Cleaner Pack Help ????

[psuedopimp]

it's not like your system is 5 years old. the accumulated junk in your sandbed can't be that bad. i would stir it up in at least thirds to be safe though. let your skimmer pull out as much as it can. i would stir it up right before a water change. when you do your water changes, make sure you're not adding to the problem. that is what i had been doing and my tank started going down hill pretty quick. changed filters, and all is good.

 

[deehz]

Pedro,
I think that for the time it took you to get where you are at, you have done a great job. If for some reason I "offended/attacked" you in anyway, it wasn't that I intended or intentions were of. I do sincerely apologize.

Now, I have to agree with Justin, you are fighting 2 completely separate animals here and if one or the other is not controlled of promptly, it will be b!tch to get rid off. I guess that is what I was trying to get at initially. Garf has some very good prices on cleaner packs. Also, Daniel at The Coral Reef should help you out with this as well. Don't add any more livestock for a couple of months minimum and reduce feedings (your fish and corals will be fine. They can go for days even weeks without a trace of food in the natural ocean.).

If you can, get a filter sock/pad where you can put in phosphate media absorbers and good quality carbon in separate sock/pad. Daniel has this in stock as well. I would put it into the inlet/outlet of your fuge and let the water pass through the media. Change out the media every couple of weeks. Once you start seeing the algae start to recede quite a bit, then you can change out the phosphate media once a month till your sand starts the denitrifying process and the macroalgae in your fuge is healthy enough to start absorbing NO3 and PO4 naturally. This is a sign that the compounds of PO4 are taken out first before the algae can. You will also start seeing a drop in NO3.

I also like Justin's idea of vacuuming out the sand in 1/3rds. It has not established itself yet so by getting rid of the excess waste that has accumulated on the sand is a good idea. It won't harm the fish but would keep a watchful eye on the corals to see how they react. You may get a small spike in NO3. You are doing fine by being proactive. Just be patient and all will clear in time.

Thanks!

 

[pnavarro170]

no worries deehz, im with ya, just didnt know when i didnt take advice through all that. haha. anyways, yeah i siphoned the sand in the front, along with that went 10 gallons of water which was replaced with new. gonna see what it all looks like after the lights are on today for a minimum of 5 hrs. then ill head to the lfs's to see what they got tomorrow since everyone is closed mondays. after that see what i can order online, ill keep updating. just wanting to be proactive, and wished the damn refugium was working the entire time. not just the last week or less. stupid led light strip. haha, so much life in the rufugium finally, plus growth.

 

[bmw_zoan]

What will the sand sifting star do eventually to the sand then??? You think I should get rid of mine then?

 

[deehz]

What will the sand sifting star do eventually to the sand then??? You think I should get rid of mine then?

No, you should not get rid of your sand sifter. They are good for sand beds that are not deep, young sand beds, and eat they consume any waste that the other members of the cleanup crew have not. If they go unharmed, they can keep your sand pretty clean. The downside is that they do prevent the sand from forming bacteria and the beneficial animals that consume waste in your sand. This is why they are not good for DSB/VDSB. They can also be picked on by other fish and hermits; they tend to die rather easy.

 

[bmw_zoan]

Oh I see, well mine seems pretty healthy, and can you please explain what DSB/VDSB is?? I'm kind of new to the hobby

 

[deehz]

Oh I see, well mine seems pretty healthy, and can you please explain what DSB/VDSB is?? I'm kind of new to the hobby

Not a problem.
DSB-deep sand bed. VDSB-very deep sand bed.

Most traditional systems have very little sand (1-2" deep) to no sand at all--bare bottoms. They require maintenance like vacuuming the sand or the "bare glass" periodically. The waste that is "uneaten" by your clean up crew will convert to NO3 and PO4. This can cause diatom "outbreaks" if not controlled of properly (algae/cyano). So, they become a maintenance nuisance. Thus, by the constant maintenance of the sand, you do not get the beneficial animals and bacteria that consume waste, NO3, and PO4 naturally.

On the other hand, DSB and VDSB (sandbeds of 3" +) act like natural filters. Similar to what your live rock does with the little animals and bacterias that live in it. Or what they call tanks with huge amounts of rock, the berlin method. Your rock is a natural filter that consumes waste, nitrates, phosphates, etc. Its the same thing with DSB/VDSB. They accumulate over time beneficial animals and bacteria that consume waste. So they help in the reduction of your nitrogen's in your system.

What people don't like about them is that over time, to much "uneaten" waste has accumulated. They eventually have to "replace" all of the sand. They cannot be siphoned because the introduction of oxygen will wipe out the little critters. Then you have an ammonia spike because of the die off. However, these people that say they are not worth it, are basing their decision on looks v function.

I have not noticed any difference with my sand, it is a DSB (3.5" deep). I actually think they look cool and are beneficial to all tanks. You can actually see the little worms that consume the waste wiggle around in the outside glass of your tank. I actually believe that the DSB has lowered my NO3 quite a bit now that it is fully colonized with little critters and beneficial bacterias. With DSB's, the benefit is also that you can add fish that "bury" themselves such as wrasses and some gobies. It is pretty neat watching my coris wrasse go night night and waking up in the morning--he buries himself when it is time to go to sleep or is threatened.

Here is a little bit more info on it:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/deepsandbeds.htm