Coral wholesalers who sell to non store front businesses?

[dahenley]

why not drive to a local wholesaler and pick up the corals. this would save on shipping, doa, and allow you to pick out better corals. talk to a few i have.

there are so many ways to sell corals its crazy, you have your local clubs, craigslist, ebay, frag swaps, forums like this, etc, etc. get creative and go for it, you dont have rent, ee's to pay for, and probably wont make this your primary business. it takes very little start up money to do what your talking about,

this is a great idea if you lived near LAX (where 99% of coral/fish imports come in through)

here in Texas, thats not as easy. especially since there are minimal wholesalers within driving distance. (or less then the economical cost of driving)

 

[shrimphead]

i live in the uk and the main wholesaler for lfs's to get their corals from is tmc. a lfs i knew said when he started importing corals directly from indonesia everything was turning up dead because the people on the other end didn't know how to pack stuff, he ended up going to indonesia to show them how to do it. but in the end he probably has some of the nicest corals i have seen for sale. i think what you need to do is import directly from the source which involves BULK purchasing more work, risk, permits and stuff but if you can find the right distributor i would say it could work well. i'm not talking from experience though. and i take it the people who mention wholesalers are talking about wholesales in the US not from the source (indonesia ect) is that right ?

 

[alexandernewell]

Location really doesn't have much to do with what you can get. Its more about the relationship you build with your supplier. Everyone in this thread seems to express the opinion that if you don't live in California then everything you get will be green or brown undesirables. That is simply a falsehood. A supplier who sends out crappy corals doesn't get return business. Granted that if you are a new customer you won't get the choicest pieces but you can still get gems and things that will become gems with the proper care and lighting. I have seen plenty of trashy brown acros become beautiful over a few weeks. I have also seen plenty die off but that comes with the territory.

Moral of the story, Just because someone "cherry picks" a wholesaler doesn't mean that what they got will stay that way and the non cherry pieces won't always stay that way. Anyone one here can attest to how dynamic corals can be.

Price points: wholesaler prices will be 1/2-1/3 of retail prices. The retail markup is mostly dependent on the amount of dry goods the store sells. Its the dry stuff where they make their money. The live stuff is there to sell the dry stuff. If you buy a frag at 1/3 retail and sold it for 1/2 retail you would make money if you had zero overhead but shipping/loss/time/quarantines/holding systems all cost money. If your markup is only about 30% and your an exceptional keeper you will be lucky to break even. This is acceptable if your doing it further your maintenance operation by making yourself more desirable to future customers but as an alternate revenue stream your final price point needed to cover costs will be close to retail prices.

Scouring sites and stores looking for great pieces you are comfortable you can maintain is the most cost effective way to start. It doesn't matter how much you spend on a mother colony if you can keep it alive for several years and it makes you lots of frags. Its a much slower form of growth but as they say "nothing good ever happens fast in saltwater."

 

[Jeremy Blaze]

Everyone in this thread seems to express the opinion that if you don't live in California then everything you get will be green or brown undesirables. That is simply a falsehood. QUOTE]



I never said anything like that.

 

[dahenley]

Everyone in this thread seems to express the opinion that if you don't live in California then everything you get will be green or brown undesirables. That is simply a falsehood. QUOTE]



I never said anything like that.

Me either!
but i do know people that order from wholesale places, (most of which are from the West Coast). The do offer a Super nice piece every now and then, but most of the stuff is just nice. (and the bargan stuff is the "brown and green" )

you just dont get to go to the wholesaler personally, and view for your self, and "cherry Pick" what you want.

and your right. you have to build a relationship with your rep, and they do throw you a sweet shipment every now and then, but they also have to unload the mass "normal" stuff.

 

[MrineLfRlz]

Ive read this thread and it does seem very risky. But even as a hobbiest if you sell over X- Amount of coral or fish a year i was told you will still need to get a liscense because you can get into trouble for selling to much without one? So isnt it a good thing to at least get a reseller or retailer liscense or LLC?
Or was i totally misinformed? Can someone set me straight thanks.

 

[albano]

Ive read this thread and it does seem very risky. But even as a hobbiest if you sell over X- Amount of coral or fish a year i was told you will still need to get a liscense because you can get into trouble for selling to much without one? So isnt it a good thing to at least get a reseller or retailer liscense or LLC?
Or was i totally misinformed? Can someone set me straight thanks.

get in trouble with who? RC? State Tax Dept.? IRS? ...
all the above?

Which are you worried about...sounds like you'll need a license!

 

[MrineLfRlz]

get in trouble with who? RC? State Tax Dept.? IRS? ...
all the above?

Which are you worried about...sounds like you'll need a license!

yes IRS and state taxe Dept i was wanting to find out how much you can accually get away with selling before you need a liscense?

 

[Jeremy Blaze]

Anyone buying at wholesale and reselling needs do be licsensed at least with the state. Regardless of volume.

 

[dahenley]

if your just selling locally, then you dont need one. BUT, if your selling over "X" amount, then you "SHOULD" file taxes and list it. which would be nice to have a business license and would/might be better for you. (if thats what your asking)

 

[MrineLfRlz]

Thanks for everyones replys my question was accually how much is the average "X" amount you can sell before getting into trouble if you were to become a big coral farmer?

 

[Jeremy Blaze]

Thanks for everyones replys my question was accually how much is the average "X" amount you can sell before getting into trouble if you were to become a big coral farmer?

Hard to say. Thats like asking how much weed you can sell before you get busted.

There are many basement sellers selling tons of stuff that never get in trouble. But it just takes one unhappy customer, or one unhappy store owner to call the IRS, the state revenue, the wholesaler, etc... to get you in trouble.

 

[dahenley]

i dont think the coral industry is any different the little johnny mowing lawns....
if you check your IRS 1040 (i think thats the one that asks about side jobs under or over 600$ mark????)

i think its in the 600$ range. that if your contract labor, and you make less then that, you dont have to report it, and over that you do. (should)

 

[MrineLfRlz]

i dont think the coral industry is any different the little johnny mowing lawns....
if you check your IRS 1040 (i think thats the one that asks about side jobs under or over 600$ mark????)

i think its in the 600$ range. that if your contract labor, and you make less then that, you dont have to report it, and over that you do. (should)

thank you for that but would it be better at taxe season if i sold more then 600 if i had a license or just to report it? in other words would i benefit at taxe season if i had a license or do i need to make alot of money before getting one to be a benefit?

 

[AquaticFins]

A state sales tax license is not something that will help or hurt at "tax season."

It's simply required. Your profile says you live in Missouri; there is no amount of coral you can legally sell at retail (to the consumer) without a sales tax license. Doing so is a crime.

Here's the relevant statute. It applies both to corporations and individuals. http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/C100-199/1440000118.HTM

You could try to make the argument that you're not engaged in the business of selling coral. If you're not attempting to make a profit, you can sell up to $3,000 worth of your coral collection (and/or other belongings; $3,000 in total) a year in MO before you're required to collect sales tax. With that said, if you have to ask the question...you're probably not going to be winning that argument with the Missouri Department of Revenue.

Here's a FAQ page from the Missouri Department of Revenue that should help answer your questions on a state level. http://dor.mo.gov/faq/business/register.php

 

[dahenley]

good informaion.

on a second note... if you have a business, you can claim store use or business losses, and buy things easier.
so, it may help more then you think. and in Texas, its easy to get your business and wholesale license. and cheap, so why wouldnt you.
and if you have it, you dont have to use it... it can just sit until your larger or need it. you just file the same paperwork with no purchases or losses so no ill effects.

 

[A.T.T.R]

Around 25 bucks per coral landed shipped from indo ( it's actualy cheaper shipping from indo then from inside the states



Also good luck finding a wholesaler that is worth anything

Issue is when some one sells to public they get boycotted by the stores
See if an Lfs will let you buy boxes from them and charge you a fee to tack on your order

 

[MrineLfRlz]

A state sales tax license is not something that will help or hurt at "tax season."

It's simply required. Your profile says you live in Missouri; there is no amount of coral you can legally sell at retail (to the consumer) without a sales tax license. Doing so is a crime.

Here's the relevant statute. It applies both to corporations and individuals. http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/C100-199/1440000118.HTM

You could try to make the argument that you're not engaged in the business of selling coral. If you're not attempting to make a profit, you can sell up to $3,000 worth of your coral collection (and/or other belongings; $3,000 in total) a year in MO before you're required to collect sales tax. With that said, if you have to ask the question...you're probably not going to be winning that argument with the Missouri Department of Revenue.

Here's a FAQ page from the Missouri Department of Revenue that should help answer your questions on a state level. http://dor.mo.gov/faq/business/register.php

good informaion.

on a second note... if you have a business, you can claim store use or business losses, and buy things easier.
so, it may help more then you think. and in Texas, its easy to get your business and wholesale license. and cheap, so why wouldnt you.
and if you have it, you dont have to use it... it can just sit until your larger or need it. you just file the same paperwork with no purchases or losses so no ill effects.

thanks for the heads up getting a license is going to be the best move for me i think as i get bigger then i will definitely be doing this.

 

[ERICinFL]

Glad I stumbled across this thread. I've considered starting a tank maintenance business to do on the side, mainly to support my tank and perhaps put a few extra bucks in my pocket. I'm fortunate enough to have a wholesaler about 15min. from my house and ORA is an hour drive South. I've done some poking around, looking for wholesalers that will sell to home based businesses. It's kind of a toss up. From what I've noticed, most places that strictly wholesale, will only sell to a traditional, storefront based business, where as the wholesalers who also sell retail, are generally a little more lenient. It's interesting to note, that the wholesale/retailers tend to charge anywhere from 15-20% more, over the straight wholesaler. I learned this after speaking to a gentleman that ran a wholesale/retail aquarium supply store. He also told me, that some businesses claiming to wholesale to home based businesses, are actually a retail in disguise. He said all they do, is mark down the retail price a few bucks. It's more of a scam than anything else, because they know how difficult it can be to find an actual wholesaler and they exploit that.

I don't know if you've made any progress with your business, as this thread was started a while ago, but just thought I'd share those little tid bits of info.

 

[Jeremy Blaze]

Glad I stumbled across this thread. I've considered starting a tank maintenance business to do on the side, mainly to support my tank and perhaps put a few extra bucks in my pocket. I'm fortunate enough to have a wholesaler about 15min. from my house and ORA is an hour drive South. I've done some poking around, looking for wholesalers that will sell to home based businesses. It's kind of a toss up. From what I've noticed, most places that strictly wholesale, will only sell to a traditional, storefront based business, where as the wholesalers who also sell retail, are generally a little more lenient. It's interesting to note, that the wholesale/retailers tend to charge anywhere from 15-20% more, over the straight wholesaler. I learned this after speaking to a gentleman that ran a wholesale/retail aquarium supply store. He also told me, that some businesses claiming to wholesale to home based businesses, are actually a retail in disguise. He said all they do, is mark down the retail price a few bucks. It's more of a scam than anything else, because they know how difficult it can be to find an actual wholesaler and they exploit that.I don't know if you've made any progress with your business, as this thread was started a while ago, but just thought I'd share those little tid bits of info.

Many brick and morter pet stores probably think a guy selling out of his basement, while getting wholesale stock is a scam as well.