Dosing vs calcium reactor

[Mikenroe]

Hi there, this might have been asked before. However I am trying to figure to figure out the best and most cost effective way without sacrificing quality to keep my alk, cal, and mag stable. I just got a apex gold but have not set it up yet. So is using a calcium reactor with all, ca, and mg media in it the best? Or would it be best to get a dosing pump and use it to dose? If the dosing pump is the better way, 2nd question is where is the most cost affective and best solution to use. I currently use brightwell products and make my own stock solution however the strength of the solution is so much less than when you buy the solution in a bottle. So I'll have to add 2 to 300 mL of one solution to make a small increase. Would love some help. Thank you in advanced.

 

[bertoni]

This article might help:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-04/rhf/index.php

Generally, using a 2-part is an easy way to get started, but calcium reactors work well, too. If you don't mind dealing with the tuning process, the reactor should be fine. It's a personal choice, and people are successful with both methods.

 

[dendrite]

I have a 180 gallon with 60 gallon sump, heavily stocked reef that started with 2 part dosing and supplemented Mg but it became onerous to keep up with the mixing. I then ran a MRC CR-1 reactor with Mg pellets in the reactor along with reduced dosing, and finally just stopped the dosing 4 months ago. I run the reactor at 6.3 to 6.4 and so far the dkh is holding at 8.4. Much less work then dosing. I use a used cole parmer peristaltic pump and am thrilled with the ease of set up and adjustment. There is a huge thread on calcium reactor set up here by TKE racer that goes into detail

 

[Mikenroe]

Hey thanks guys for the comments. I read a lot more last night and it seems as there is a lot of split decision and that it is a personal preference. So then my next question? If I go with the dosing route. Where and what is the best way to keep enough solution? I started to test daily at the same time and it looks like I'm dropping about .75 dkh everyday. When I make my brightwell stock solution at double the strength that is still like 250mL I have to add daily. Is there a way to get a solution that is a stronger strength in large quantities so that I only have to add like 10 mL. That way the solution might last me longer, in other words save me money in the long run?

 

[Potatohead]

Hey thanks guys for the comments. I read a lot more last night and it seems as there is a lot of split decision and that it is a personal preference. So then my next question? If I go with the dosing route. Where and what is the best way to keep enough solution? I started to test daily at the same time and it looks like I'm dropping about .75 dkh everyday. When I make my brightwell stock solution at double the strength that is still like 250mL I have to add daily. Is there a way to get a solution that is a stronger strength in large quantities so that I only have to add like 10 mL. That way the solution might last me longer, in other words save me money in the long run?

Don't buy a pre-mixed liquid, buy the dry powder and mix it yourself. You can either use baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) if your ph is typically on the high side, or sodium carbonate if it's on the low side. You can use calcium chloride for calcium and magnesium chloride/sulfate for mag. This is typically far cheaper, and available at almost every saltwater LFS or online.

 

[Mikenroe]

Thanks potatohead, I agree that mixing yourself is probably cheaper, however a gallon of made calcium by brightwell is going to last much longer than a gallon that I mix myself because the strength is so different. Brightwell will mix at 2.5 ppm per gal where as the bottled solution by them is 40 ppm. Even if I were to do 4 times the strength mixing it that would still only be 10 ppm which is way under the pre made solution from them. Any advise!

 

[bertoni]

Bulk Reef Supply and other vendors sell bulk chemicals for a DIY 2-part. This article has more:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

The calcium part can be made very concentrated, more than 1000 times more concentrated than 40 ppm.

 

[Potatohead]

Thanks potatohead, I agree that mixing yourself is probably cheaper, however a gallon of made calcium by brightwell is going to last much longer than a gallon that I mix myself because the strength is so different. Brightwell will mix at 2.5 ppm per gal where as the bottled solution by them is 40 ppm. Even if I were to do 4 times the strength mixing it that would still only be 10 ppm which is way under the pre made solution from them. Any advise!

Wow I didn't realize the bottled product was so strong. That would likely be the way to go so you don't have to dose so much liquid. if you want to raise cal by say 20 points per day you would have to dose 80 ml, which is not too bad. Being a large tank I don't think there's a way to do it with less liquid, a cal reactor might be something to look into if you get sick of it.

 

[tmz]

There are 3 common methods for supplementing alk and calcium which can be used singularly or in any combination you choose. Folks have had success with all of them . They are:

Two part dosing: calcium chloride and sodium carbonate.via commercial mixes or generic recipes detailed in the reef chemistry articles stickied at the top of this forum. Generic is much less costly. Overtime the extra chloride and sodium may raise sg so it should be monitored, usually correctable by routine water changes and tweaking .

Caclium hydroxide( kalkwaser/ limewater) Adds both calcium and alkalinity in one part; reduces CO2 content in the water thus raisng pH. Can be easily dosed slowly 24/7 via a still reservoir and timed peristaltic pump. Is self prufying to an extent and may precipitate some small amount of PO4. Generic food grade calcium hyrdoxidde is low cost.

CACO3 reactor ( calcium reactor) , Relatively high initial costs. Relatively complex in terms of managing flow ,CO2 regulation , media levels and equipment ( 2 pumps, CO2 bottle ,CO2 regulator ,reactor ) . Media may or may not have impurities . Soemtimes folks have trouble maintaining constancy in alk and calcium due to varitions in media volume, fines, clogs ,flow rates and pH levels. Has a pH lowering effect. Some have success with them and are happy with them.

All three can be useful. personally, my calcium reactor works best on the shelf where it's been for the last 5 years or so. I prefer calcium hyrdroxide dosed from a still reservoir for the main sytem and two part for a few small off sytem tanks.

 

[Mikenroe]

Thanks again guys!! Bertoni thank you for the reply, however I was aware that you could increase the strength, but was unaware you could increase it by that much. However that would be pretty costly do increase it,even if I increased it only to 40 or even half 20, due to the volume of product I would have to buy I want to Beatle to find the cheapest way to do this without sacrificing quality. Secondly, to put that much product in a container, wouldn't that melt the container do to the chemical reaction between the water and the product?

 

[tmz]

Take a look at Randy's article , which Jonathan noted earlier. It covers your questions about the strength of the calcium solution(37,000ppm) and containers to use . I use one gallon plastic milk containers ;though the reaction with water does generate heat ( I use an anhydrous calcium chloride product, Prestone Drieway Heat) it's not warm enough to melt the container .

 

[bertoni]

The 2-part calcium part still is fairly dilute, but 37,000 ppm is correct. If you are in a snowy part of AZ, some local store might carry some Dow Flake or something similar during the winter. Calcium chloride from pool supply places seems to work well, too. Baking soda is fairly inexpensive from the grocery store, but a restaurant supply place might have bulk products that are quite a bit less.

 

[Mikenroe]

Jonathan, what do you use? I've been using bright well. I live in Gilbert AZ. I read that article you suggested, and it seems like a 2 part might be the best way to go. but there again. what is the best way to do this and what is the cheapest way without sacrificing quality. I know in alk there is two parts to alk. What would you recogmend?

 

[bertoni]

I bought DIY chemicals a long time ago. Mag Flake was available online, as was Dow Flake.

 

[DylansGolden]

I was going to just run a doser with BRS 2-Part on my SPS only 66G SCA but I ending up getting a GEO calcium Reactor and just set it up today. They both work, but I like that the calcium reactor doesn't effect my salinity and it also adds trace elements. More of a set and forget with some adjusting as needed once it's dialed in and the coral grow. I just run 2TBSP per 5 Gallon of ATO water to counter the low pH of running a CaRx.