to catch everyone's attention. Do you post it there, here or both? Do we now have to surf to 2 or 3 places daily to see if we missed any important updates?
It is a complicated matter but worth discussing at one of the round table meetings or even an informal meeting. We can plan meetings on RC and use the space they have allotted for us in the manner that we all agreed to when we clicked the "I agree" button while signing up. If we have enough people complaining and breaking rules in our forums here then maybe they will just ask us to leave. I hope that it never comes to that but beware how you say things. Once you have the attention on you things may get worse and worse. It is probably best for everyone that likes to come here and enjoy the forums to just accept that there are rules and they WON'T be bent for anyone.
Sometimes people get away with things against the rules for a while but they almost always end up caught. Just as in real life there are people who speed, drink and drive, take drugs, sell drugs etc... sometimes for years before getting caught. They are still breaking the rules and will pay the price for it when they are caught.
Simplest way to look at it is this. Follow the rules and all is well.
Sometimes the squeaky wheel doesn't get the oil... it gets replaced.
Honestly, nothing I said is directed toward one person or meant to offend anyone. It is simply my beliefs.
Hope you guys feel the same or can accept that it isn't your rules or your forums. It is ReefCentral and they have allowed us to use some of it and even supplied the workers for free. If we don't respect it that all may stop.
-- Kevin
