Cross Breeding Clowns??

[kindler]

I was looking at trying something new. I was wanting to try cross breeding a Gold & Maroon with a Black & White. Has anyone tried this? What is the best pairing; not that they might change? Gold & Maroon male with Black & white female in hopes to keep the maroon smaller and less aggressive or Gold & Maroon female with Black & White male? Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Scott

 

[BonsaiNut]

Species?

 

[deangelr]

Crossbreeding clown obviously works.. I have no experience doing this although I have seen maroons crossbred.

IMO I would make the maroon the larger clown and hope that turns female. This is because the maroon reguardless of size is likely to be more aggressive. Seems to make sense that the more agressive fish would be more dominant and therfore female..

just IMO

 

[kindler]

Percula.

Scott

 

[deangelr]

Species?

assuming he means maroons and ocelaris

 

[deangelr]

oops nevermind

 

[kindler]

Species?

Well I guess its both Perc and Osc the Black would be Perc and Maroon Osc at least I think it's an Osc

 

[velvetelvis]

There's no such thing as a maroon ocellaris. Maroon clownfish are Premnas biactuleatus--clownfish that will grow very large (about 6"-7") and very aggressive. There are several clownfish species that have melanistic (black) forms, but when people refer to black and white clownfish they usually mean black ocellaris, Amphiprion ocellaris. These are the same species as the familiar orange "Nemo" clownfish, just a different color.

Ocellaris get to be about 3" long and can be aggressive when sexually mature and breeding, but usually nothing like maroons. Ocellaris are also sometimes called "false perculas", which can lead to confusion, but perculas are a different, though related, species.

If you're interested in breeding clownfish, check out Joyce Wilkerson's book, "Clownfishes". This will give you detailed information on the different clownfish species and their dispositions, care, breeding, and raising.

 

[JHemdal]

So I think I understand that the OP wants to cross a gold striped maroon clown with a black/white ocellaris. I haven't heard of this being done and have never kept the fish together myself. Cross genera hybrids *do* show up from time to time, but are much less common than crosses between more similar species of the same genus. I agree that if you want to try this, go with a large ocellaris and a very small maroon, but I doubt that it will work....

Jay

 

[Costa reefing]

There's no such thing as a maroon ocellaris.

ahhh but there is, look up cocoa clownfish

Proaquatix achieved this with a female white-striped maroon and a male black ocellaris according to their website

Not many people have achieved hybrids like this so while its not probable it is possible

 

[velvetelvis]

Well I guess its both Perc and Osc the Black would be Perc and Maroon Osc at least I think it's an Osc

I assumed from the above quote that the OP was mixing up maroon clownfish and ocellaris clownfish, but maybe they were actually referring to the hybrid.

 

[kindler]

Thanks all for the help so far! So again here are the two fish I am looking at. My maroon & gold is 2.5" female I would assume sine I have had it alone for several years. I am not sure of the species but would assume Premnas since it is a wild caught fish. I wanted to try and pair it with an ORA black & white Percula.

I will for sure get the book I have seen many threads regarding it's greatness!!

Maroon & Gold - Premnas - Female
Black & White - Percula - Male

Thanks,
Scott

 

[BonsaiNut]

I might recommend something. It sounds like you don't have a lot of experience with clowns(?) Why don't you try a common pairing of same species to see if you can get them to spawn and raise the fry? It is not as easy as it might sound when you listen to people who have been doing it for years and have become quite accomplished. That way you know you have the basics nailed before you move on to more advanced projects.

What you are suggesting is very difficult, and might even include putting the smaller fish at risk if you have a beefy female Premnas (probably the most aggressive clown out there). You might try for years and never be successful - without really knowing what you are doing wrong.

 

[kindler]

I might recommend something. It sounds like you don't have a lot of experience with clowns(?) Why don't you try a common pairing of same species to see if you can get them to spawn and raise the fry? It is not as easy as it might sound when you listen to people who have been doing it for years and have become quite accomplished. That way you know you have the basics nailed before you move on to more advanced projects.

What you are suggesting is very difficult, and might even include putting the smaller fish at risk if you have a beefy female Premnas (probably the most aggressive clown out there). You might try for years and never be successful - without really knowing what you are doing wrong.

:thumbsup: I think just a Black & White Percula pair would be a good start? I just don't want to get fish that I don't want. Then maybe later I can try to cross breed one of the babies with my Maroon & Gold. I am new to breeding but have a good knowledge and will be reading Joyce Wilkerson's book cover to cover before I start.

Thanks so much all for the guidance and not just calling me stupid. After all this I think I will try a B&W pair then see about a cross breed later!!

Anyone know of a breeder I can get a pair of Black & White Percula from??

Thanks,
Scott

 

[velvetelvis]

Again, the black and white clowns are actually ocellaris, not perculas. Both Sustainable Aquatics and ORA breed them and sell mated pairs, although buying a mated pair (as opposed to getting two juveniles and letting them pair off as they grow up) can be pricey. My pair of B&W ocellaris came from Sustainable Aquatics. They're beautiful, healthy, and perfectly marked; I'm really enjoying them.

None of the breeders I know of sell directly to the public, however. Your best bet might be to see if your LFS is willing to order them directly from one of the breeders for you. Another option is to try Diver's Den on Live Aquaria--they sometimes get in pairs of the B&W ocellaris from both ORA and SA.

 

[kindler]

I thought there were both Percula and Ocellaris. What is this??? Are they just in error with the species?
Australian Black Percula's

Identification:The Australian Black and White Percula Clownfish is very distinctive with its jet-black body and three bluish-white bands on each side. A very good candidate for a reef aquarium, they are very hardy and are perfect for the novice or seasoned aquarist. It is one of the few clownfish that can be maintained together in an aquarium along with other varied tank members. Also known as the Black Perc, or Black Percula Clown Anemonefish, it is normally found in association with anemones on the reefs of the Coral Sea. It can be found individually, or more commonly, in pairs or small groups within the same anemone such as Heteractis magnifica or Stichodactyla mertensii

I also found this:

ORA™ Hatchery Certified Mated Pairs
Australian Black Percula Clownfish
Amphiprion percula spec.

Identification:These are hatchery certified pairs from ORA. They are mated and have been together for several months. ORA did not need additional broodstock so they released them for sale to us. They are exceptional clowns in their own right, selected for potential breeding. They are being sold a little young so it will be a short while for your first spawn. During this term your new pair will be getting used to their new surroundings.

Mated pairs of Black Percula Clownfish typically spawn every 10-14 days and the eggs hatch in about 7-8 days. The female is generally the larger fish of the pair. As with some other marine fish, clownfish are protandrous hermaphrodites, meaning they exhibit sex reversal from males to females. The average nest size for A. ocellaris is about 250 eggs.

The Black and White Percula Clownfish is very distinctive with its jet-black body and three bluish-white bands on each side. A very good candidate for a reef aquarium, they are very hardy and are perfect for the novice or seasoned aquarist.

Minimum tank size: 20 Gallon
Feeding and diet: Omnivorous, feed varied diet that includes plant material
Reef Compatibility: Excellent Reef Fish
Level of Care: Easy
Approximate Purchase Size: 1-1/2"


Scott

 

[bues0022]

That's the biggest problem with people calling "ocellaris" a "false perc". People think they have a perc, but forget to keep the "false" on there because it doesn't seem like a big deal.

B&W are ONLY ocellaris.

"false percula" is a term IMHO should never be used.

 

[kindler]

Cool or I guess not. Thanks for all the info!! So are they FALSE PERCULA or OCELLARIS just to confirm? Also found out these are yet another AquaConn mislabel!!

Scott

 

[bues0022]

false percula is a very poor "common" name for A. Ocellaris. They are the same thing, though I very much dislike the term "false percula" because it is confusing to many - including yourself it seems.

 

[deangelr]

False percula = Ocellaris