drummereef's 180g in-wall build

[drummereef]

Looking good....even a PO4 of 0.02 isn't bad, but i am sure a littel food had to do with it?
What are you doing for dosing again?

I am currently dosing DIY 2 part. About 70ml daily.

NOTE THE ADD...OCD attention to detail as everything is sitting prefectly on a Paper towel!:spin2:

:lol: Presentation is everything right?

should add
....sitting perfectly on the perfectly clean paper towel

:lol:

gads - it must be like a clean lab over there, got to love it

Haha! I wish. :rollface:

 

[drummereef]

Brett,

After looking at your chemistry numbers aren't you a bit concerned with running your alk that high while using pellets? From all my research and some local experience here, I've seen some tanks crash with that high of alk while running pellets. I thought when running the ULNS that you were suppose to keep alk more towards NSW @ 8.

I was unaware of this Josh. Are there some links you can provide with this information? I've only heard claims that some bio pellets could cause elevated alk levels but I haven't heard of crashes due to higher alk levels. Definitely point me in the direction of any info you have.

subscribed

Thanks Matt!

Hey Brett - love the updates. Just wondering if you think the temp fluctuation is too much? Now, I have zero monitoring on my system so the only way to know how much mine fluctuates is to get up at the middle of the night and check Just curious what you think is a safe temp fluctuation over several days?

Also, great points about the backup. I have a 6kw portable generator that I'm ready to use in emergency but havent had to yet. i really need to look into a battery backup for when im not home. thanks!

As of now I don't see any detrimental effects of the temp swing. Normally it's only about 1-2 degrees over the course of a few hours. The peak value, 80.70 might have been an anomaly in the program as well as the low value, 78.3. Looking at the mean curve, 78.4-79.5 doesn't look as bad as the graph makes it seem. I am keeping an eye on it though...

subscribed

Thanks akronut!

 

[Greenmaster]

Hey Brett - love the updates. Just wondering if you think the temp fluctuation is too much? Now, I have zero monitoring on my system so the only way to know how much mine fluctuates is to get up at the middle of the night and check Just curious what you think is a safe temp fluctuation over several days?

Look at temp swings in the ocean... even just the day/night swing is larger then Drummereef's.

 

[cromedogg33]

Brett,

I'll find a few more useful links today. I don't think it's DIRECTLY correlated to "biopellets" per say it's what we are trying to achieve with an ULNS. The pellets are a bi-product of doing that.

Theres a few good reads on ULNS and I'll try and find them out again. I've completely stopped dosing alk of my auto top off for this reason as I watched a fellow reefer here burn almost every coral in his tank.

 

[cromedogg33]

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1953484&highlight=biopellets+and+alkalinity

This is a post more with opinions rather than facts, I believe IF a remember correctly sunnyx did a great writeup on ULNS.

 

[drummereef]

Brett,

I'll find a few more useful links today. I don't think it's DIRECTLY correlated to "biopellets" per say it's what we are trying to achieve with an ULNS. The pellets are a bi-product of doing that.

Theres a few good reads on ULNS and I'll try and find them out again. I've completely stopped dosing alk of my auto top off for this reason as I watched a fellow reefer here burn almost every coral in his tank.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1953484&highlight=biopellets+and+alkalinity

This is a post more with opinions rather than facts, I believe IF a remember correctly sunnyx did a great writeup on ULNS.

This is very interesting Josh. Thanks for the heads up. :thumbsup: I remember reading Sonny's article, I think it's still on his site but I'll take a look back at it again. I haven't noticed anything strange with the corals yet, good color and polyp extension so far but I've stopped dosing to let the Alk come down a little. I'll try and nail it around 8.0dkh and see what happens. My Calcium was a little high too so it's not a bad thing if both come down at the moment.

 

[drummereef]

UPDATE:


Picked up a few snails today. 14 Nerite and 12 Cerith snails for the tank. As much as I like the Mexican Turbos I might have to start trading them in. They're so dang big they are starting to knock stuff over. And you know what drummer said about this... :hammer: I might trade them in for some more Trochus if I can find them. Here's a couple pics.


Nerite Snail

Cerith Snail. I wish I could get a better pic of the acro to the right of the cerith. It's about as electric blue as it gets but for some reason I can't seem to replicate the colors accurately. I'll work on getting a better pic of it.

 

[110galreef]

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1953484&highlight=biopellets+and+alkalinity

This is a post more with opinions rather than facts, I believe IF a remember correctly sunnyx did a great writeup on ULNS.

That is an interesting read. Do you know of any other thread or issues tieing these together......

I have had NO issues thus far w/ all my sps colonies & frags and my dKh has been coming down from 10.8 to now 9.3 since Jan 1. It got way out of whack at first when i started dosing in Mid dec. I am however, running ~ 1/2 the recommended dose for my size tank....maybe this is the key? especially if you already have a healthy, "lower" nutrient system to start. Seems many have like say PO4 & nitrates of 10-50+ & then try to run the biopellets & have that solve the problem aside from curing the underlying issue first then perfect water with biopellets or gfo, etc....too much chg to quick???

ALK: 9.3dkH
Cal: 430
PO4: 0.00
Mg:1350
Nitrate & Nitrite & Ammon: 0
pH hovers 8.03(mornin) & 8.13(eve)

But either way all still looks good. I was planning to get my ALK down to 9.0 slowly anyway, maybe I'll just go to 8.5 & hang there. That will give me a litlle lee-way to go up or down a little & still be safe between tests.

 

[jackfrost]

This is an excellent thread. Congrats to all your effort and time and most important PATIENCE !

I see too many people fail in this hobby because they want to grow SPS in less than 30 days from putting water in their tanks.

So Congrats !

 

[coffeenut]

That is an interesting read. Do you know of any other thread or issues tieing these together......

I have had NO issues thus far w/ all my sps colonies & frags and my dKh has been coming down from 10.8 to now 9.3 since Jan 1. It got way out of whack at first when i started dosing in Mid dec. I am however, running ~ 1/2 the recommended dose for my size tank....maybe this is the key? especially if you already have a healthy, "lower" nutrient system to start. Seems many have like say PO4 & nitrates of 10-50+ & then try to run the biopellets & have that solve the problem aside from curing the underlying issue first then perfect water with biopellets or gfo, etc....too much chg to quick???

ALK: 9.3dkH
Cal: 430
PO4: 0.00
Mg:1350
Nitrate & Nitrite & Ammon: 0
pH hovers 8.03(mornin) & 8.13(eve)

But either way all still looks good. I was planning to get my ALK down to 9.0 slowly anyway, maybe I'll just go to 8.5 & hang there. That will give me a litlle lee-way to go up or down a little & still be safe between tests.

IM running BIO pellets , quite a bit i must add.. like 4500 worth for 600 gal.. for 1 year now.. I am mainly sps...

My #s are about what you show above..
and my sps are doing great.
Check out my tank .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEJasUZ5YxQ]

 

[drummereef]

I was planning to get my ALK down to 9.0 slowly anyway, maybe I'll just go to 8.5 & hang there. That will give me a litlle lee-way to go up or down a little & still be safe between tests.

Sounds like a good plan to me.

This is an excellent thread. Congrats to all your effort and time and most important PATIENCE !

I see too many people fail in this hobby because they want to grow SPS in less than 30 days from putting water in their tanks.

So Congrats !

Thank you jackfrost!

Check out my tank .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEJasUZ5YxQ]

Glad to hear you are having good success with the bio pellets coffee. Awesome vid of your tank too!! :thumbsup:

 

[drummereef]

Here's another thread on the topic of Alk with bio pellets, quite interesting again. It was linked to me by Gary Faulkner in the Warner Marine ecoBAK Forum.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1967026

 

[drummereef]

So here's something new... I started to smell an odor from my RO/DI water the last couple days. Kind of smells like a burnt rubber smell. Not musty or like mold but more like burnt rubber if that makes sense. I've had other DI cartridges smell like this in the past when they are near exhaustion but wondering if anyone else has experienced this.

Also, I tested the PO4 of the RO/DI after the DI stage this evening. It tested 0.05 with my Hanna Checker!! This was after running the unit for a minute or two. The TDS reads 000 with the digital meter on my system. What gives??? Also, what the heck do you do about the phosphate getting through the RO/DI other than change the DI resin?

 

[cromedogg33]

Here's another thread on the topic of Alk with bio pellets, quite interesting again. It was linked to me by Gary Faulkner in the Warner Marine ecoBAK Forum.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1967026

Interesting read, and goes pretty much along the lines of what I've been reading as well.

I think the major issue some people might have with biopellets is they don't understand exactly how much they are removing from the water. You have to aggressively overfeed IMO. I see some people throw in a cube for 4 tangs, some anthias ,and expect there to be left overs for coral.

To the issue at hand though, I believe we have to keep our alk at ~8 to get best results. I guess me saying "tank crash" might have been a bit of a strong term, but after seeing a local reefer here have his alk creep up to 9.5 I watched basically everything "crash".

Anyhow, I hope this gives you a bit of heads up so that all the hardwork you have put in doesn't get shot down later.

 

[110galreef]

This whole thing has me somewhat worried.....

I know have 250g display & a 40g frag tank I dont' want to zap.....
wondering if I should just pull the biopellets & see what my params are w/o them & see how the corals responds....maybe they will color up better?

Plus if params are in check w/o pellets, then I will save $$ there too? The basics used to be (still), regular WC, Skim moderate to heavy, keep ALK, CAL, MAG ideal, good flow, feed properly, and keep Nitrate, Ammonia & PO4 "in check" and all will be succesful. But what is "in check" ..........is PO4 & nitrate at 0.00 bad.....is nitrates of 3-5 & P04 of .03 better?

Ahhhhh....This hobby & all the PRO, CONS, OPINIONS, IDEAS.......why can't there be a simple follow this and all is well.

 

[cromedogg33]

I don't think taking them offline all of a sudden will help. I think it's more of educating ourselves in some of the newer technology. Basically all it's saying is keep your alk a bit lower and realize the biopellets take a TON out of the water.

Pellets were designed to be run with overpowered skimmers. I think others get in trouble when using smaller than ideal skimmers on tanks while running pellets.

The old saying "overfeed/overskim/overpump."

I've seen AMAZING tanks in person and on the site that are running pellets. We are all learning a little bit more through time using them. I think it's hard for us hobbyists to purposefully overfeed a tank and not think about side effects. I'll never be the person who says "you can't do it this way or that way" because without a doubt somebody has done it.

 

[110galreef]

it seems like then we are just throwing one thing at something(which may not even be an issue) to only then have to adjust something else to compensate for the previous fix.

ie, biopellets to make a very low nutrients system into an ULNS, and thus needing to now lower Alk, & feed more?

any general negatives to an alk of 7.0-8.0. Or is that just low on the "ok" range?

another note....i have had 750ml of biopellets running about 2.5 mos and probably still have 90% left? Good bad indifferent??

 

[drummereef]

any general negatives to an alk of 7.0-8.0. Or is that just low on the "ok" range?

As far as the Alk goes, I think this is just range where people are seeing the best results.

I definitely agree with the feeding angle. I also agree people don't know how much nutrient the bacteria is taking from the water column. And, in the same regard, the bio pellets allow us to feed foods that would generally disturb the nutrient balance of our systems. I think it's a change in mindset, where the old idea of fish poop alone isn't going to cut it for the health of our corals when using this system. I like the idea and am sticking to it at least for a while. One thing I really need to do is to investigate good foods but are small enough for stony corals.

 

[cromedogg33]

Brett,

It's a good thought to see what coral ACTUALLY eat other than fish poo. I have been debating on dosing phyto in my tank but at what cost? I'm not entirely sure there is actual evidence of corals eating phyto. There is physical evidence of live brine being eaten by coral.

Have you tried live brine shrimp at all? It's something I've contemplated feeding as my tank matures a bit more to offset cost/time. Right now I'm feeding pellets/mysis/brine. What I've been doing is basically feeding everytime I walk around to look at my tank. I grab a pinch of pellets and throw them in. I'm feeding more and more often in my new 180 vs my old 75 which I was doing 1 to 2 max times a day and not nearly as much as now. It's a concious effort to feed more. I think it's helping overall keeping everything happy. Fatter/bigger fish=more poop, more food in the water column=happier coral.

I will definately continue to see your progress as well as mine as I'm using ecobak pellets as well, but I started from day 1 and have been running carbon as well with no GFO. I as well dosed MB7 from day 1. Only thing I haven't run into like you was green hair algae.


The battle continues.....

 

[cromedogg33]

So here's something new... I started to smell an odor from my RO/DI water the last couple days. Kind of smells like a burnt rubber smell. Not musty or like mold but more like burnt rubber if that makes sense. I've had other DI cartridges smell like this in the past when they are near exhaustion but wondering if anyone else has experienced this.

Also, I tested the PO4 of the RO/DI after the DI stage this evening. It tested 0.05 with my Hanna Checker!! This was after running the unit for a minute or two. The TDS reads 000 with the digital meter on my system. What gives??? Also, what the heck do you do about the phosphate getting through the RO/DI other than change the DI resin?

Are you running your DI cartridges vertical or horizontal? I run 3 in series that are vertical as it forces the water to travel throught the entire resin rather than the lower half on most that come horizontal.