Chaeto's downsides?

[SofaSnorkeling]

Aside from the beneficial export of ie nitrate and phos, does chaeto remove anything good from our systems? Are there good things like certain trace elements that chaeto removes, that we may want to take a closer look at with ICP so we can potentially dose?

I saw a video on the pax bellum algae reactor, they suggest you dose nitrogen/molybdenum as needed and iron/manganese daily. I have heard manganese is good for tanks (maybe moly and iron?). so if chaeto depletes manganese should fuge users dose it? What do you scientific minded folks think, am I off on the managnese?

Feel free to mention other issues with fuge's even if you love them. Thanks!

 

[hegeh]

Manganese and iron are not the main concern since i had cheato. As we can always dose it / replenished during water change or dose them. My concern is only for the cheato to have enough light throughout and not dying. Else the dead tissue will fly up the display tank or clog the return pump. Also it house for pods and remove nutrient naturally to compete with any algae from DT

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[Bpb]

Chaeto does indeed take up a number of trace elements that may need replenishing depending on how rapidly it grows.

It is also expensive and space consuming to do correctly (as in, not a little soda can sized section in the back of an AIO tank). Requires a lot of light to really thrive (as much or more than you'd want to hit an sps tank with.

It is also messy and annoying to constantly prune (to me anyway, some people don't mind it)

To those who use it, don't get offended. I could make a comparable list to any method of nutrient control. It's just about what you personally favor in your own routine


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[Michael Hoaster]

It's strange, chaeto grows like crazy for some, and just dies for others. The biggest downside for me was getting it in my display, where I never was able to eradicate it. It's not a great display plant.

The big three, macro nutrients it needs are Carbon, Nitrogen and Phosphate. Of the micro nutrients, iron is the most important. All other trace elements can be replenished with fish food, water changes, or dosing.

It's tough for me to offer advice to reefers, since I have a planted tank. I can fully commit to feeding my plants. Reefers who keep plants have to walk a tight rope with nutrients, not letting things get out of hand, affecting corals.

There are other macro algae that work well for nutrient export, if you want to try something other than chaeto. Ulva is fantastic for mopping up excess nutrients, quickly. That makes it a very handy plant in my book. I like a red algae for a steadier nutrient uptaker, like grasilaria. This may be a batter choice for reefers, as it doesn't need a lot of excess nutrients (or light) to grow.

So maybe that's my suggestion for reef keepers. Try grasilaria for nutrient export, over chaeto. It's more slow and steady nature perhaps matches up better with the needs of reef tanks.

 

[bertoni]

From my experience, if Chaetomorpha depletes any important trace elements, water changes are enough to handle the situation. 10-20% a month seems to be fine.

 

[Bpb]

From my experience, if Chaetomorpha depletes any important trace elements, water changes are enough to handle the situation. 10-20% a month seems to be fine.

Good to know. I knew they uptook some but wasn't sure how much


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[SofaSnorkeling]

What are your personal opinions on whether chaeto outcompetes dinos? If chaeto takes up some of the trace that dinos can use might that lower the dino risk is where I'm going w this. Thanks!

 

[Michael Hoaster]

It may. I used ulva to help outcompete my dinos. But that was just one part of my overall anti-dino strategy.

 

[ThRoewer]

This is my algae refugium:

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Originally I had intended to run it with Chaetomorpha but the Chaeto ball would get stuck somewhere or accumulate too much air bubbles and float up. There is still some Chaeto in there, a thick matt that is half-dead on the surface (burned by the H380) that provides shelter and food for pods, snails, and all kind of other useful critters.

I have two other algae tanks on this system, one with a dense mat of Caulerpa and one with more of those red macroalgae. But those tanks also contain fish, shrimp, and anemones.

In total the algae "refugium" volume about equals that of the display.
My PO4 and NO3 are undetectable, yet I still have a host of nuisance algae in the display tank, probably because there was nothing else that took up the real estate. Like in a real reef, no spot remains unsettled, and what isn't occupied by corals or coralline will be claimed by nuisance algae.

 

[bertoni]

Chaetomorpha might help, but I agree that more techniques might be needed, especially at first.

 

[SofaSnorkeling]

This is from the 1st post over in the large thread on R2R...

"œDino's seem to prefer life as autotrophic epiphytes on macro algae "“ chaeto morpha seems to be one of their favorite types to host in"

Sounds like some people think chaeto create a better environment for dino's, god this is confusing for a newbie ;-)

I started this thread in part because I wondering if anyone would mention this. For someone starting a new tank, what are the best methods to avoid dinos in the early stages while cycling ect. I know maybe just running a skimmer and nothing else so water doesnt get too clean. What is the progressional order of things in the anti dino cycle?

 

[Michael Hoaster]

There's a good chance you won't get dinos in your new tank. You will go through an algae phase. In my experience it's best to feed heavily and get it started sooner rather than later. You can delay it by keeping the new tank low nutrient, but you're only delaying the inevitable. The sooner you get to it, the sooner you can get through it.

It's hard to advise you on dinos, because there are many different kinds, and they respond differently to different treatments. I got them, and so began a lot of research. I read A LOT and took notes and listed things to try. What worked for me was a long term strategy that weakened them, concluding with a knock-out combo punch that finished them off.

I can confirm that mine liked to grow on macro algae and seagrass especially.

Good luck with your new tank! I know it's confusing for newbies, but just focus on the basics and choose your own path. One of the cool things about this hobby is that many different techniques work well. You provide the framework, and Mother Nature steps in to fill in the gaps.

 

[bertoni]

I am not sure why feeding heavily to encourage algal growth is a good idea. I would agree that there's often a bloom of microbial algae and the like in a new tank, but those usually (but not always) fade on their own.

 

[Michael Hoaster]

Having done it both ways, I prefer sooner. I got through my algae phase much quicker. Of course you have to perform sound aquarium skills to succeed.

 

[SofaSnorkeling]

Can I ask what kind of dinos you had and how you got rid of them? I imagine it was a combination of things.

I have heard starting with live rock can help avoid dinos, dont like the idea of whatever else might come along with fl keys rock though

 

[Michael Hoaster]

I had dinos that did not harm animals that ate it. So predation was employed with snails and pods-lots of them. I used Ulva and other plants to compete for nutrients. Manual removal and UV were also effective elements of the treatment. After time I wore it down and finished it off with a big manual removal, 3 day blackout, water change-combination.

I don't think I've gotten any dinos from the gulf live rock I use. Live rock does add some uncertainty, but the benefits are huge.

 

[gprdypoo04]

The only success I've had is with halimedia but i don't think it mops up a lot of nutrients. Just uses a lot of calcium.