Coral / QT & Ich?
- Thread starter yachtdr22
- Start date
What to do now....????
The 375 system has Ich.
The 375 tank is getting replaced in 2 weeks. Therefore, it will need to be emptied. I have a Purple Tang and a Blonde Naso that are in the 75 gal QT. They are now 4 weeks clean (had Ich, treated w/ cupramine) waiting to go into the 375.
The current swimmers in the 375 are: Sailfin, Foxface, Marine Beta, Flame Hawk, Long Nose Hawk, 5) PJ Cardinals. They will need to be treated too.
Since the tank has to come down and all contents emptied, is there anyway around the 10 week fallow period?
The 375 system has Ich.
The 375 tank is getting replaced in 2 weeks. Therefore, it will need to be emptied. I have a Purple Tang and a Blonde Naso that are in the 75 gal QT. They are now 4 weeks clean (had Ich, treated w/ cupramine) waiting to go into the 375.
The current swimmers in the 375 are: Sailfin, Foxface, Marine Beta, Flame Hawk, Long Nose Hawk, 5) PJ Cardinals. They will need to be treated too.
Since the tank has to come down and all contents emptied, is there anyway around the 10 week fallow period?
Deinonych
New member
If you are replacing the 375 with a new tank, I'm assuming you are keeping the rock, correct? If so, you will still need to leave it fallow for 10 weeks. Crypto cysts could be attached to the rock. If you are doing a complete rebuild with new sand, rock etc. then you don't have to leave it fallow. Of course, it might take 10 weeks once the system is fully cycled and ready to receive livestock. 
Holding any fish in a LFS fish system is going to greatly increase the odds of incurring a parasite.
I have 2 questions...
First... Is there such a thing as an Ich free tank, or does Ich survive in some form ?
Second... How do you know?
If the purpose of quarantine is observation and fish appears clear for 5 weeks, is it assumed that fish is Ich free?
If all fish in a tank appear to be clean for 3 months, than can it be assumed that all the crytons have expired because they did not find a host? Or, can fish host and not show signs? If that is the case, then how is observation a indication of contamination??
First... Is there such a thing as an Ich free tank, or does Ich survive in some form ?
Second... How do you know?
If the purpose of quarantine is observation and fish appears clear for 5 weeks, is it assumed that fish is Ich free?
If all fish in a tank appear to be clean for 3 months, than can it be assumed that all the crytons have expired because they did not find a host? Or, can fish host and not show signs? If that is the case, then how is observation a indication of contamination??
Spar
New member
Yes, there is a such thing as an Ich-free tank. If you do the proper QT protocol on everything. This includes fish, coral, live rock, macro algae, CUC, etc, etc, etc.
How do you know? You don't really, except for the day you see your fish flashing and/or start seeing spots. Otherwise, you are just under the assumption that it is Ich-free. I am in that state. There were things I skimped on early on in my new tank's life, such as only running fallow for 30 days instead of 72+. But, so far so good for me (knocking on wood right now...).
Observation is the least effective of all QT methods. In order of effectiveness, IMO, it is Tank Transfer Method (near 100% effective), then Copper, then Hypo, then Observation.
Deinonych
New member
+1
Best to assume all new fish have crypto and run them through tank transfer to eliminate that possibility.
I agree.
It is conceptually difficult to 'prove' the absence of something. A healthy, symptom free fish population over an extended period of time is reasonable evidence that the tank is ich free, but not a guarantee.i choose to just observe most fish in QT, and make a similar assumption ..... but, again, no guarantee.
Where is the sticky with the Tank Transfer Method Details?
I am getting over an Ich outbreak brought in by infected Coral (Coral was treated w/ RX)
Does Coral need to go Fallow in a Coral tank? for how long? 8 weeks?
What do we do about Inverts? Shrimp?
Do we TTM them?
Thanks all!
I am getting over an Ich outbreak brought in by infected Coral (Coral was treated w/ RX)
Does Coral need to go Fallow in a Coral tank? for how long? 8 weeks?
What do we do about Inverts? Shrimp?
Do we TTM them?
Thanks all!
The main TTM thread can be found here: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1996525
However, TT is only useful to clear FISH of ich. For corals/inverts, you need to isolate them in a fishless environment for 72 days. I use my frag tank for this purpose.
However, TT is only useful to clear FISH of ich. For corals/inverts, you need to isolate them in a fishless environment for 72 days. I use my frag tank for this purpose.
I see the TT discussion, but i dont see where steve has his instructions for the whole procedure?
I will isolate the corals and inverts for 10 weeks....
He wrote this sticky: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2388428
But if you're looking for a step by step, hvacman laid it out pretty nicely here:
Personally, I use vinegar instead of bleach. And the whole doing it the morning thing is not necessary, so long as you don't exceed 72 hrs between transfers.
Good Morning,
In a few hours the new swimmers will be coming out of their first round of TTM.(12 Firefish, Bluejaw, Jester gobi, lamrick angel)
I had received peppermint shrimp, Cleaner shrimp, Sand sifting Star, Mangroves and Coral.
The Coral was all dipped and in their own tank fallow for 10 weeks.
I wasnt dipping the Shrimp, SF or mangroves so i put them in with the fish.
I was planning on putting the inverts & mangroves in with the coral (fallow for 10wks)
or shall i keep the inverts with the fish and continue them through the TTM and into the QT?
Thoughts? recommendations?
thanks
Drew
In a few hours the new swimmers will be coming out of their first round of TTM.(12 Firefish, Bluejaw, Jester gobi, lamrick angel)
I had received peppermint shrimp, Cleaner shrimp, Sand sifting Star, Mangroves and Coral.
The Coral was all dipped and in their own tank fallow for 10 weeks.
I wasnt dipping the Shrimp, SF or mangroves so i put them in with the fish.
I was planning on putting the inverts & mangroves in with the coral (fallow for 10wks)
or shall i keep the inverts with the fish and continue them through the TTM and into the QT?
Thoughts? recommendations?
thanks
Drew
Newsmyrna80
Active member
I QT all inverts, LR and coral for at least 72 days. An unquarantined sea urchin brought in brook.
wooden_reefer
New member
TTM does not address the issue of supporting ALL your fish for 12 weeks for the DT to fallow. When ich has already broken out in DT, TTM is generally not useful.
You need to support all you fish for 12 weeks. Robustly cycled medium for this purpose is both often sufficient and necessary.
If a drug that harms nitrification does not have to be used, then it is always sufficient and necessary. There is no vague concept of a "mature tank" and one has to stock slowly, only a tank having robustly cycled medium; the greatest possible bioload will still be supported at once after that.
Cycling robustly to support 10-20 times the greatest possible bioload in QT is what I do routinely and by nature, automatically. I am not a fan of TTM as the primary method against ich.
If your display tank is free of cryptocaryon irritans, TTM is the best method to avoid adding it to your display tank. If it is not, you will have to treat the display tank by leaving it fallow (without fish) for 72 days.
wooden_reefer
New member
Even if the DT is not already infested with ich, TTM can only be regarded as an adjunct method, not the main method.
If a fish obviously cannot take copper, TTM should then be method considered.
Moving fish around is often not a good idea because it disrupts their adaptation (can also lead to external bacterial infection), which is one of two broad considerations for QT (the other being disease treatment, many diseases not just ich)
At least one should address the issue of ammonia in TTM. It is feasible to remove ammonia in TTM without WC or chemicals, but such is not often mentioned.
Last, it is precisely because ich can break out in DT that the skill to do TTM is far less valuable.
After one has successfully fought against ich and eradicated ich in DT, I believe one would not like TTM much. Once the skill to methodically with little work eradicate ich is acquired, TTM will be much less attractive to an aquarist.
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