Elegance coral never really opens up

[VJV]

Hi, I have had my elegance for over one year now and it never opened up fully. It has not died either but it is constantly closed, and the polyps are shrunken, even when it opens up.

My tank parameters are PH of 8,1-8,2, Cal440, Alk 8,0dKH, Mag1280ppm, PO4 0,015 and NO3 always undetectable.

I have used several different salts during this period, including Aquavitro Salinity, Red Sea Coral salt and Tropic Marin pro-reef.

Recently I moved it to a QT because I was treating the main display with Fauna Marin DinoX and it really closed up.

Any suggestions?

Thanks!

 

[steallife904]

I think its not happy right now because of the GHA growing around it. They also need to be fed often. They are one of the difficult LPS to keep from what I have heard. Do you have the GHA throughout the tank?

 

[Dkuhlmann]

Elegance are not hard to keep but I do agree with you that algae has to go. You need to pull it and use a toothbrush or some other kind of brush and get it all off of it.

I agree how bad is the algae in your tank? Looks like some Bryopsis on it as well. There is no way that your nitrates and phosphates are 0 having all of that algae. I'm guessing that you have this throughout your tank.

 

[A1t2o]

^Agreed with both above. Solve the GHA problem and target feed the elegance when the power heads are off. Personally I added an ATS and a couple more hermits to take care of my GHA problem. I also started doing a 1 gallon water change per day routine, 46 gallon tank, I don't do it every day but it does help with making it easy to remember to actually do it. The GHA was already receding before I started the daily water changes so I do not think that was the reason.

Just take care of your nutrient export and get all of your parameters on spec, then the GHA should recced and your elegance should open up. The elegance is a bit more finicky, so make sure it is getting low flow and medium light. Good luck.

 

[VJV]

Elegance coral never really opens up

I think its not happy right now because of the GHA growing around it. They also need to be fed often. They are one of the difficult LPS to keep from what I have heard. Do you have the GHA throughout the tank?

Thanks! GHA is relatively recent. I will take care of it anyway. The Elegance is now in a QT with zero other algae.

 

[VJV]

Thanks, I did had a bad case of GHA in my tank but took care of it by pulling the rocks out and treating with H2O2, plus left the tank fish less for 3 months with zero feedings.

I'm afraid that Nitrates and Phosphates have indeed been at zero. Been using test kits from Hanna, Red Sea and Salifert. They were at zero before I had it, and remained afterwords. Algae unfortunately does it feed only on these elements. Algae also feeds on dissolved organics/fish waste, before it is broken down into NO3 and PO4.

So you can indeed have very little of either and still have algae growth.

But I would not want to divert from the topic of the elegance coral. It was not expanding before I had GHA either so would like to hear from people that have them what is it that makes them thrive.

I never really fed it so that is already one thing to take away. Other inputs much appreciated.

Thanks!

 

[Four drachma]

My elegance likes medium light and was closing when I had it over 24 " below the water surface.

I have 0 nitrates and Phosphates and it's evident by the absence of any hair algae. If I begin to see any algae sprouting, I know my phosphates and nitrates are rising.....I say this because your elegance is surrounded by hair algae, therefore your NO & PO are high.
I use Red Sea and it's one of the more accurate tests out there, but you said you tried it...?

 

[VJV]

My elegance likes medium light and was closing when I had it over 24 " below the water surface.

I have 0 nitrates and Phosphates and it's evident by the absence of any hair algae. If I begin to see any algae sprouting, I know my phosphates and nitrates are rising.....I say this because your elegance is surrounded by hair algae, therefore your NO & PO are high.
I use Red Sea and it's one of the more accurate tests out there, but you said you tried it...?

Thanks. I do belive that lighting may have been too strong. I also had a lot of flow in my main tank which again, it did not like. As for algae, i did have it in the main display (now the coral is in a quarantine tank) but I can tell you that indeed Nitrayes and Phosphates were close to zero.

Red sea pro tests were always an absolute zero (before any algae apeared, as well as afyer it did). I boight three different kits because based on all the advise i SHOULD have both. I than bought the Ultra low resolution Hanna Phosphorus test, wgich is way more accurate and it measures between 0,005 and 0,015, still very low.

The fact is that algae grows on disolved as well as non disolved organics, not only in PO4 or NO3.

This guy has beem closed up before the algae apeared and after so, I rule it out as a cause. Also, if indeed the reason why the test kit does not pick it up is because the algae is consuming it, The water would be clean anyways, just like if i was using a refugium with macro algae. And corals seem to do very well in tanks with refugiums so again, do mot think that this is the cause here.

Flow and light is what i am much more leaning towards, and appreciate you sharing your experience in this regard. Unfortunately everyone seems to look at the picture and just go "Aaarrghhh, you have algae so you are doomed" .

Kind regards.

 

[Go.Fish]

I know the algae issue on that piece doesn't seem like a big concern to you. It helps consume the nitrate and phosphate that was present in your water giving you low readings. That being said, it would really benefit that elegance to get rid of that algae. Turkey baste the algae before doing water changes is one way to reduce the presence, or use a toothbrush, or you could also pull the coral out and spot treat the algae with peroxide. The soft tissue of the coral can easily get irratated by the presence of it. With a clean perimeter it may allow the coral to expand further without irritation. They are notoriously difficult corals to keep in captivity, some people can, some people can't. Kudos to you for keeping it alive for over a year!
You mentioned you changed salt several times in this period, this can have a negative effect on corals if not done slowly. Stability is a key to success as you're probably well aware, have you decided on a salt now? If changing brands entirely I would do so over the course of at least a few months.
And have you mentioned what lighting you're using? Photoperiod? That would also help in knowing if this is having an effect on algae growth. Lowering photoperiod, changing spectrum may also benefit by controlling the algae and happiness of the coral.

 

[VJV]

Thank you for your elaborate reply! Lots of useful info. All the other corals were fine with the different salt mixes I used and on the other hand, this one was closed up before I changed for the first time. I take your point on stability and I plan to stick with the Tropic Marin Pro Reef. I use a doser to keep Alk, Cal and Mag stable. Split dosages over 24x per day so that things are as stable as possible.

Lights are Ecotech radion XR15Pro LEDs and the Elegance coral was sitting in the sandbed, 24 inches deep.

Flow was provided by 2 Tunze 6095s, which at 10.000l/h each provide something like 60x turnover for the tank, which has 300L.

Since the beginning I suspected that flow could be the problem. At the store it was in one of those zero edge tanks with no power heads inside. In my tank when it opened the sides were always swaying in the current.

I will take care of the algae with some peroxide. Your point on it irritating the coral makes a lot of sense. Also, after I post an algae clean picture hopefully I'll get more light/flow input and less NO3PO4 comments [emoji4]

 

[Dkuhlmann]

Holy cow, that's a lot of turnover and way too much for any LPS. Yes I'm now convinced after your last post that the flow is most of your problem.

In my 40b I only have one 800 gph power head and the return flow, that's it. I do have a mostly LPS dominate tank with a few LPS that are on a rock up high with the return flow directly on them and they seem to do, OK. These are the easier to keep SPS and I'm doing these as an experiment to see if I can keep one of the beautiful blue acros. And if these don't do well then that's OK too. My most favorite corals are LPS.

I hope you find a way to block some of that flow to your elegance so it can do better for you.

 

[VJV]

It's a learning curve with any coral for sure. I jave several other LPS (large torch, large hammer, lobo, trachy, acans) and each has its specific requirements. The Lobo was struggling When i had it high up in the structure but since it went on the sandbed it is thriving. The torch coral is sitting at the top of a rock under the LED lights and blowing in the current and it is doing fantastic. More than 12 inch accross, swaing in the flow. The hammer on the other side, hates high flow and high ligh. Had to place it close to the substrate in a moderate flow area in order for it to thrive.

The elegance however was always very hard to keep happy. It was on the sandbed but even there the undertow seems to be too mich for him. Having said this, i have seen videos on youtube showing elegance corals swaing in what apears to be high flow and they look amazing...

I guess requirements may vary down to individuals within their species...

No one said it would be easy... But thats what makes it so addictive!

Please keep your inputs comming!

 

[taricha]

This discussion is a good example of what IMO is one of the flaws in coral care advice.
Feeding, water parameters and even light levels are all well defined.
Flow on the other hand? High, Medium, and Low are meaningless without some benchmark. The worst is "medium" flow. That's given as advice all the time and could literally mean almost anything.

The only thing I could come up with to solve this is reference videos. "Medium flow as seen here", but even that can be a little deceptive.
A very extended very soft tissue coral Will make the same flow look more vigorous than a less extended less flexible tissue specimen.
Good thing most corals can adapt to different conditions if given acclimation time.

 

[VJV]

Elegance coral never really opens up

Still have not got around to taking care of the GHA on the base of the coral. In any event two weeks into quarantine and already looking better. This tank has much lower flow, about 20x. The light is also scaled way back otherwise the acans I have there will close up.

 

[Four drachma]

I'm glad to hear it's getting better, they're such beauties! You're doing something right,it looks very healthy.

 

[VJV]

Another update. Still on the QT and now always fully open. Tentacles never really got back to the original size. Apologies for the tank as it is going through the uglies [emoji13][emoji13][emoji13]!

Also, difficult to get white balance and exposure right with the iPhone.