Downsizing??? Really???
- Thread starter Ron Reefman
- Start date
Ron Reefman
Active member
Thanks for the heads up. I knew they were coming soon.
Having looked at the RB 2' strip of all blue for $100 each (I'd want at least 2), and comparing them to the 21ledusa Reef Pro which is 44" has way more leds and can be had in a variety of spectrum and dimable for $136. The RB has nice fittings to attach the strip to a Photon V2, but I'd rather have 2 of the 44" rather than 4 of the 24", especially at a better price.
I wish RB had more spectrum and longer lengths. I'd be willing to pay some premium, but currently, it's less than I want and at a price that's too high.
Ron Reefman
Active member
We went to the Florida Keys last week and went snorkeling a few times. I managed to bring home 20 polyps of Little Money Zoas (because they are collected at Little Money Key), a few brown palys, two small variegated urchins, 2 medium size blue/green brittle stars, a very small yellow sea cucumber, 5 emerald crabs, a couple of clams, 20 turbo snails and 20 small sundial snails. BTW, we have the proper license to collect and these numbers are within the allowed limits, just in case anybody is concerned.
These got spread over the 125g main DT, the 65g shallow local reef and the 50g display refugium. Both urchins are in the 50g display refugium with "˜Hannibal' the red Hawaiian reef lobster. I suspect he will leave them alone. He doesn't seem interested in the turbo snails or the emerald crabs either. I guess it's just fish (and the previous owner said some corals). The small sundial snails spread out all over the 125g main tank.
Here are some pics of the things we collected while still in their native habitat.
A couple of other things of interest we saw that we didn't collect were this Gaudy Clown crab.
This small reef octopus.
This gorgeous Spotted Seahare.
A very nice sea star.
These got spread over the 125g main DT, the 65g shallow local reef and the 50g display refugium. Both urchins are in the 50g display refugium with "˜Hannibal' the red Hawaiian reef lobster. I suspect he will leave them alone. He doesn't seem interested in the turbo snails or the emerald crabs either. I guess it's just fish (and the previous owner said some corals). The small sundial snails spread out all over the 125g main tank.
Here are some pics of the things we collected while still in their native habitat.
A couple of other things of interest we saw that we didn't collect were this Gaudy Clown crab.
This small reef octopus.
This gorgeous Spotted Seahare.
A very nice sea star.
JonezNReef
Member
That's some really cool stuff! Thanks for sharing
Ron Reefman
Active member
If you like this stuff, you might find this thread interesting and more informative.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2511350
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2511350
Pelagic_e36
Member
Sorry if I missed it, but what salt mix do you use? You said you don't dose Ca or Alk?
Ron Reefman
Active member
Always happy to answer questions.
I use Instant Ocean Reef Crystals salt.
I do dose Ca, alk and Mg, but I use bulk forms. I use Dowflake (snow melt) for Ca at $20 for a 50lb bag, swimming pool supply sodium bicarbonate for alk, Mag Flake (another snow melt) for magnesium chloride and Epsom salt from San Francisco Salt for magnesium sulfide. They are all 50% to 65% less expensive than Bulk Reef Supply costs. And since I have 4 tanks (about 400g of saltwater in the house), cost is a bit of an issue I try to control!:fun4:
I use Instant Ocean Reef Crystals salt.
I do dose Ca, alk and Mg, but I use bulk forms. I use Dowflake (snow melt) for Ca at $20 for a 50lb bag, swimming pool supply sodium bicarbonate for alk, Mag Flake (another snow melt) for magnesium chloride and Epsom salt from San Francisco Salt for magnesium sulfide. They are all 50% to 65% less expensive than Bulk Reef Supply costs. And since I have 4 tanks (about 400g of saltwater in the house), cost is a bit of an issue I try to control!:fun4:
Pelagic_e36
Member
Awesome! Thanks for the info.
Ron Reefman
Active member
My new 21ledusa 4' led strips came in yesterday and I set them on the tank. Don't get your panties in a wad :lol2:, I'll post some photos over the next few days. But first I want to explain what I got and what I was trying to accomplish... and succeeded (at least IMHO)!
I have a 50" Reef Breeders Photon V2 over my 125g, 5'x2'x20" mixed reef tank by CADLight. The light is super and I love it, but I wanted better. And what I wanted wasn't something any led fixture on the market other than MAYBE a god awful expensive Pacific Sun hybrid. And even then, the t5 fixtures on their fixture aren't dimable.
I wanted a good 20,000K white light at the very front edge of my tank. It would brighten up the front and reduce shadows under rock and coral. This is a common complaint with leds. I tried a SunBlaster Nano t5 fixture and was not happy with the shade of white or the intensity. It did in fact reduce shadows, but that aspect of the fix was not nearly as dramatic as I had hoped for. The t5 came with a 6500K bulb, I tried a 10,000K bulb and a 15,000K bulb and wasn't happy with any of them.
So I ordered 2 48" fixtures from 21ledusa. One has 21 12,000K white and 21 445nm royal blue. All are 3 watts with 90 degree lenses and both channels have independant dimming. The second fixture is the same except it is all 445nm royal blue leds. The wire legs on these are so cheap as to be worthless when extended more than about 25%. So I will build new legs. But my tank has euro bracing and a clear mesh screen so the fixtures won't fall in the water!
I put the white & blue fixture at the very front edge of the tank and it virtually sits on the front euro brace. I tipped it back slightly so less light spills out the front glass and it helps get light under rocks and corals. Given the 50;50 split of 12K white and 445nm blue I've started it at full power. I suspect that in the long run I will dim both channels down some, so it's more than powerful enough to do what I want. I do get the cool white I wanted and it does light up the sand at the front of the tank. I'll test PAR and report that back as well.
The all 445nm blue strip is near the back of the tank, about 3" or 4" off the back edge. I started it at full power as well. I wanted blue and good PAR because I have 5 corals that are encrusting onto the back glass about 2/3rds of the way up the glass. That made it very difficult for the Reef Breeders V2 to light up the front of the tank by moving it forward and still getting good light more than half way up the back glass! The 21ledusa strip worked perfect. The corals on the back glass even fluoresce while the white leds of the V2 are on.
The big picture look I wanted to achieve was a more white look at the front of the tank. Then I could go a bit more blue/white than my normal V2 settings to the point as well as being able to lower the V2 on it's legs since I didn't need to try and cover 24" of bottom front to back along with 2/3rds of the back glass. And obviously the back of the tank is seriously blue due to the 21ledusa all blue strip. So when I look in the tank, the front looks typical, normal, up close, easy to see, just like what I see when I'm snorkeling. But what I really like is that the tank gets more and more blue toward the back, just like the water does when you look off into the distance while underwater. That was what I really wanted and the fact that a couple of corals fluoresce so much that they even 'glow' some while the white midday lights are on is just the frosting on the cake! The one other improvement in the overal look is the clear screen over the tank really picks up a lot of light and looks like a bright, shinny lid on the tank and to my eyes it was too much reflection. I had considered changing the screen to a dark one, and I still may. But the 21ledusa strip that is at the very front edge of the tank blocks 95% of that white glare. Just another unexpected enhancement!
For now I have the led strips on just 2 timers (one for each strip). But each strip has 2 power cords so I could light up each channel separately. I have the blues in back come on 2 hours into a 4 hour sunrise but I already think I'll move that up to just 1 hour into sunrise. The white and blue front led comes on 3 hours into sunrise and I'll probably set it up so the blues come on 2 hours in and then the whites at 3 hours in. I have sunset set up very similar and I'll adjust it so the blues stay on a bit deeper into the sunset as I love the fluorescence level I have with many of the newer corals I've added since my old tank broke and this one started last Fall. So the extra blue from the led strips really make the corals pop. I've said it before, but now more than ever the sunset over the tank makes it look like a crazy, wild colored hippie poster from the 60's or 70's under a powerful blacklight! I only wish I could capture it in photos or video and make it look as intense as it looks to my eyes.
I'll work on some comparison photos and maybe even videos today and tomorrow and post them here.:beer:
I have a 50" Reef Breeders Photon V2 over my 125g, 5'x2'x20" mixed reef tank by CADLight. The light is super and I love it, but I wanted better. And what I wanted wasn't something any led fixture on the market other than MAYBE a god awful expensive Pacific Sun hybrid. And even then, the t5 fixtures on their fixture aren't dimable.
I wanted a good 20,000K white light at the very front edge of my tank. It would brighten up the front and reduce shadows under rock and coral. This is a common complaint with leds. I tried a SunBlaster Nano t5 fixture and was not happy with the shade of white or the intensity. It did in fact reduce shadows, but that aspect of the fix was not nearly as dramatic as I had hoped for. The t5 came with a 6500K bulb, I tried a 10,000K bulb and a 15,000K bulb and wasn't happy with any of them.
So I ordered 2 48" fixtures from 21ledusa. One has 21 12,000K white and 21 445nm royal blue. All are 3 watts with 90 degree lenses and both channels have independant dimming. The second fixture is the same except it is all 445nm royal blue leds. The wire legs on these are so cheap as to be worthless when extended more than about 25%. So I will build new legs. But my tank has euro bracing and a clear mesh screen so the fixtures won't fall in the water!
I put the white & blue fixture at the very front edge of the tank and it virtually sits on the front euro brace. I tipped it back slightly so less light spills out the front glass and it helps get light under rocks and corals. Given the 50;50 split of 12K white and 445nm blue I've started it at full power. I suspect that in the long run I will dim both channels down some, so it's more than powerful enough to do what I want. I do get the cool white I wanted and it does light up the sand at the front of the tank. I'll test PAR and report that back as well.
The all 445nm blue strip is near the back of the tank, about 3" or 4" off the back edge. I started it at full power as well. I wanted blue and good PAR because I have 5 corals that are encrusting onto the back glass about 2/3rds of the way up the glass. That made it very difficult for the Reef Breeders V2 to light up the front of the tank by moving it forward and still getting good light more than half way up the back glass! The 21ledusa strip worked perfect. The corals on the back glass even fluoresce while the white leds of the V2 are on.
The big picture look I wanted to achieve was a more white look at the front of the tank. Then I could go a bit more blue/white than my normal V2 settings to the point as well as being able to lower the V2 on it's legs since I didn't need to try and cover 24" of bottom front to back along with 2/3rds of the back glass. And obviously the back of the tank is seriously blue due to the 21ledusa all blue strip. So when I look in the tank, the front looks typical, normal, up close, easy to see, just like what I see when I'm snorkeling. But what I really like is that the tank gets more and more blue toward the back, just like the water does when you look off into the distance while underwater. That was what I really wanted and the fact that a couple of corals fluoresce so much that they even 'glow' some while the white midday lights are on is just the frosting on the cake! The one other improvement in the overal look is the clear screen over the tank really picks up a lot of light and looks like a bright, shinny lid on the tank and to my eyes it was too much reflection. I had considered changing the screen to a dark one, and I still may. But the 21ledusa strip that is at the very front edge of the tank blocks 95% of that white glare. Just another unexpected enhancement!
For now I have the led strips on just 2 timers (one for each strip). But each strip has 2 power cords so I could light up each channel separately. I have the blues in back come on 2 hours into a 4 hour sunrise but I already think I'll move that up to just 1 hour into sunrise. The white and blue front led comes on 3 hours into sunrise and I'll probably set it up so the blues come on 2 hours in and then the whites at 3 hours in. I have sunset set up very similar and I'll adjust it so the blues stay on a bit deeper into the sunset as I love the fluorescence level I have with many of the newer corals I've added since my old tank broke and this one started last Fall. So the extra blue from the led strips really make the corals pop. I've said it before, but now more than ever the sunset over the tank makes it look like a crazy, wild colored hippie poster from the 60's or 70's under a powerful blacklight! I only wish I could capture it in photos or video and make it look as intense as it looks to my eyes.
I'll work on some comparison photos and maybe even videos today and tomorrow and post them here.:beer:
der_wille_zur_macht
Team RC
I am looking forward to photos. I really appreciate what you are doing with the white to blue fade front to back. I tried for a similar effect on a 125 set up as a peninsula maybe 12 or 14 years ago, with a 10k mh at one end and a 20k at the other. I really loved the effect, it was probably my favorite pre-LED light rig.
Ron Reefman
Active member
OK, I have 3 photos to show you. The 1st is with just the Photon V2 on. Th 2nd is with the V2 and the backside blue leds. The 3rd is with the V2, backside blue and frontside white & blue leds on. The differences are subtle, but if you look at shadows under some of the front rocks and the shade of blue on the back glass you can see a difference. Photos don't do the differences justice. In the photos, when the backside blue leds are on, the back wall stuff doesn't look any more blue, it just looks better lit. But in person the difference is fairly dramatic.
Just the Photon V2 fixture:
The Photon V2 and the backside all blue led strip:
The Photon V2, the backside blue strip and the up front white & blue strip:
Just the Photon V2 fixture:
The Photon V2 and the backside all blue led strip:
The Photon V2, the backside blue strip and the up front white & blue strip:
HuskerBioProf
New member
Interesting about the light gradient. I was thinking about doing something similar with adding a shadow box to the back of the tank to give the illusion of fading to blue. You can tell the difference in the photos, but I'm sure they don't do it justice.
der_wille_zur_macht
Team RC
Awesome. That last photo looks great. You really accomplished the goal of emphasizing the shift from bright white to shadowy darker blue, it adds a sense of depth that's totally missing in most aquariums.
Ron Reefman
Active member
Thanks guys.
HuskerBioProf, I learned about the shadow box technique after I built my 180g tank about 7 years ago and I would loved to have done it then. But that tank had a closed loop and lots of pipes running up the back of the tank (inside and out). This tank already had the back glass blacked out and I didn't want to take the time to remove it as I had lots of small holding tanks full of coral, fish and other critters from the old 180g that needed a home after 6 weeks purgatory!
I still think the shadow box is a cool idea.
der wille zur match, it worked out as well as I could have hoped. My first fellow reefer visitor was blown away by the look. But photos of blue tanks just do look like they do in person. I'd love to post up pics of what it looks like with all the blues of the photon and the t led strips (the front strip is half blue). The fluoresced colors are crazy! But the photos look awful. I think it's a white balance thing with the camera, but I've tried every white balance setting I have in all 3 of my cameras and none of them look good (thank goodness for digital cameras). I know some kind of a yellow filter can help, but I haven't really looked into it yet. But now that I have a Nikon P900 super zoom point and shoot, I may look into it and see if I can buy a filter.
HuskerBioProf, I learned about the shadow box technique after I built my 180g tank about 7 years ago and I would loved to have done it then. But that tank had a closed loop and lots of pipes running up the back of the tank (inside and out). This tank already had the back glass blacked out and I didn't want to take the time to remove it as I had lots of small holding tanks full of coral, fish and other critters from the old 180g that needed a home after 6 weeks purgatory!
I still think the shadow box is a cool idea.
der wille zur match, it worked out as well as I could have hoped. My first fellow reefer visitor was blown away by the look. But photos of blue tanks just do look like they do in person. I'd love to post up pics of what it looks like with all the blues of the photon and the t led strips (the front strip is half blue). The fluoresced colors are crazy! But the photos look awful. I think it's a white balance thing with the camera, but I've tried every white balance setting I have in all 3 of my cameras and none of them look good (thank goodness for digital cameras). I know some kind of a yellow filter can help, but I haven't really looked into it yet. But now that I have a Nikon P900 super zoom point and shoot, I may look into it and see if I can buy a filter.
der_wille_zur_macht
Team RC
I feel your pain. I love photography! I can take a great shot of a natural landscape or a bird or my kids or whatever, but I can't manage a single good photo of a reef tank that I feel reflects the actual appearance.
der_wille_zur_macht
Team RC
What style of shadowbox are you guys talking about? I've seen people do boxes on reef tanks where they put objects (rockwork usually it seems) in an actual box. I understand the goal but feel like it hardly ever comes off as natural.
On the other hand, I've seen FW tanks with a different style, and built one myself. You still put a box on the back of the tank, but you put a piece of translucent colored material (stiff plastic usually) in the box, slanted at an angle. The material is lit from behind with a colored light. The slant gives a "fade to infinity" sort of effect and creates a gradient of color. I think something like this would look amazing on a reef tank if it was properly done.
As a whole, I think it's a shame that reefkeepers seem to just default to black rear walls and totally uniform lighting by default and don't experiment with techniques that can help create the illusion of depth.
Ron Reefman
Active member
Steve, I'll get a couple of pics for you. But I hope to try and improve on the way the strips are mounted. They have the standard thin wire legs that expand out from inside the fixture. But when I expand them to fit the 60" tank they are fully extended About 8" to 10" outside the fixture and that leaves very little wire, if any, inside the fixture to 'hold it up'.
So I think having longer wire legs, 8 to 10" outside the fixture and another 8 to 10" inside the fixture will make it much 'stiffer' and hold the fixture up better. Right now the wire legs let the fixture sag down so it partially rests on the euro brace or the screen tank cover. But I've never tried pulling a set of the legs completely out of the fixture for fear that I might damage something or may not be able to get it back in.
I'd also conside taking the entire fixture apart. It's possible that I could drill the leg holes a little bigger and put a more substantial set of legs into it. I kind of like that idea best and mostly it just requires some spare time on my part!
der wille zur match, yup, I'm a serious amateur photographer as well. I've been using an Olympus super zoom point and shoot (22mm to 840mm lens) for sports and nature pics. Thus the desire to have a good zoom lens. I recently got a Nikon P900 that has a 22mm to 2000mm zoom. Holy crap! I'll be the first to admit that at 2000mm it's not a great lens, but it does work. Besides those 2 I have an Olympus Tough camera for simple use and, more importantly, for snorkeling. It has an f2.0 lens which is a bit faster than any of the other tough cameras on the market. That means faster shutter during underwater photos.
Same octopus about 10 seconds apart:
The shadow boxes I saw were fairly simple. The deeper the box, the more you could do with it, but mostly a hazy sheet of plastic on the back glass and some cut outs to look like rocks in the background and some overhead led lighting. It wasn't all that realistic, but it's a whole lot better than the old plastic reef scenes people used to stick up on the back of an aquarium.
I'm OK with the black back glass as I have 2 powerheads back there and they almost disappear. I've also taken 5 magnet frag plugs and started 5 coral frags that are starting to encrust onto the back glass.
BTW, I just read your sig. I love the "Inconveniencing marine life since 1992", you have 10+ years on me there. And I couldn't agree more with the Eric Borneman quote. That's why I keep bringing home stuff from the Gulf of Mexico and the Florida Keys that I can't find online. Well, except at a couple of sites like KP Aquatics and Gulf Coast Ecosystems.
So I think having longer wire legs, 8 to 10" outside the fixture and another 8 to 10" inside the fixture will make it much 'stiffer' and hold the fixture up better. Right now the wire legs let the fixture sag down so it partially rests on the euro brace or the screen tank cover. But I've never tried pulling a set of the legs completely out of the fixture for fear that I might damage something or may not be able to get it back in.
I'd also conside taking the entire fixture apart. It's possible that I could drill the leg holes a little bigger and put a more substantial set of legs into it. I kind of like that idea best and mostly it just requires some spare time on my part!
der wille zur match, yup, I'm a serious amateur photographer as well. I've been using an Olympus super zoom point and shoot (22mm to 840mm lens) for sports and nature pics. Thus the desire to have a good zoom lens. I recently got a Nikon P900 that has a 22mm to 2000mm zoom. Holy crap! I'll be the first to admit that at 2000mm it's not a great lens, but it does work. Besides those 2 I have an Olympus Tough camera for simple use and, more importantly, for snorkeling. It has an f2.0 lens which is a bit faster than any of the other tough cameras on the market. That means faster shutter during underwater photos.
Same octopus about 10 seconds apart:
The shadow boxes I saw were fairly simple. The deeper the box, the more you could do with it, but mostly a hazy sheet of plastic on the back glass and some cut outs to look like rocks in the background and some overhead led lighting. It wasn't all that realistic, but it's a whole lot better than the old plastic reef scenes people used to stick up on the back of an aquarium.
I'm OK with the black back glass as I have 2 powerheads back there and they almost disappear. I've also taken 5 magnet frag plugs and started 5 coral frags that are starting to encrust onto the back glass.
BTW, I just read your sig. I love the "Inconveniencing marine life since 1992", you have 10+ years on me there. And I couldn't agree more with the Eric Borneman quote. That's why I keep bringing home stuff from the Gulf of Mexico and the Florida Keys that I can't find online. Well, except at a couple of sites like KP Aquatics and Gulf Coast Ecosystems.
