clear/white mucus/slime in tank help
- Thread starter noobtothereef
- Start date
I don't think Baking soda would have anything to do with it, but insecticide very possible. The problem is the bacteria in the tank, and the organics feeding them.
So here's another update, and it's great news. I've opened the house up for two days now, and there is absolutely a difference. My filter socks were getting clogged every 4 hours or so, and since this morning - 8 hours later - they are still flowing well! That said, I'm a little ****ed at myself cause I decided to throw down some winterizer fertilizer on the lawn and realized half way through my doors and some windows were open. Still, my tank and filters are looking a lot better.
I'm now 99.9% sure this is an airborne organic issue, but exactly what organic I'm not sure.
I agree Dr. Tim's Re-Fresh would be beneficial, but I think I will only dose half the recommended amount and only for a few days. This will help break down whats in there right now. Then I'm going to use Waste Away, which is where most people see the slime disappear. The more I research, the more I see success from this method.
Oh and open up your home and tell anyone staying there to stop spraying chemicals!
So here's another update, and it's great news. I've opened the house up for two days now, and there is absolutely a difference. My filter socks were getting clogged every 4 hours or so, and since this morning - 8 hours later - they are still flowing well! That said, I'm a little ****ed at myself cause I decided to throw down some winterizer fertilizer on the lawn and realized half way through my doors and some windows were open. Still, my tank and filters are looking a lot better.
I'm now 99.9% sure this is an airborne organic issue, but exactly what organic I'm not sure.
I agree Dr. Tim's Re-Fresh would be beneficial, but I think I will only dose half the recommended amount and only for a few days. This will help break down whats in there right now. Then I'm going to use Waste Away, which is where most people see the slime disappear. The more I research, the more I see success from this method.
Oh and open up your home and tell anyone staying there to stop spraying chemicals!
Ya, I would really try to air out your place. It might not be the same strand, but it still sounds like the same basic issue. My room was humid and a lot of water surface area exposed.
I would keep trying to remove it and clean filter socks and skim heavy if possible. I really think you will notice a difference if you air your place out a few days. If you decide to use Dr. Tims just don't go crazy with dosing.
Good luck.
Success! Remedy free of charge- 4 days after ventilating the place, slime is completely gone.
The only question now is where the airborne organic is coming from, and how to maintain the tanks without keeping open ventilation all the time. If I come up with any other findings, I will make sure to update this thread.
I'm actually thinking about writing a new thread to document my findings and help others deal with this issue without having to go through numerous posts.
But if nothing else, open your home/office/shop and ventilate!
Good luck to you all, and happy reefing.
The only question now is where the airborne organic is coming from, and how to maintain the tanks without keeping open ventilation all the time. If I come up with any other findings, I will make sure to update this thread.
I'm actually thinking about writing a new thread to document my findings and help others deal with this issue without having to go through numerous posts.
But if nothing else, open your home/office/shop and ventilate!
Good luck to you all, and happy reefing.
The exact source could take months or years to know for sure...if ever. The problem about definitively identifying the exact airborne organic source, is I live in a 3500 sg. ft. house with 3 kids, 2 dogs, and a wife.
Specifically, a wife and teenage daughter who have to stay pretty and clean. I'm sure numerous amounts on VOC's are disbursed daily between the two. I had a few talks with them about spraying stuff in the air, but it seems every time I enter a room, mama is spraying the counter with 409 or squirting cleaner gel in the toilet (and letting it set for hours), and the teenager is applying make-up and hairspray.
So the only thing I can do is open the house up as much as possible, and pay attention to my tanks along with what they are using...chemically. It's definitely an eye opener as far as VOC's and toxic chemicals used in the house. I'm also going to look into VOC free cleaners and possibly go that route.
Additionally I'm still not counting out the possibility of mold feeding the bacteria, or VOC's that are more permanent (like paint, ect.).
So here's the thing, the good news is we know this bacteria is an airborne organic feeder, and with enough fresh air we can limit or eliminate it. The problem obviously lies with identifying the actual organic. In a single person strictly controlled environment, that could be relatively simple. However in a less controlled environment with numerous individuals using various chemicals, it's a serious challenge. There is a likely hood in the next few months or so they leave for a week, which would give me some time to test a few things out in a more controlled environment.
All I can do is observe and document, which I will continue to do on a daily basis. Just like any successful reefer, I'm going to take it slow and steady without drastic changes. Eventually I'll figure it out and be sure to share with everyone.
But at least now I'm slime free! :dance:
Hope you guys are to.
Tek
Mr. Vu
I am glad I found this thread. So I have the same problem.
It started after I did a WC and replaced a filter sock which was in there 2 months from the beginning of the tank. It was a brand new sock after rinsing it with RO/DI water. The original sock is where my whole shrimp was in when the tank cycled for the first month. I had added SPS, fish, and everything was perfect and growing until the filter sock swap.
I used some of the water from from this WC in a QT tank and both tanks turned cloudy a day or 2 after. The main tank was the only tank with the slime. The QT tank cleared up on its own after a few days. I was thinking a normal bacteria bloom but the main tank seems to be getting worse. I have since done 2 water changes with no avail and the the corals looked ****ed. Carbon and GFO was replaced just recently and does not seem to help clear up anything.
I am guessing the old filter sock caused an issue after it was disturbed.
It started after I did a WC and replaced a filter sock which was in there 2 months from the beginning of the tank. It was a brand new sock after rinsing it with RO/DI water. The original sock is where my whole shrimp was in when the tank cycled for the first month. I had added SPS, fish, and everything was perfect and growing until the filter sock swap.
I used some of the water from from this WC in a QT tank and both tanks turned cloudy a day or 2 after. The main tank was the only tank with the slime. The QT tank cleared up on its own after a few days. I was thinking a normal bacteria bloom but the main tank seems to be getting worse. I have since done 2 water changes with no avail and the the corals looked ****ed. Carbon and GFO was replaced just recently and does not seem to help clear up anything.
I am guessing the old filter sock caused an issue after it was disturbed.
I am also having the same problem and will try T-Rex's ventilation approach. I added quite a bit of bacteria to the tank during the cycling process and am wondering if that may have contributed to the problem. The strange is that the clear slime was primarily on the outside of the filter socks and not on the inside.
Update:
Okay, so tank was doing great with zero slime, but then yesterday I noticed some slime beginning to form on the top of the tank glass and a little in the filter socks. Just like you said bgold21, it appears to be on the outside of the socks.
So I immediately checked my APEX and sure enough the PH had dropped to 7.91. It has been consistently running 8.2 and only dropping to 8.1 as the low.
I did a a quick cleaning of the glass and fully opened up the house.
Sure enough the slime has subsided and is barely present. Should be completely gone in another day or two, and Ph is rising as well.
I still don't know what causes this, other than its airborne related. I asked my wife if she has used any chemicals out of the ordinary and she said no.
Current Observations:
So I have been keeping a couple windows in the house slightly cracked open to allow some consistent ventilation...super small cracked open when its real cold. The weather has been much warmer this week (until today-it's cooled off again) and my dehumidifier which has a digital reading of humidity has been much higher in that room this last week. Before outbreak I actually lowered the fan speed and started shutting it down at night cause it was reading low and not even filling the drain tank up.
However, the few days prior to the recent slime outbreak (or beginning of one), the dehumidifier was registering high again. Therefore it appears the humidity in the room could have something to do with it.
Another thing to mention. I'm also using an air purifier in the room but I'm not sure its doing much for the issue.
Summary:
In my experience the bacteria seems to bloom in a humid environment. This is proven when nothing had changed (as far as I'm aware) but weather (warm and higher humidity) with dehumidifier showing a higher reading. By opening my home and ventilating it dies off. Also the dehumidifier likely aids in preventing outbreak. However, I believe there is some type VOC (most likely) or spore in my home that feeds the bacteria, particularity when its warm and humid in that room.
Future actions:
I think I'm going to crack open a window in my fish/coral office. I blacked out windows to give it a cool effect, but the lack or ventilation and humidity is an issue. I'm going to change my air purifier filters (there are multiple filters in the purifier). I bought the toxin filter which is for mold and spores, though I'm thinking I should have tried the VOC filter first.
I'll continue to update along the way.
Breakthecycle2
New member
Dr. Tim did a paper on this or was "interviewed" about this or something. He recommends Re Fresh for 14 days at every other day. I did this and it went away and never came back.
I contacted him and he recommended the same to me to include waste away afterwards.
That's awesome it worked permanently for you. Reading some of your posts, it appears carbon dosing is what you attributed bacteria growing in your tank. But I'm not completely clear on what your conditions were or if you continue to maintain your tank and environment the same way as you did in the past.
The only thing I really dose is BRS 2 part, and Mag every once in a while. Parameters are spot on. Dosing 2 part and slime doesn't appear to coincide, as I've actually reduced dosing in the last few weeks (due to water change raising/stabilizing CA and ALK parameters) when I had the small outbreak/bloom. Also hundreds of people use this without issues.
That said there is one small issue in the back of my mind - The salt I used for water changes. I've been off and on using HW Marinemix Reefer salt. I used it around the same time I had the first bloom, and then a week before having the most recent bloom. Slight chance this is actually the fuel to the slime monster, but worth mentioning.
At this point I believe its the damp, warm, stagnant air that allows the bacteria to grow. However the fuel source is a mystery at this point. Possibly something in the salt which I will stop using for now, but more likely some type of VOC or spore.
The way I'm kinda looking at this now is the same condition you need to create fire.
Fuel, heat, oxygen.
In this case I believe its fuel could be VOC's/Spores, heat being a warm and humid environment, and of course oxygen.
I donno, I have a degree in Aeronautics, not Bacteriology. :headwally:
Huh. I had the exact same thing in a little 50 gal in my kitchen. I would definately say it was in a humid environment, but I wouldn't have directly linked them. In my new set up I've done all kinds of stuff differently with better overall results, and indeed a dehumidifier is one of them. I had this stuff along with what I believed to be dinos.
Another thing I did: Stopped doing water changes. I just let it ride despite my reservations. Kept Alk and CA where it needed, to be, plus (IIRC) frequent carbon changes. Took a few weeks but sure enough - it all cleared up.
Another thing I did: Stopped doing water changes. I just let it ride despite my reservations. Kept Alk and CA where it needed, to be, plus (IIRC) frequent carbon changes. Took a few weeks but sure enough - it all cleared up.
My slime is completely gone. I changed my salt to Instant Ocean standard salt added 4 snails, started using a carbon/GFO mix in my reactor (even though my phosphates were 0.0). I also performed a 40% water change with the IO salt and sucked as much of the slime out of the tank with a turkey baster before changing the water. I also opened the front door to the house a few times per day to let more fresh air into the house and changed my air filters to best air filters I could buy at Home Depot. In my situation, I believe my issue had to do with either overseeding the tank with multiple brands of bottled bacteria or the salt that I was using (Red Sea Reef Crystals). I didn't have the patience to test each variable one at a time so I took the kitchen sink approach and changed multiple things close together. While the air quality could have played a part in this, I haven't ventilated the house much over the past 2 weeks since the problem went away and the slime has not returned. My goal was to remove as much nutrients from the water as possible.
Aquamechanic
Member
Wordy post ahead but, I think you may want to take the time to read on ... if this solves the problem for anyone, it was worth the effort.
I have good news, which I will get to in a moment.
So the last post I contributed to this thread (you'll have to dig back to find it) had me convinced that by my client installing a $3000 HEPA filter on his HVAC that would filter the air (surmised to be mold perhaps?) and the slime would cease to exist. Well it worked for a couple weeks then, slime in the newly setup tank returned.
- Keep in mind that the tank has been setup with R.O.D.I zero TDS water immediately converted to marine. No decor, no lighting. Just glass covers, sump, skimmer and powerhead in tank - and slime.
One difference post HEPA filter is that the R.O.D.I barrel in the basement no longer slimmed up. Why?
It had no surface film whatsoever which was an anomaly.
So I drained and cleaned the tank again and filled it with chlorinated tap water this time. Unconditioned. In 2 weeks it was the standard slime-fest again. Freshwater!
Then a very unfortunate-fortunate event occurred. I visited a client that gets service twice weekly on a 15 year old system and out of the blue, they had the dreaded slime. Skimmer stunk like a bag of $#!% ... worse then it ever has. Tank smokey, corals in obvious distress. And *** is the smell in the office? ... Urethane?
So I speak to the office manager and the preceding weekend they had contractors SPRAY ALCOHOL BASED CLEAR COAT on their kitchen cabinetry. BINGO!
It was identical to the dental office that had been experiencing this gunk for 2 years.
So
(to solve the newest issue) I cleaned the skimmer, gave the tank a 10 gallon water change on a 200 gallon (5%) and added 2 lbs of activated carbon in the main flow area of the sump. I confirmed that there was to be no more spraying of solvents in the office (ARG!)
4 days latter the tank was much improved. Slime gone. Smell gone. 80% of coral recovered but some LPS looked receded. Over the next month all coral that appeared stressed after the fact receded to death. No stopping it even after moving some pieces to another system. Lost all brains, flavia and Blasto. Otherwise the tank has recovered. No dead fish, softs, mushrooms or anemones (3 bubbles).
So now I KNOW this is a case of carbon dosing that causes this 'slime syndrome', through some air or water borne source. So I press with the dental office again and while speaking to the Dr., he mentions that they always wipe down the chairs on the office after each patient but it was an organic wipe. I asked him to confirm the ingredients and low and behold, it contained 70% ISO-propal alcohol. Commercial grade cleaner wipes and not a consumer Lysol product. I should add that I never noticed any 'rubbing alcohol' odor in the office during ongoing weekly visits.
Forthcoming info after 2 years of fighting this cause on his behalf. Furthermore, the dental assistant tells me they switched brands of cleaner exactly 2 YEARS AGO!
Epilogue -
The wipes were removed from the equation and in 2 weeks the slimy tank self cleaned. Former slime was now but a white film that is easily wiped away. Just like any haze on the glass after a few days growth.
I have refilled the setup with R.O.D.I. (last week) and will report back if anything changes for the worse again. But I am convinced alcohol vapor was the demon in the room.
I surmise that the barrel stopped getting slime ahead of this discovery because any air exchanged in the basement would be going through the HEPA/ Carbon furnace filter and no longer expose the barrel to carbon dosing. Upstairs there are 4 examination rooms in the vicinity of the aquarium.
Not the brand of salt, not the source water or storage barrel. Not mold in the walls or ventilation. Not something being intentionally added to the tank or bad food, wrong chemicals. Nadda. Alcohol or similar carbon dose IS the problem.
Smile if this gives you an AHA! moment. I hope it does
Cheers
I have good news, which I will get to in a moment.
So the last post I contributed to this thread (you'll have to dig back to find it) had me convinced that by my client installing a $3000 HEPA filter on his HVAC that would filter the air (surmised to be mold perhaps?) and the slime would cease to exist. Well it worked for a couple weeks then, slime in the newly setup tank returned.
- Keep in mind that the tank has been setup with R.O.D.I zero TDS water immediately converted to marine. No decor, no lighting. Just glass covers, sump, skimmer and powerhead in tank - and slime.
One difference post HEPA filter is that the R.O.D.I barrel in the basement no longer slimmed up. Why?
It had no surface film whatsoever which was an anomaly.
So I drained and cleaned the tank again and filled it with chlorinated tap water this time. Unconditioned. In 2 weeks it was the standard slime-fest again. Freshwater!
Then a very unfortunate-fortunate event occurred. I visited a client that gets service twice weekly on a 15 year old system and out of the blue, they had the dreaded slime. Skimmer stunk like a bag of $#!% ... worse then it ever has. Tank smokey, corals in obvious distress. And *** is the smell in the office? ... Urethane?
So I speak to the office manager and the preceding weekend they had contractors SPRAY ALCOHOL BASED CLEAR COAT on their kitchen cabinetry. BINGO!
It was identical to the dental office that had been experiencing this gunk for 2 years.
So
(to solve the newest issue) I cleaned the skimmer, gave the tank a 10 gallon water change on a 200 gallon (5%) and added 2 lbs of activated carbon in the main flow area of the sump. I confirmed that there was to be no more spraying of solvents in the office (ARG!)
4 days latter the tank was much improved. Slime gone. Smell gone. 80% of coral recovered but some LPS looked receded. Over the next month all coral that appeared stressed after the fact receded to death. No stopping it even after moving some pieces to another system. Lost all brains, flavia and Blasto. Otherwise the tank has recovered. No dead fish, softs, mushrooms or anemones (3 bubbles).
So now I KNOW this is a case of carbon dosing that causes this 'slime syndrome', through some air or water borne source. So I press with the dental office again and while speaking to the Dr., he mentions that they always wipe down the chairs on the office after each patient but it was an organic wipe. I asked him to confirm the ingredients and low and behold, it contained 70% ISO-propal alcohol. Commercial grade cleaner wipes and not a consumer Lysol product. I should add that I never noticed any 'rubbing alcohol' odor in the office during ongoing weekly visits.
Forthcoming info after 2 years of fighting this cause on his behalf. Furthermore, the dental assistant tells me they switched brands of cleaner exactly 2 YEARS AGO!
Epilogue -
The wipes were removed from the equation and in 2 weeks the slimy tank self cleaned. Former slime was now but a white film that is easily wiped away. Just like any haze on the glass after a few days growth.
I have refilled the setup with R.O.D.I. (last week) and will report back if anything changes for the worse again. But I am convinced alcohol vapor was the demon in the room.
I surmise that the barrel stopped getting slime ahead of this discovery because any air exchanged in the basement would be going through the HEPA/ Carbon furnace filter and no longer expose the barrel to carbon dosing. Upstairs there are 4 examination rooms in the vicinity of the aquarium.
Not the brand of salt, not the source water or storage barrel. Not mold in the walls or ventilation. Not something being intentionally added to the tank or bad food, wrong chemicals. Nadda. Alcohol or similar carbon dose IS the problem.
Smile if this gives you an AHA! moment. I hope it does
Cheers
Aquamechanic
Member
T-Rex .... check ingredients of any cleaners you are using in the house for alcohol. It is often used in air fresheners and cleaners to distribute them, then evaporate.
Try a carbon air filter IN THE ROOM with the aquarium. I am confident your situation will be similar to mine. VOC's, and most likely Alcohol specifically.
Good luck
I'm fairly sure some of the cleaning products we use contain alcohol, but I will look into them. No air fresheners. I will say on occasion I indulge myself in an alcoholic beverage in my office.
The thing is, I have a 240 gal. tank 10 ft. away at its closest point to one of my affected tanks with open doorways that has never had a hint of slime. Explain that?
Not trying to be sarcastic, it's just kind of mind boggling.
That said I will keep the possibility of alcohol being a factor and I will very likely buy the VOC filter that goes in my air purifier.
As for an update on treating my tanks, I ended up cracking a window open in my office. I have not had a full on slime outbreak since, but I still get what I believe is the beginning of one when the room gets warm and more humid. Best way to describe it is white speckles forming on the top sides of the tank where the water meets the air and glass.
Additionally, I feel I'm pulling out way too much skimate on a daily basis. My bioload is very low for the water volume (close to 400 gal. and only 4 fish). My skimmer is awesome, but emptying on a daily basis is just too much in my opinion. Also, lately I've noticed slightly cloudy water in the morning time or so which clears by around noon. Parameters are spot on - Alk, Ca, Mag., Phos., Nitrate. Along with Ph, ORP, and Sal. staying consistent.
So today I decided to try Dr. Tim's waste away. Even though the slime is gone, I still feel there is something lingering, and too many people including Dr. Tim himself have recommended this. I'm a little nervous cause I have thousands of dollars in SPS coral, but I'm taking the plunge to see if it helps. I turned off the skimmer and dosed half strength as stated in directions.
I'll continue to update my tanks condition. Thanks for everyone's posts and advice.
karimwassef
Active member
maybe run a line of fresh air into the skimmer instead? Inject goodness.
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