Coral Maternity in Portugal
- Thread starter Machado deSousa
- Start date
Machado deSousa
New member
I thought the same, but there are two more tanks on the top shelf of the stand with 200g each, waiting to run and, consequently, more than 2000g per hour would run out of the sediment retainer ...
double0banks
New member
Just finished reading and taking notes. Great setup, truely the best grow out setup that I've seen.
Machado deSousa
New member
I'm glad you like the thread and am pleased you were able to glean some useful information.
Machado, you and your helpers make it look so easy! It would be great to see the steps involved in cutting the glass, setting up the panels for sealing, etc.
On the sediment trap, the velocity is the key to letting detritus fall out. For whatever flowrate you have, you need to get the velocity down to 1 foot per second or so. So with a lot of flow, unfortunately this means a wider tank (longer does not help).
Your design is fine, just bypass some of the flow to another area if possible to slow the flow in that section down a bit.
I forget, do you use commercial supplements or make your own balling mixes? At your volume, you would do well to buy large food grade sacks of those chemicals you are using
On the sediment trap, the velocity is the key to letting detritus fall out. For whatever flowrate you have, you need to get the velocity down to 1 foot per second or so. So with a lot of flow, unfortunately this means a wider tank (longer does not help).
Your design is fine, just bypass some of the flow to another area if possible to slow the flow in that section down a bit.
I forget, do you use commercial supplements or make your own balling mixes? At your volume, you would do well to buy large food grade sacks of those chemicals you are using
Machado deSousa
New member
The guys have really done a good job.
Unfortunately, I have no pics showing such steps but I can try to explain you how it was done:
There was a single hole on the pane which separate the compartment (1) from the remaining sump. The first step was to obstruct it with a little piece of glass fixed on the submerged side of the sump using epoxy because it hardens down the water. With the hole obstructed there wasn’t any problem emptying the compartment (1).
To drill the new holes we needed the opposite side of the pan without water. So, the second step as to fix a rectangular piece of glass, vertically, with epoxy all around (bottom and both vertical sides) to create the "dried column".
The third step was to empty the corner getting this way the empty space in the â€Âthe dried columnâ€Â. After that, all 3 holes could be drilled.
The fourth step was to refill the compartment (1) with water coming from the sump while adding the same volume of new saltwater to the system to compensate.
After the compartment (1) and sediment retainer be refilled with water, the upper part of the glass, referred in the second scheme of my post as “to be broken after the holes doneâ€Â, could be broken to enlarge the channel.
I should post some pics of the corner viewed from above.
I agree with you when you say that the velocity is the key to letting detritus fall out but not when you say that longer does not help.
The key of this retainer is his particular design. The water is forced to flow upward and backward and the sediments tend to fall down when the water rises (and slowly flows over the parallel backward glasses). The longer the sediment retainer the slower the water rising. The same happens with larger retainers. JMO.
The up-spring effect on the water surface produced by the upward flowing water in a laminar regime is very, very nice! My last shot gives a small idea how it does.
The problem is that I need to prepare the sump for the next upgrades. I have two more tanks wating for to run and by now 2,000g wuold bypass the sediment retainer and with the next tanks running much more water wuold bypass.
I buy the main products 30 pounds bulks.<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14474135#post14474135 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by H20ENG
I forget, do you use commercial supplements or make your own balling mixes? At your volume, you would do well to buy large food grade sacks of those chemicals you are using
Cheers,
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Thanks Machado,
By "longer does not help", I mean that if the water is flowing at 5fps over the first baffle, at the end of a hundred baffles, the flow would still be the same. Thus the detritus would still be carried with it, and not settle.
Increasing the cross sectional area for a given flowrate is the only way to slow the velocity. That is why I mentioned wider not longer I know you are well versed in the mechanics of water flow
I am also curious as to the amount of detritus you get from just corals, and its consistency? I know you have some fish and mangroves too.
Thanks for your reply,
Chris
By "longer does not help", I mean that if the water is flowing at 5fps over the first baffle, at the end of a hundred baffles, the flow would still be the same. Thus the detritus would still be carried with it, and not settle.
Increasing the cross sectional area for a given flowrate is the only way to slow the velocity. That is why I mentioned wider not longer
I know you are well versed in the mechanics of water flowI am also curious as to the amount of detritus you get from just corals, and its consistency? I know you have some fish and mangroves too.
Thanks for your reply,
Chris
simmons797
New member
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14482146#post14482146 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by H20ENG
Thanks Machado,
By "longer does not help", I mean that if the water is flowing at 5fps over the first baffle, at the end of a hundred baffles, the flow would still be the same. Thus the detritus would still be carried with it, and not settle.
Increasing the cross sectional area for a given flowrate is the only way to slow the velocity. That is why I mentioned wider not longer
I am also curious as to the amount of detritus you get from just corals, and its consistency? I know you have some fish and mangroves too.
Thanks for your reply,
Chris
A longer tank is exactly what would work. Look at the construction again and the flow pattern.
Machado deSousa
New member
Chris, thank you for your reply, I'm liking very much to talk with you about this issue. I saw your profile and I think that I can learn a lot with your skills and experience.
Ok, H20ENG, I understand what you are saying but I think I have not explained clearly my point of view, may be because English is not my mother language. When I say that the velocity of the water reduces for a longer sediment retainer I am not talking about horizontal water flowing. I'm just talking about the ascensional water flowing between the baffles in the sediment retainer. In this case, the cross sectional area is S = distance between the baffles x retainer width x number of baffles. So, having a longer retainer = more baffles = more cross sectional area = lower velocity in the rising water.
I like to feed my corals and fishes and after some time the detritus have tendency to accumulate. I have no precipitations. My mangroves were a bonsai before be moved to my prop. They are more then 15 years old, but actually they are free to grow because I have space over them.
Thanks for your comments,
Cheers,
...<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14482146#post14482146 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by H20ENG
..Increasing the cross sectional area for a given flowrate is the only way to slow the velocity. That is why I mentioned wider not longer
Ok, H20ENG, I understand what you are saying but I think I have not explained clearly my point of view, may be because English is not my mother language. When I say that the velocity of the water reduces for a longer sediment retainer I am not talking about horizontal water flowing. I'm just talking about the ascensional water flowing between the baffles in the sediment retainer. In this case, the cross sectional area is S = distance between the baffles x retainer width x number of baffles. So, having a longer retainer = more baffles = more cross sectional area = lower velocity in the rising water.
I like to feed my corals and fishes and after some time the detritus have tendency to accumulate. I have no precipitations. My mangroves were a bonsai before be moved to my prop. They are more then 15 years old, but actually they are free to grow because I have space over them.
Thanks for your comments,
Cheers,
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Machado deSousa
New member
Hi logan!
Using ATI Aquablue Spezial (60%) and Blue Plus (40%) I have good growths and the visual effect is not so nice. If I don't worry about growth I like 50% each to get more colorful corals.
Cheers,
Using ATI Aquablue Spezial (60%) and Blue Plus (40%) I have good growths and the visual effect is not so nice. If I don't worry about growth I like 50% each to get more colorful corals.
Cheers,
Machado,
Thanks for the reply. I went back and looked again closely at your design. I thought that your baffles were touching at the bottom, at which all the flow would simply flow past the tops of them. My apologies for my haste. :sad1:
Yes, in your configuration, longer would make for slower velocity. It would be better to have no flow along the bottom to give the detritus a chance to settle completely, but I completely understand the lack of space to do so.
This pic got me.
This one made it clear.
Thanks for the reply. I went back and looked again closely at your design. I thought that your baffles were touching at the bottom, at which all the flow would simply flow past the tops of them. My apologies for my haste. :sad1:
Yes, in your configuration, longer would make for slower velocity. It would be better to have no flow along the bottom to give the detritus a chance to settle completely, but I completely understand the lack of space to do so.
This pic got me.
This one made it clear.
fair standards
In Memoriam
First off Machado, let me say that what you are doing is terrific and i wish that more people would take the attitude about the hobby that you do.
Now, as to RC calling you a commercial venture......I'm passing this question on to the department of Labor because the Reef Central rules only state the following:
Reef Central defines “commercial post†as knowing and willful posts made by private individuals or businesses, directly or indirectly seeking commerce. Additionally, posts made by individuals or businesses in regard to other commercial activities, in anticipation of direct or indirect economic benefit or relief from the subject activity, will generally be regarded as “commercial.â€Â
They then go on to state that RC gets to decide who is actually a commercial entity and who is not.
Now I specifically know that certain individuals that are not in ANY LEGAL WAY considered a business have been branded a commercial vendor by RC. Additionally, I know that there are certain individuals that have a "special" relationship with RC and that have a much larger and much more "for profit" operation have been allowed to stay on the boards.
So, unless RC gets off their butts and finally make a decision as to what defines a commercial entity and what does not, they have no right to deny anyone the right to operate on the boards. If there is any abuse to this policy, please send an email to fairstandardsact@gmail.com.
Now, I'm sure RC is going to stifle this post but, by law, they can not inhibit free speech........especially since this does not go against any of their rules. So, as soon as I see that this post has been removed or closed, I will also pass this on to the department of labor and the FCC. If necessary, they can be brought up on charges of unfair business practices.
Now, as to RC calling you a commercial venture......I'm passing this question on to the department of Labor because the Reef Central rules only state the following:
Reef Central defines “commercial post†as knowing and willful posts made by private individuals or businesses, directly or indirectly seeking commerce. Additionally, posts made by individuals or businesses in regard to other commercial activities, in anticipation of direct or indirect economic benefit or relief from the subject activity, will generally be regarded as “commercial.â€Â
They then go on to state that RC gets to decide who is actually a commercial entity and who is not.
Now I specifically know that certain individuals that are not in ANY LEGAL WAY considered a business have been branded a commercial vendor by RC. Additionally, I know that there are certain individuals that have a "special" relationship with RC and that have a much larger and much more "for profit" operation have been allowed to stay on the boards.
So, unless RC gets off their butts and finally make a decision as to what defines a commercial entity and what does not, they have no right to deny anyone the right to operate on the boards. If there is any abuse to this policy, please send an email to fairstandardsact@gmail.com.
Now, I'm sure RC is going to stifle this post but, by law, they can not inhibit free speech........especially since this does not go against any of their rules. So, as soon as I see that this post has been removed or closed, I will also pass this on to the department of labor and the FCC. If necessary, they can be brought up on charges of unfair business practices.
2farNorth
In Memoriam
Not sure if I wanted to get in the middle of this, but I think 'Machado deSousa' said it best when someone asked what he does with all the frags......
his reply was ----
A little more research would help your case......
Even though I personally know RC members that have been banned because of being accused 'commercial', RC makes the rules.... and they have the right to not let any of us post on the boards if they feel the need...
Free speech, yes... but when it is on a privately run site, you are a guest here, enjoy the hobby, and play by the rules..... even if there are 'gray areas'
Over an hour and a half, I'm really surprised that there hasn't been a response..... from anyone! (well besides me!!)
his reply was ----
A little more research would help your case......
Even though I personally know RC members that have been banned because of being accused 'commercial', RC makes the rules.... and they have the right to not let any of us post on the boards if they feel the need...
Free speech, yes... but when it is on a privately run site, you are a guest here, enjoy the hobby, and play by the rules..... even if there are 'gray areas'
Over an hour and a half, I'm really surprised that there hasn't been a response..... from anyone! (well besides me!!)
Machado deSousa
New member
Hi Chris, as I wrote before, this design is not mine. I was inspired in a Delbeek and J. Sprung book.
Thanks for your reply.
Cheers,
Machado deSousa
New member
Hi folks,
I would like to take a moment and thank everyone for helping to make this thread what it is (was)...just in case...
Cheers,
I would like to take a moment and thank everyone for helping to make this thread what it is (was)...just in case...
Cheers,
By actually posting in this section, or in any other section and putting up a photograph of your newly bought wanderfully bright amazing coral that everyone else is envious you have. You automatically have every reefer in your area giving you a pm asking when you frag it to keep them in mind.....
So if you post on here and show you have twenty frags of a certain group of corals you assume they will someday go out the door, either sold or traded.
Either way I'm glad I don't make the rules and have to enforce them.
Just wish we had half the colourful corals you guys seem to get...
and at the cheap prices you pay. Try $120 for a brown small Ricordea single polp...
Great site and some amazing experiences being shared on here!
Rob
So if you post on here and show you have twenty frags of a certain group of corals you assume they will someday go out the door, either sold or traded.
Either way I'm glad I don't make the rules and have to enforce them.
Just wish we had half the colourful corals you guys seem to get...
and at the cheap prices you pay. Try $120 for a brown small Ricordea single polp...
Great site and some amazing experiences being shared on here!
Rob
Hi Fairstandards and welcome (back?) to RC.
Two problems with your post above.
1. Nowhere does the <a href=http://reefcentral.com/agreement.php target=_blank>User Agreement</a> state you have to be a "business" and that's by design.
2. You clearly do not understand our <a href=http://reefcentral.com/agreement.php target=_blank>User Agreement</a> and what it is trying to do. Nobody is saying commercial people can't be on RC. We're saying commercial people cannot use our forums to sell things. The only exception to that is for our sponsors who are limited to selling within their sponsor forums. There are many, many commercial members of RC...they just know and understand the rules of what they can post about.
This is a privately owned site and the very User Agreement you signed when joining (again) states that we have the right to remove any member for any reason. If the owner of RC decided tomorrow that he only wanted postings about chocolate chip cookies and would ban everyone that doesn't post about them, he can do that.
You should really read up on what your "right to free speech" means. It clearly does not mean what you think it means.
:lol: The department of labor...now that's the funniest thing we've been threatened with in a long, long time. Thanks for the chuckle this morning. Oh and, reference again my statement above about this being a privately owned site.
Two problems with your post above.
1. Nowhere does the <a href=http://reefcentral.com/agreement.php target=_blank>User Agreement</a> state you have to be a "business" and that's by design.
2. You clearly do not understand our <a href=http://reefcentral.com/agreement.php target=_blank>User Agreement</a> and what it is trying to do. Nobody is saying commercial people can't be on RC. We're saying commercial people cannot use our forums to sell things. The only exception to that is for our sponsors who are limited to selling within their sponsor forums. There are many, many commercial members of RC...they just know and understand the rules of what they can post about.
This is a privately owned site and the very User Agreement you signed when joining (again) states that we have the right to remove any member for any reason. If the owner of RC decided tomorrow that he only wanted postings about chocolate chip cookies and would ban everyone that doesn't post about them, he can do that.
You should really read up on what your "right to free speech" means. It clearly does not mean what you think it means.
:lol: The department of labor...now that's the funniest thing we've been threatened with in a long, long time. Thanks for the chuckle this morning. Oh and, reference again my statement above about this being a privately owned site.
