Debating FW vs reef

[wbwhale]

Hi folks! New to the hobby, as the forum says. I have some experience with freshwater tanks not a ton; right now I just have a 5.5gal with a betta and a few plants.

Going to pick up either a 40 or 55gal during Petco's dollar sale and acquire the rest of the equipment here and there as budget allows. Budget IS pretty tight so that's my primary concern. I'd really love a reef tank but I have been reading for a while and can't quite figure out which direction to go. I'd like to have something up and running by next spring or thereabouts.

Any opinions? I'm probably looking at a $500 budget over six to eight months (and then cycling before adding any livestock... this is a long game). We'll be building the stand and I'm looking into DIY lighting with an Arduino and such. Is that enough to give marine critters a decent home? Or better to just wait until I win the lottery?

 

[juniorrocketdad]

You could do a reef for 500 easy but you need to know what your doing so make sure you have enough research before you dive in, other than that pick up a 40 breeder from petco as they are always good starter tanks and than figure it out from here before you add anything to the tank, remember there is nothing wrong with having an empty tank while you do research

 

[toothybugs]

That 500 is certainly enough, but if you are REALLY new to aquaria, I'd suggest getting a 40B from the sale and running it as a freshwater tetra tank for a while. Get a grasp on the nitrogen cycle, water changes, the hazards of overfeeding, etc before jumping in to a reef. It will be a lot less frustrating and definitely cheaper up front to go fresh for a bit first.

After 6-12 months and seeing the above topics in action, start putting money towards the equipment needed to convert to a reef - a protein skimmer, bucket of salt, an RODI unit, and reef-grade lighting will be your main purchases. When you drain out the freshwater you may want to drill it to put in an overflow so you can have a sump. But that will be something you decide for yourself as you learn more about all this.

 

[wbwhale]

Well, the 5.5's cycled but there's pleeeenty to learn about aquarium chemistry. I like the idea of a tetra tank for a while but what do I do with the fish when I switch it? Maybe just sell them?

I've been looking at sumps and thinking they sound like the way to go. I've got a husband with steady hands for glass drilling and custom stand building, so that's always an option later.

 

[Perth_reefer]

You're in a good position in that you're not looking to rush into anything. Personally I'd be tempted to go straight into saltwater because that would allow you to take your time, make a list of what you need and buy second hand as things come up for sale. Gumtree, Craigslist and eBay are going to have pretty much everything you need.
While you're waiting to get all your equipment together there is plenty of reading to do and by the time you have everything you'll be much better prepared than a lot of people who just jump into the hobby and make a lot of mistakes.
Looking forward to seeing pictures once you get started.

 

[Shawn O]

Go in the direction YOU want to go, this is your tank and yours is the only opinion that matters. Well, maybe your husbands does, a little. If you go FW first, ask your LFS if you buy your FW fish from him, will he take them back for some store credit towards SW fish. Let him know you are going to be spending money and he could be the one getting all of it or someone else will. Add your fish from least aggressive to most aggressive. Use as much live rock as you can. Add your fish and CUC slowly, over a period of time, to allow your tank to keep up with the load.

I wish I had done as you're doing and gone slowly, instead of buying a setup that was already running. You can go as slow as you want and add things at your leisure or as budget allows. Good luck and happy reefing.

 

[wbwhale]

Thanks for the input! I do kind of lean towards just starting with a reef tank because it's what I've always wanted; I did a bunch of reading years ago but it wasn't a good time. I'll do a bunch more in the meantime. Of course I'd like to have 20 tanks all over the house but I'm trying to incorporate some degree of realism here....

 

[mmittlesteadt]

A 40 breeder is MUCH better for a reef than a 55. The 40 breeder tank has more space front to back to build a reef in. A 55 gallon is too tall and narrow (front to back) to design any rockwork decently.

What fascinates you more? Do you prefer fish over corals? Do you like the idea of many different kinds of creatures to watch? Freshwater pretty much limits you to fish and plants, but Saltwater gives you fish, corals (many different kinds) and other invertebrates that crawl, climb, swim, etc. all over rockwork, glass and throughout the tank.

FW is easier on many levels, but it is a great way to get to understand the nitrogen cycle without the expense of SW. Read the stickies here to see if you want to invest (time, money and research) in Saltwater.

 

[A sea K]

I've been looking at sumps and thinking they sound like the way to go. I've got a husband with steady hands for glass drilling and custom stand building, so that's always an option later.

Like a few others have already mentioned a 40 breeder is a far better choice than a 55.

While your shopping the dollar sale at petco grab a 20gal LONG (30x12x12) to use as your sump, it will fit easily under the stand and has better room than a reg 20. A little DIY work for the baffles and your all set.

As for starting out I also think it best to start with a salt system vs fresh. Get your feet wet cycling the tank, slowly add livestock when the tank has matured and cycled a bit. A little rock here and there as you go and in short order you will have a fair grasp on how things work. When your ready you can start with some easy to keep corals and inverts, plenty of those to chose from.

Probably the most important choice you will make will be lighting. This will likely be the biggest expense and your decision needs to be based on what you plan to keep in the long run. Choosing the wrong light now will possibly mean re-buying a different set-up a little farther down the road. Lots and lots of options in lighting and knowing what you plan to keep coral wise will be of the most help when selecting a lighting system.

 

[lpsouth1978]

I'm going to add my $0.02 here as well. When I first decided to get a SW tank I had been keeping FW for nearly 20 years and knew all about the nitrogen cycle, water changes, etc. I quickly learned that my knowledge of FW was not going to go very far with SW. There was still a STEEP learning curve. You have the advantage of the internet and this site to help you out.

Go with the SW system. Start with a few fish and work your way up to adding a few hardy corals. Continue learning and adding more advanced corals as you are ready. Nothing good happens quickly in this hobby.

 

[Wryknow]

I'd go with the 40G breeder and start with a Fish Only With Live Rock set up. You can use simple in-tank filtration and it's not that much more than a freshwater set up to get started. I'd buy a Tunze Reefpack 250 and you'd basically need a heater (maybe a powerhead for more circulation) and simple florescent light and you'd be in business. Once you feel that you have everything under control and are ready to try some corals you would need to upgrade your light (add a DIY LED hanging kit) and you could start adding some softies.

 

[Wryknow]

You can also save a lot of money on live rock by starting with "dead" rock from (I like Marcorocks) and add a pound of live rock rubble from your LFS to seed it. It takes longer, but works and saves a lot of $$$.

 

[Sk8r]

We have a great big master file up in the stickies of this forum called SETTING UP that walks you through from start to advanced in this hobby. This may help you.

 

[serbusfish]

As someone who is new to reefs I thought i'd drop in my 0.02 cents.

My reef has been up and running for almost 4 months. Before I set it up I ran a planted freshwater tank for 2 and a half years, this gave me a lot of knowledge on how to keep water quality high, how to properly acclimate fish, do water changes, etc. With a reef water quality is even more important, you have to use buffers, keep salinity stable, remove phosphates, keep nitrates low, etc. For me with my freshwater background this stuff came pretty easy, but I feel if I had jumped right into to the reef side without the freshwater learning curve I would have made big mistakes and might have given up altogether.

How long have you had your Betta? If you have had him a while and can keep his water good then I would say try saltwater and start with some really easy corals, and go from there. If you have only had your Betta a couple of months (or less) perhaps consider waiting a while before jumping into this side of fish keeping. If you know what you are doing and are diligent about keeping your parameters in check you shouldn't have too many problems, but if you are like my friend who doesnt buffer, doesnt test his water, and then wonders why his corals are receding/dying your going to have a bad time.

 

[ericarenee]

You do know that asking this Question here is like asking your Dodge dealer to talk you into buying a Ford..

 

[wbwhale]

You do know that asking this Question here is like asking your Dodge dealer to talk you into buying a Ford..

Well, this is the best reply ever. LOL!

Sk8r, thanks! I've been reading through them for a week or two and making notes. Trying to set up a spreadsheet with all the items I need, cost, features to look for, etc. All the brands and options and opinions take a while to sort through..!

I've not had this particular betta long but have had others in the past and am majorly addicted to water testing and understanding the cycles and stuff. I like to stare at my spreadsheets and graphs and wish there were more parameters to track. So, I think as long as I feel like I understand what has to be done (the chemistry forum is great btw) I can probably do it.

 

[taricha]

...am majorly addicted to water testing and understanding the cycles and stuff. I like to stare at my spreadsheets and graphs and wish there were more parameters to track. ...(the chemistry forum is great btw)

End of thread. You are a reefer. You've found your home.
Anyone who enjoys reading through the chemistry forum and trying to wrap their head around how all the competing systems interplay in a slice of simulated ocean will only find fulfillment with the constant puzzle of a reef tank.
BTW update us on how that $500 budget goes. [emoji6]
Actually that would make a really good thread, very unusual for these parts if you could stick to it. From zero to stable, stocked reef in $500.
It can be done, but most of us could only give you advice what not to do on a budget like that.

 

[texdoc77]

Had FW for a long while myself, but I always loved the saltwater and now that I have made the switch, it seems silly I did not do it sooner. I personally do not think "practicing" with a FW tank makes much sense, but I DO think starting a saltwater tank and going slowly does.

I also agree that $500 seems like a difficult amount to work with, however, you will spend money slowly over time and really does not have to feel like a big chunk of change. Good luck.

 

[Shawn O]

$500 is just a starting budget, it should get you a working tank with some fish. The hubby doesn't need to know you're going to spend a LOT more money over the long haul.

Buy a good skimmer, the best you can afford within your starting budget. There are deals to be had on craigslist and here in the trading forum. I think this should be your first priority item after the tank and sump. With or without corals, there will always be crud you need to remove from the water. The more crud you can remove from the water, the better. An ATO will help keep things stable. I currently top off my tank by placing a 1 gallon milk jug, with a slit in the bottom, full of DI water over the tank. Not very consistent but it does the job. An ATO will maintain salinity much better than adding water when I notice the level is getting lower.

You don't need much in the way of lights for just fish. As stated before, good lights are going to be expensive. Chinese LEDs would be a good start there but you get what you pay for.

A 55 gives a lot of front viewing space but does make it harder to do rockwork. The 40B is definitely better there. If you like the size of the 55s front view more than the 40, a 75 gallon tank is pretty much a 55 that is 6" deeper, front to back.

 

[wbwhale]

Ha! Yeah, that's the "get it up and running" budget. I am sure it will take more in the long run. I'm sure I'll make a thread, though. I love rehashing details at length and hubby only wants to hear so much about sea life. I have a 2yo who adores fish (he loses his mind with half the avatars here) but of course his interest in water testing and equipment specs is pretty limited. FOR NOW.

I wish there were 75s in the Petco sale but alas, no.