If that was the case my mortgage co. would be here insp. my house. I'm sure if it isn't arson or fraud they would have to pay the claim , or the mortgage Co. would be suing the Ins. Co. Do you think a moorage Co. would take a risk of loaning somebody 100 of thousands of dollars and not be covered because someone used something that wasn't UL approved?
DIY Icecap...its not what you think
- Thread starter reefburnaby
- Start date
S
sir reefalot
Damn, now we got a "UL" police....
We don't need no stinking "UL".
Don't you folks have some tangs to save or something....
P.S. I don't wear a helmet when I ride a bicycle.
Call me crazy...
:smokin:
We don't need no stinking "UL".
Don't you folks have some tangs to save or something....
P.S. I don't wear a helmet when I ride a bicycle.
Call me crazy...
:smokin:
gregt
Premium Member
Sir reefalot,
As long as you don't come to my house when yours burns down and the claim is denied, then we'll all be happy.
The point is not that you must only use UL listed equipment, but that we should all be aware that doing DIY electronic wiring can have consequences like bbrowncods described.
Poorly designed and / or implemented wiring can and does cause fires.
As long as you don't come to my house when yours burns down and the claim is denied, then we'll all be happy.
The point is not that you must only use UL listed equipment, but that we should all be aware that doing DIY electronic wiring can have consequences like bbrowncods described.
Poorly designed and / or implemented wiring can and does cause fires.
DanOtheManO
New member
There goes the DIY idea...
There goes the DIY idea...
Technically ANY DIY light canopy or retrofit lighting installation would create a new "device" which is not UL approved whether it is "overdriven" or not, unless it is done by licensed electrician, constructed in accordance with the current National Electric Code (NEC) and any locally applicable codes, and using strictly UL approved devices in their approved manner.
There goes the DIY idea...
Technically ANY DIY light canopy or retrofit lighting installation would create a new "device" which is not UL approved whether it is "overdriven" or not, unless it is done by licensed electrician, constructed in accordance with the current National Electric Code (NEC) and any locally applicable codes, and using strictly UL approved devices in their approved manner.
DanOtheManO
New member
I really doubt that there are many "UL listed" devices which have been specifically approved for a use where they are suspended 6 inches above saltwater and attached to, and enclosed by a wooden cabinet, continuously exposed to salt spray, etc. Most DIY hoods whether they involved PC retrofits, Normal output fluorescents, or halide installations would not meet the strict interpretation described by bbrowncods. The simple fact is that they were not constructed by a qualified/licensed electrician. (That's why it say's "not for consumer use" on the bare ballasts that you buy at Home Depot.)
They were constructed by a hobbyist, hopefully with some knowledge of electrical safety, and some regard for their own well-being. This is the DIY forum. If you've got money to spend to buy an entire UL listed hood, and if that will make you sleep better at night, then go to the vendors forum and shell out some dough.
If your insurance company would deny a claim for a DIY light setup on a fish tank, they would also deny it if you had 4 strands of Christmas lights together instead of the rated for 3 in a row, or if you put two extension cords together, or put a candle next to the bed, where a blanked could be tossed on it, or fell asleep smoking, or spontaneously combusted. They are not insuring a perfect world where everything is flame proof, meteor-proof, earthquake-proof, and flood-proof, they are sharing the risk of the world with you, including the risk of a dumb hobbyist/homeowner (as long as they aren't dumb enough to try insurance fraud). Of course they assume that you are somewhat able and interested in looking after your own safety. Unless it were fraudulent, I doubt they would deny a claim on the grounds of an unapproved electrical device. If your policy does contain specific language to that effect, I would go with another company.
That said, You should take a good look at your wife and kids, and all the "stuff" in your house that you like, and weigh your confidence in your electrical skills, and the risk that you might pose to yourself, and your family, against the cost of having it done by someone who has been licensed and certified to know what they are doing, and the cost of equipment that is rated as safe for a specific use. You may need to ask questions or learn more about electricity to honestly weigh your ability to "Do It Yourself" without creating unacceptable risk.
I've built tesla coils, and evaluated the risks to the house and family while doing so. My only surprise was that the garage door opener didn't like being hit by a 3 foot arc. That particular unrecognized risk only cost me $200, but it was worth the fun, and exploration the project provided.
The world is full of risks. If you drive ten miles to buy a single lottery ticket, you are more likely crash and die on the trip than to win the lottery, and yet most of us still drive ( and some of us even buy lottery tickets). People smoke at home, and light candles, even though these things known to cause hundreds of house fires each year.
Here are some tips on being more safe around the home.
http://www.ul.com/consumers/homeowners.html
Now after all that is said, and since you probably stopped reading a long time ago, I really don't think that overdriving a normal fluorescent bulb with more power by 2 or 3 times is any more risky than the same bulb and wiring at normal power. As far as I can tell there are not many specific or significant design changes made to a VHO bulb over a NO bulb, and there is even less of a difference in a ballast that puts out X watts over a ballast that puts out X watts and is also labeled "VHO". I'm a little wary of two or more electronic ballasts in parallel driving the same bulb, they could cause feed-back to one another or something. I'm not Undewriters Laboratories, you would be foolish to take my advice over theirs. But then again, you might be thrifty, creative, carefull, responsible, and willing to learn and try new things.
Make sure your GFCI circuit breaker works, your wiring is secure, and adequately insulated, and there is a grounded reflector within a couple inches of the bulb.
But for goodness sake people this isn't rocket science or voodoo magic, that must be "blessed" by some lab before it will obey the laws of physics, it's just electricity. It can be dangerous like automobiles or candles or skateboards can be dangerous, but don't go hide in a cave just becuase the world is a risky place, use some common sense, educate yourselves, be responsible, and enjoy life.
They were constructed by a hobbyist, hopefully with some knowledge of electrical safety, and some regard for their own well-being. This is the DIY forum. If you've got money to spend to buy an entire UL listed hood, and if that will make you sleep better at night, then go to the vendors forum and shell out some dough.
If your insurance company would deny a claim for a DIY light setup on a fish tank, they would also deny it if you had 4 strands of Christmas lights together instead of the rated for 3 in a row, or if you put two extension cords together, or put a candle next to the bed, where a blanked could be tossed on it, or fell asleep smoking, or spontaneously combusted. They are not insuring a perfect world where everything is flame proof, meteor-proof, earthquake-proof, and flood-proof, they are sharing the risk of the world with you, including the risk of a dumb hobbyist/homeowner (as long as they aren't dumb enough to try insurance fraud). Of course they assume that you are somewhat able and interested in looking after your own safety. Unless it were fraudulent, I doubt they would deny a claim on the grounds of an unapproved electrical device. If your policy does contain specific language to that effect, I would go with another company.
That said, You should take a good look at your wife and kids, and all the "stuff" in your house that you like, and weigh your confidence in your electrical skills, and the risk that you might pose to yourself, and your family, against the cost of having it done by someone who has been licensed and certified to know what they are doing, and the cost of equipment that is rated as safe for a specific use. You may need to ask questions or learn more about electricity to honestly weigh your ability to "Do It Yourself" without creating unacceptable risk.
I've built tesla coils, and evaluated the risks to the house and family while doing so. My only surprise was that the garage door opener didn't like being hit by a 3 foot arc. That particular unrecognized risk only cost me $200, but it was worth the fun, and exploration the project provided.
The world is full of risks. If you drive ten miles to buy a single lottery ticket, you are more likely crash and die on the trip than to win the lottery, and yet most of us still drive ( and some of us even buy lottery tickets). People smoke at home, and light candles, even though these things known to cause hundreds of house fires each year.
Here are some tips on being more safe around the home.
http://www.ul.com/consumers/homeowners.html
Now after all that is said, and since you probably stopped reading a long time ago, I really don't think that overdriving a normal fluorescent bulb with more power by 2 or 3 times is any more risky than the same bulb and wiring at normal power. As far as I can tell there are not many specific or significant design changes made to a VHO bulb over a NO bulb, and there is even less of a difference in a ballast that puts out X watts over a ballast that puts out X watts and is also labeled "VHO". I'm a little wary of two or more electronic ballasts in parallel driving the same bulb, they could cause feed-back to one another or something. I'm not Undewriters Laboratories, you would be foolish to take my advice over theirs. But then again, you might be thrifty, creative, carefull, responsible, and willing to learn and try new things.
Make sure your GFCI circuit breaker works, your wiring is secure, and adequately insulated, and there is a grounded reflector within a couple inches of the bulb.
But for goodness sake people this isn't rocket science or voodoo magic, that must be "blessed" by some lab before it will obey the laws of physics, it's just electricity. It can be dangerous like automobiles or candles or skateboards can be dangerous, but don't go hide in a cave just becuase the world is a risky place, use some common sense, educate yourselves, be responsible, and enjoy life.
DanOtheManO said:
For anyone thinking of trying this you can STOP THINKING ABOUT IT NOW
I already tried it and it cost me $80.00 for new ballasts. they do feedback to each other and the end result is a $40.00 electronic paper weight (or two as in my case).
as for safty ratings, I am not sure how they work in the US but here in canada if I make something I can pay a fee and it will be tested and aproved if it passes the tests. I am thinking of taking my ballast box in and getting it CSA aproved.
Steve
bbrowncods
New member
Hey I'm glad my first post created some discussion. (that was the purpose). I would like to clarify that I did say HYPOTHETICAL, and nowhere did I say that this was unsafe. In fact, I think that it probably is safe. I just believe that it will be hard to convince an insurance adjuster, that probably knows less about electricity than most of us, that:
1. I had a safe lighting setup and
2. I was not negligent in wiring a ballast designed for four bulbs into one bulb.
Especially if the fire department says otherwise.
Call me paranoid! That said, having seen others do it with no consequences, I'll probably do it also...
Besides my refrigerator is new.
1. I had a safe lighting setup and
2. I was not negligent in wiring a ballast designed for four bulbs into one bulb.
Especially if the fire department says otherwise.
Call me paranoid! That said, having seen others do it with no consequences, I'll probably do it also...
Besides my refrigerator is new.
Important Question
Important Question
I bought the Rel-4p32-LW-RH-TP ballast instead of the advance -SC ballast to overdrive 2, 20 Watt T12 tubes, by *4. However I found out today that the ballast factor BF=.75 for this ballast. Will this cause any problems with the amount I'm overdriving? Below is the link to the specs of the ballast. Also the T12 tubes are not shown as being supported by this ballast in the specs. Will I encounter any problems? Thanks in advance.
http://advancetransformer.com/ecom_PDFS/out/1786559785.pdf
Important Question
I bought the Rel-4p32-LW-RH-TP ballast instead of the advance -SC ballast to overdrive 2, 20 Watt T12 tubes, by *4. However I found out today that the ballast factor BF=.75 for this ballast. Will this cause any problems with the amount I'm overdriving? Below is the link to the specs of the ballast. Also the T12 tubes are not shown as being supported by this ballast in the specs. Will I encounter any problems? Thanks in advance.
http://advancetransformer.com/ecom_PDFS/out/1786559785.pdf
DanOtheManO
New member
Ballast terms, and info
Ballast terms, and info
Some Definitions that might be helpfull:
Ballast Factor (BF), also called Relative Light Output (RLO), is the ratio of the light output of a lamp(s) operated by a ballast, to the light output of the same lamp(s) operated by a reference (ANSI standard) ballast at rated current and voltage.
Ballast Efficacy Factor (BEF) is the ratio of the ballast factor (BF) to input watts; it measures the efficiency of the lamp/ballast system relative to others using the same type and number of lamps.
(taken from http://www.eren.doe.gov/femp/procurement/ballast.html)
Ballast Reference Sheet (from www.universalballast.com/techSupport/media/ballast-terminology.pdf)
Power Factor:
Measurement of the relationship between input voltage and current. A higher power factor means that the input current will be lower for the same input power level.
High PF (>.90) for C&I
Low PF (<.90) for Residential
Electronic typically > .98
(DanO's note: An AC transformer is seen as an inductive load rather than a pure resistive load like a heater or incandescent bulb. This means as the voltage increases in the AC cycle, the current draw is greater initially (well let's just say that it behaves differently over time from the basic I=V/R that would apply to a resistive load.) and can actually reverse the current against the input voltage after the input voltage peaks and starts to fall of in the AC cycle. So instead of I = V/R where I increases directly with V, I can be large while V is increasing, and then actualy negative (depending on the inductor) after V peaks and is falling. This effect is annoying for other devices on the line, and can setup harmonics in the line which is even more annoying. This can be somewhat corrected with a capacitor that matches the inducance of the coil. The degree to which this is corrected results in a higher power factor, for electronic ballasts, it should be a non-issue, and is usually greater than .98)
Ballast Factor:
a.k.a. % Light Output
.78 - L, HPL, EL,
.88 - RH, HP, HE1
.18 - RHH
(DanO's note: Basically how bright a light will be on the ballast compared with a reference standard. Some ballasts will be lower than 1.0 because their goals are different i.e. cheaper overall price, lower power consumption, lower noise, reduced harmonics, whatever.)
Ballast Efficacy Factor (B.E.F.)
= Ballast Factor x 100 / Input Watts
Can only compare like systems with
the same lamp type and quantity
Total Harmonic Distortion (THD)
Measurement of Harmonic content of a ballasts input current
< 10% - HP, HE, EL, HPL
< 20% - RH, L, RHH
Instant Start
*Maximum energy efficiency
*Ideal for applications with > 3 hours/start
Programmed (Rapid) Start
*Maximizes lamp life by improved lamp starting and operation
*For applications < 3 hours/start
*For use with Occupancy sensors
*Use as a replacement for Rapid Start Specifications
System Light Output:
Rated Lamp Lumens
x Ballast Factor
x Number of Lamps
=System Lumens
System Lumen Example:
F40T12/ES F32T8
2280 2710
x 0.90 x 0.78
x 4 x 4
8208 8455
(magnetic) ("L" electronic)
Electronic Ballast Q & A (fromhttp://www.universalballast.com/techSupport/trouble_shooting/elct-qa.html)
What is a ballast? A ballast is an electrical device that supplies sufficient voltage to start the flow of arc current in a fluorescent lamp, and then regulates the proper arc current to the lamp.
Electronic Ballasts are able to operate lamps at high frequencies because they utilize semi-conductor component circuitry instead of the standard electro-magnetic transformer circuit operating at line frequency.
Passive Input Ballasts utilize inductance and capacitance to correct for power factor and current harmonics. The Universal Lighting Technologies RH and L series of ballasts are considered Passive Input Electronic ballasts.
Active Input Ballasts utilize semi-conductor circuitry to correct for power factor and current harmonics. The Universal Lighting HP series is considered an Active Input Electronic Ballast.
Ballast Factor is the measure of the light output (lumens) of a ballast and lamp combination in comparison to the ANSI standard ballast operated with the same lamp. Electronic ballasts generate 10% more lumens, per watt, verses electromagnetic ballasts, due to the high frequency operation of the fluorescent lamps. A simple way to think of Ballast Factor is as a Multiplier. Simply multiply the ballast factor times the rated lumens of the lamp to get the amount of lumens produced from the lamp/ballast combination.
Rapid Start ballasts provide continuous filament voltage which allows for a lower starting voltage. A grounded reflector close to the lamp, and a grounded line circuit are required to provide a capacitive starting aid for the lamp. Rapid Start used to be considered the best for frequently switched applications.
Programmed Start ballasts improve on the rapid start concept by delaying the starting voltage until the filament is fully heated. This results in a 50 percent greater number of safe starts during a normal lamp life. After the lamp is started the filament voltage is reduced to a minimum, saving energy and enhancing longer lamp life.
AccuStartâ„¢ is the name of the new Universal Lighting programmed Start Ballast.
Instant Start ballasts start the lamps without preheating the filaments. This requires a higher starting voltage to start the arc current. Because there is no filament voltage applied by the ballast it is the most energy efficient.
Do electronic ballasts run cooler? Electronic ballasts generate less heat than electro-magnetic ballasts by using highly efficient semi-conductor circuitry. This saves money on air conditioning costs.
Are electronic ballasts lighter? Electronic ballasts are lighter in weight than electro-magnetic ballasts because they utilize semi-conductor circuitry instead of a transformer based design.
Are electronic ballasts cheaper to operate? Electronic ballasts pay for themselves over time because they use 10 to 30 percent less energy to create the same amount of light as electro-magnetic ballasts.
Do electronic ballasts provide flicker free light? Electronic ballasts operate the lamps at roughly 25KHZ where electro-magnetic ballasts operate a 60HZ. The high frequency operation prevents stroboscopic effect, and makes the light appear continuous to the human eye with no perceptible flicker.
Do electronic ballasts make noise? Because electronic ballasts do not have the auto transformer that is inherent to an electro-magnetic ballast, the characteristic "hum" of a magnetic ballast is not present in an electronic ballast. The electronic ballast generates a small noise, much less than a magnetic ballast of a similar application. Other factors such as the lighting fixture, and room characteristics affect the noise level.
What is RFI? Radio Frequency Interference is any signal, either radiated from the lamps, or conducted on the power line, that interferes with radio or television reception. Electronic ballasts have built in filter circuits that meet the FCC Guidelines Part 18 (Class A) for RFI and EMI for eliminating these unwanted signals, when the ballast is installed properly with a good earth ground.
What is High Power Factor? High Power Factor ballasts correct for the loading effect of the ballast on the supply voltage. This results in more efficient operation. All Universal Lighting electronic ballasts are High Power Factor ballasts.
Ballast terms, and info
Some Definitions that might be helpfull:
Ballast Factor (BF), also called Relative Light Output (RLO), is the ratio of the light output of a lamp(s) operated by a ballast, to the light output of the same lamp(s) operated by a reference (ANSI standard) ballast at rated current and voltage.
Ballast Efficacy Factor (BEF) is the ratio of the ballast factor (BF) to input watts; it measures the efficiency of the lamp/ballast system relative to others using the same type and number of lamps.
(taken from http://www.eren.doe.gov/femp/procurement/ballast.html)
Ballast Reference Sheet (from www.universalballast.com/techSupport/media/ballast-terminology.pdf)
Power Factor:
Measurement of the relationship between input voltage and current. A higher power factor means that the input current will be lower for the same input power level.
High PF (>.90) for C&I
Low PF (<.90) for Residential
Electronic typically > .98
(DanO's note: An AC transformer is seen as an inductive load rather than a pure resistive load like a heater or incandescent bulb. This means as the voltage increases in the AC cycle, the current draw is greater initially (well let's just say that it behaves differently over time from the basic I=V/R that would apply to a resistive load.) and can actually reverse the current against the input voltage after the input voltage peaks and starts to fall of in the AC cycle. So instead of I = V/R where I increases directly with V, I can be large while V is increasing, and then actualy negative (depending on the inductor) after V peaks and is falling. This effect is annoying for other devices on the line, and can setup harmonics in the line which is even more annoying. This can be somewhat corrected with a capacitor that matches the inducance of the coil. The degree to which this is corrected results in a higher power factor, for electronic ballasts, it should be a non-issue, and is usually greater than .98)
Ballast Factor:
a.k.a. % Light Output
.78 - L, HPL, EL,
.88 - RH, HP, HE1
.18 - RHH
(DanO's note: Basically how bright a light will be on the ballast compared with a reference standard. Some ballasts will be lower than 1.0 because their goals are different i.e. cheaper overall price, lower power consumption, lower noise, reduced harmonics, whatever.)
Ballast Efficacy Factor (B.E.F.)
= Ballast Factor x 100 / Input Watts
Can only compare like systems with
the same lamp type and quantity
Total Harmonic Distortion (THD)
Measurement of Harmonic content of a ballasts input current
< 10% - HP, HE, EL, HPL
< 20% - RH, L, RHH
Instant Start
*Maximum energy efficiency
*Ideal for applications with > 3 hours/start
Programmed (Rapid) Start
*Maximizes lamp life by improved lamp starting and operation
*For applications < 3 hours/start
*For use with Occupancy sensors
*Use as a replacement for Rapid Start Specifications
System Light Output:
Rated Lamp Lumens
x Ballast Factor
x Number of Lamps
=System Lumens
System Lumen Example:
F40T12/ES F32T8
2280 2710
x 0.90 x 0.78
x 4 x 4
8208 8455
(magnetic) ("L" electronic)
Electronic Ballast Q & A (fromhttp://www.universalballast.com/techSupport/trouble_shooting/elct-qa.html)
What is a ballast? A ballast is an electrical device that supplies sufficient voltage to start the flow of arc current in a fluorescent lamp, and then regulates the proper arc current to the lamp.
Electronic Ballasts are able to operate lamps at high frequencies because they utilize semi-conductor component circuitry instead of the standard electro-magnetic transformer circuit operating at line frequency.
Passive Input Ballasts utilize inductance and capacitance to correct for power factor and current harmonics. The Universal Lighting Technologies RH and L series of ballasts are considered Passive Input Electronic ballasts.
Active Input Ballasts utilize semi-conductor circuitry to correct for power factor and current harmonics. The Universal Lighting HP series is considered an Active Input Electronic Ballast.
Ballast Factor is the measure of the light output (lumens) of a ballast and lamp combination in comparison to the ANSI standard ballast operated with the same lamp. Electronic ballasts generate 10% more lumens, per watt, verses electromagnetic ballasts, due to the high frequency operation of the fluorescent lamps. A simple way to think of Ballast Factor is as a Multiplier. Simply multiply the ballast factor times the rated lumens of the lamp to get the amount of lumens produced from the lamp/ballast combination.
Rapid Start ballasts provide continuous filament voltage which allows for a lower starting voltage. A grounded reflector close to the lamp, and a grounded line circuit are required to provide a capacitive starting aid for the lamp. Rapid Start used to be considered the best for frequently switched applications.
Programmed Start ballasts improve on the rapid start concept by delaying the starting voltage until the filament is fully heated. This results in a 50 percent greater number of safe starts during a normal lamp life. After the lamp is started the filament voltage is reduced to a minimum, saving energy and enhancing longer lamp life.
AccuStartâ„¢ is the name of the new Universal Lighting programmed Start Ballast.
Instant Start ballasts start the lamps without preheating the filaments. This requires a higher starting voltage to start the arc current. Because there is no filament voltage applied by the ballast it is the most energy efficient.
Do electronic ballasts run cooler? Electronic ballasts generate less heat than electro-magnetic ballasts by using highly efficient semi-conductor circuitry. This saves money on air conditioning costs.
Are electronic ballasts lighter? Electronic ballasts are lighter in weight than electro-magnetic ballasts because they utilize semi-conductor circuitry instead of a transformer based design.
Are electronic ballasts cheaper to operate? Electronic ballasts pay for themselves over time because they use 10 to 30 percent less energy to create the same amount of light as electro-magnetic ballasts.
Do electronic ballasts provide flicker free light? Electronic ballasts operate the lamps at roughly 25KHZ where electro-magnetic ballasts operate a 60HZ. The high frequency operation prevents stroboscopic effect, and makes the light appear continuous to the human eye with no perceptible flicker.
Do electronic ballasts make noise? Because electronic ballasts do not have the auto transformer that is inherent to an electro-magnetic ballast, the characteristic "hum" of a magnetic ballast is not present in an electronic ballast. The electronic ballast generates a small noise, much less than a magnetic ballast of a similar application. Other factors such as the lighting fixture, and room characteristics affect the noise level.
What is RFI? Radio Frequency Interference is any signal, either radiated from the lamps, or conducted on the power line, that interferes with radio or television reception. Electronic ballasts have built in filter circuits that meet the FCC Guidelines Part 18 (Class A) for RFI and EMI for eliminating these unwanted signals, when the ballast is installed properly with a good earth ground.
What is High Power Factor? High Power Factor ballasts correct for the loading effect of the ballast on the supply voltage. This results in more efficient operation. All Universal Lighting electronic ballasts are High Power Factor ballasts.
Last edited:
Will this same setup work on PCs?
Will this same setup work on PCs?
Just want to be sure, I want to setup a nano tank (5 gal) and only have space for a 15W PC bulb. Think I can hook up a higher wattage ballast and overdrive this puppy to 50W or so (with it giving me a reasonable lifetime)? From this thread , it seems plausible to me, but thought I would ask for anyone with experience first. Thanks!
James Becnel
Will this same setup work on PCs?
Just want to be sure, I want to setup a nano tank (5 gal) and only have space for a 15W PC bulb. Think I can hook up a higher wattage ballast and overdrive this puppy to 50W or so (with it giving me a reasonable lifetime)? From this thread , it seems plausible to me, but thought I would ask for anyone with experience first. Thanks!
James Becnel
Hey guys I had a quick question about OVRNO:
I just bought an Advance REL-4P32-SC Ballast, and some T8 bulbs (which took forever to find in 6500k). I was reading the instructions on the ballast and it says "all T8 rapid start lamps within 3/4" of grounded metal refletor." what does this mean exactly? Im a lighting newbie so simple words would help =)
Also, I'm presuming that the ballast's ground cable connects to your power cable? And finally, does the ballast itself need to be grounded? I was gonna mount the ballast directly onto my wooden lighting fixture using a couple screws. Is this enough ground or is more needed?
Thanks,
Auron
I just bought an Advance REL-4P32-SC Ballast, and some T8 bulbs (which took forever to find in 6500k). I was reading the instructions on the ballast and it says "all T8 rapid start lamps within 3/4" of grounded metal refletor." what does this mean exactly? Im a lighting newbie so simple words would help =)
Also, I'm presuming that the ballast's ground cable connects to your power cable? And finally, does the ballast itself need to be grounded? I was gonna mount the ballast directly onto my wooden lighting fixture using a couple screws. Is this enough ground or is more needed?
Thanks,
Auron
Ok new question: My light isnt firing up... i drew a pic to describe how i wired it.
My main question is: The black and grey wire... i know they goto the power plug.. but I have 3 wires in the plug (I bought the 3 prong plug), and only two wires to connect? How do i do this?
I know the black wire on the PLUG is ground...
Thanks,
Auron
My main question is: The black and grey wire... i know they goto the power plug.. but I have 3 wires in the plug (I bought the 3 prong plug), and only two wires to connect? How do i do this?
I know the black wire on the PLUG is ground...
Thanks,
Auron
Attachments
Zephrant
Premium Member
In house wiring the standard is for the black to be HOT, white to be NEUTRAL, and green GROUND.
The WHITE blade of a plug (or socket) is the larger blade.
Some ballasts can not start a bulb unless it is near a grounded metal panel. (Think how they are when they are mounted in a fixture in the ceiling.) As has been posted recently in another thread, the ballast needs the extra capacitive kick from the ground panel to start. Sometimes just touching the bulb will give it enough capacitance to start. Some people have had luck with placing aluminum foil above the bulb. In my experience just having the bulbs near the saltwater, with the tank grounded, has been adequate.
I would suggest running a wire from the ground pin of your 3 wire plug (round pin) to the ballast- Just attach it to the ballast case with a small bolt though one of the holes. Scrape away some paint so it makes good contact if needed, or use some teeth washers to get a good bite. The ground is there for a safety. If anything happens to the white wire, the ground backs it up, or if a wire inside the ballast comes loose and touches the case, the ground wire will try to pop the breaker. This is better than you finding the case is tied to 120VAC by touching it. The unit will most likely work without the ground wire, but it is a very good idea to be extra careful around our tanks with electricity.
Zeph
The WHITE blade of a plug (or socket) is the larger blade.
Some ballasts can not start a bulb unless it is near a grounded metal panel. (Think how they are when they are mounted in a fixture in the ceiling.) As has been posted recently in another thread, the ballast needs the extra capacitive kick from the ground panel to start. Sometimes just touching the bulb will give it enough capacitance to start. Some people have had luck with placing aluminum foil above the bulb. In my experience just having the bulbs near the saltwater, with the tank grounded, has been adequate.
I would suggest running a wire from the ground pin of your 3 wire plug (round pin) to the ballast- Just attach it to the ballast case with a small bolt though one of the holes. Scrape away some paint so it makes good contact if needed, or use some teeth washers to get a good bite. The ground is there for a safety. If anything happens to the white wire, the ground backs it up, or if a wire inside the ballast comes loose and touches the case, the ground wire will try to pop the breaker. This is better than you finding the case is tied to 120VAC by touching it.
The unit will most likely work without the ground wire, but it is a very good idea to be extra careful around our tanks with electricity.Zeph
Zephrant,
Thanks for clearing that up... I always thought black was ground. I got everything hooked up right now and wow that is bright. Im typing this with the glare still in my eyes. Thanks for the extra tips too...
One other question... can I connect all of my ballasts to the same power cord? The ballasts are 120V and the cord is rated at 1625 volts...
Thanks,
Auron
Thanks for clearing that up... I always thought black was ground. I got everything hooked up right now and wow that is bright. Im typing this with the glare still in my eyes. Thanks for the extra tips too...
One other question... can I connect all of my ballasts to the same power cord? The ballasts are 120V and the cord is rated at 1625 volts...
Thanks,
Auron
Fish_Freek
Cheese Head
Does anyone have a diagram for hooking a 3x over driven bulb. The 3x HD ballast i picked up has 3-blue and 1-red wire. I hooked the 3- blues to one side and the 1-red to the other side. I am assuming this is correct. Just want to get the most out of this wireing scheam.
thanks,
thanks,
Zephrant
Premium Member
Auron- The voltage rating of the power cord is not dependent on how many things you put on it, it will always be 120 volts. The thing to watch is the current. Each ballast takes some current (in amps) and you don't want to try to push too much though the cord. I can't say what your cord will handle, without knowing how big the wires are inside of it. If it is a typical 16 gauge extension cord, it will handle 15 amps without overheating. For reference, a 12 gauge cord will handle 20 amps. I don't remember what a 18 gauge will handle. The larger the gauge number, the smaller the capacity.
Say you are over driving a bulb 3 times. 3 x 40 watts is 120 watts, plus about 10% for losses in the ballast and all, so that puts you at pulling about 135 watts though the wire. 135 watts / 120 volts = 1.125 amps.
With that setup, you could probably run up to 4 ballasts for a total of 4.6 amps though the 16 gauge cord. ( being conservative here is good. )
Larger wire equals less energy loss to resistive heating of the wire, but in a 6' cord, it is not very significant.
Having said all that, I tend to use 18 gauge lamp cord, and use a separate cord for each ballast so I can put them on different timers.
Sorry so long-
Zeph
Say you are over driving a bulb 3 times. 3 x 40 watts is 120 watts, plus about 10% for losses in the ballast and all, so that puts you at pulling about 135 watts though the wire. 135 watts / 120 volts = 1.125 amps.
With that setup, you could probably run up to 4 ballasts for a total of 4.6 amps though the 16 gauge cord. ( being conservative here is good. )
Larger wire equals less energy loss to resistive heating of the wire, but in a 6' cord, it is not very significant.
Having said all that, I tend to use 18 gauge lamp cord, and use a separate cord for each ballast so I can put them on different timers.
Sorry so long-
Zeph
Grounding multiple balasts to same housing -> interference?.
Grounding multiple balasts to same housing -> interference?.
One option that I am considering is cannibalizing a two 48"-bulb shop light for the metal housing and endcaps and replacing the reflector and ballasts. I plan to ground the two 4 tube F32T8 ballasts to the same metal housing. I realize that this is very different than wiring the two ballasts in parallel (which StirCrazy warns against) but is it possible that the two ballasts could interfere with each other via their common ground? I'm guessing not but I would appreciate knowledgeable opinions. StirCrazy? Others?
-Keith
Grounding multiple balasts to same housing -> interference?.
One option that I am considering is cannibalizing a two 48"-bulb shop light for the metal housing and endcaps and replacing the reflector and ballasts. I plan to ground the two 4 tube F32T8 ballasts to the same metal housing. I realize that this is very different than wiring the two ballasts in parallel (which StirCrazy warns against) but is it possible that the two ballasts could interfere with each other via their common ground? I'm guessing not but I would appreciate knowledgeable opinions. StirCrazy? Others?
-Keith
Canadian Man
New member
Keith i have 7 ballast's sharing the same common ground and no interferience/problems.
5 of the ballast's are on one power chord and 2 ballast's on another.
5 of the ballast's are on one power chord and 2 ballast's on another.
