Emergency drain line - must have?

[JammyBirch]

Any restriction to a drain introduces a place for clogs to occur. Math it out all you want, it doesn't prevent clogs. Because it hasn't happened, doesn't mean it can't or won't. Good reefing is building in redundancies.

I get it and agree, I've had clogs before, lots of them just no water on the floor. All I'm saying is restricting a drain is not something to be intimidated by if you use your head you can have a single drain system with full flow and dead quiet.

Back to the OP...

If you're interested in the used setup with only two holes drilled in it I think you have three options.
1. Run one drain line, just make sure you design you sump correctly to handle clogs and a return pump failure.
2. Drill it, would be my choice on a used rig, check out YouTube there are a ton of videoed on how to do this.
3. Run a syphon over the lid, same advise as number one, sump design matters

 

[Ranger Daryl]

I have only one drain on my 90, but my sump has room for a power failure and my pump is elevated off the bottom so that it will run dry in the event of a drain clog. I would rather burn up a 150.00 pump then 1000's in damage to my home. My next setup will have at least two drains for peace of mind. I have never experienced an aquarium flood...but I have had a dishwasher supply line burst overnight. I woke up to the sound of pouring water, it was not a good feeling when I put my feet into water to get out of bed. My first thought was my tank shattered, then I realized it was too much water.

 

[Bent]

Over the years I've always reheated pizza in the Oven in the box. I always just put the box with the pizza straight in the oven. I was told numerous times by people that it would cause a fire. I must have reheated a hundred pizzas over the years this way, and I just laughed at the people who kept telling me not to do it because I'd always done it and never ever had a problem.

One day at work, I did what I always did, I threw the oven on 400 and threw the pizza box in there. I went back to doing some work and about 5 minutes later the smoke alarm started going off. I ran to the kitchen to find the place engulfed in smoke and the oven in flames. I was able to handle it all with a extinguisher thank god, but there was some damage that I had to pay for. All in all could have been much worse.

That story applies to so much more than just pizza boxes.

 

[Luke Schnabel]

Well you either do it and if something happens no problem. Or don't do it and if something happens then you have a problem. My thought is it's much better to do it in case of a failure.

 

[ca1ore]

unless you're willing to do the math and design correctly this is a true statement.

Has nothing to do with math, either calculated properly or not. You can work out the balance easily enough, but then anything that upsets said balance leaves no measure for error. Gate or ball valves get gummed up over time, then where does the 'excess' water go. I suppose one can design the return chamber of the sump in such a way that the tank won't overflow, though that's an inelegant solution IMO and runs the risk of pump failure.

 

[CStrickland]

@ Jammy - can you explain what a "proper" sump design consists of? You are saying that if you do it right it will work, I'm curious what the right way to do it is.

 

[Sonyardo]

Screen the overflow in a way that water can flow but snails or debris can't get in. I don't think there is anything wrong with a back up drain, but it's completely unnecessary, imho . That's all i have to say about that...

 

[JammyBirch]

I have only one drain on my 90, but my sump has room for a power failure and my pump is elevated off the bottom so that it will run dry in the event of a drain clog. I would rather burn up a 150.00 pump then 1000's in damage to my home.

This is the right answer, and yes it is all about the math. ..if you make room for the volume you can't overflow and you need to calculate the extra volume including the drain pipe

I never said anything about what is or is not proper, I'm just offering a solution to the problem. I have experience with this setup and am trying to help. Saying never do that or that doesn't work is not really helping.

 

[heathlindner25]

The question was, "is an extra drain necessary".... the answer is no.
There are hundreds of reef ready tanks with two holes setup with an overflow. One is a drain and one is a return.

 

[CStrickland]

When I had a single drain I used a pump that could run dry. It just blew bubbles into the tank if I lost the drain. It doesn't sound very safe to rely on the pump frying to prevent a flood, I'd be worried about a fire.

That drain was also very loud because you can't run a full siphon on a single drain.

PS I also had to dump all the water from the sump when it ran dry because my ato would dump the entire reservoir in. And for that same reason I couldn't use a very large reservoir or it would get the water level high enough to kick the pump back on and drop the sg in the tank, as well as flooding because it was an hob drain that needed to be primed on restart.
I'll never buy another tempered tank

 

[JammyBirch]

The ATO is also part of the equation if you're using a float style top off then ya there is added risk. Luckily for us we have SMART ATO and the Tunze unit that track water consumption and alarm out if the ATO adds too much. I've never had a submersible increase in temperature enough to say so anyway from running dry. I've run them dry a lot for water changes too. Not sure about external pumps though, if I had one I'd monitor it with an apex or something since they are expensive.

As Heathlindner25 pointed out the answer to the OP is no it's not necessary.

 

[thegrun]

Okay, I give up, I suppose rather than stating you MUST have a secondary drain line I should have stated that it was an extremely good idea to have one, and no mater how much math you do there is always a risk of a flood if you do not have one. I'm done.

 

[CStrickland]

The ATO is also part of the equation if you're using a float style top off then ya there is added risk. Luckily for us we have SMART ATO and the Tunze unit that track water consumption and alarm out if the ATO adds too much. I've never had a submersible increase in temperature enough to say so anyway from running dry. I've run them dry a lot for water changes too. Not sure about external pumps though, if I had one I'd monitor it with an apex or something since they are expensive.

As Heathlindner25 pointed out the answer to the OP is no it's not necessary.

That's kind of my point about asking what "as long as it's set up correctly" means. If you read the question to be whether a single drain is wise, then it's important to acknowledge what a proper single drain set up entails. It's not just balancing the return and the drain, it's whether the pump is a fire risk of it runs dry, what kind of ato is used and whether it has a computer to track consumption, what flood alarms and kill switches are in play, can you hear the tv over it, etc etc.

There's a big diff between "it's possible if you buy an apex" and "it's wise"

 

[JammyBirch]

That's kind of my point about asking what "as long as it's set up correctly" means. If you read the question to be whether a single drain is wise, then it's important to acknowledge what a proper single drain set up entails. It's not just balancing the return and the drain, it's whether the pump is a fire risk of it runs dry, what kind of ato is used and whether it has a computer to track consumption, what flood alarms and kill switches are in play, can you hear the tv over it, etc etc.

There's a big diff between "it's possible if you buy an apex" and "it's wise"

I'm not sure what you're reading I read..."is an emergency drain a must have"

I don't have an apex, it's not needed for this. All of the stuff at the end of your post are your words not mine. "It's possible if you buy an Apex" lol really? :thumbsup:

 

[roostertech]

Thanks for all the input guys. I'm probably one flood away from having my tanks kicked out of the living room so I should be on the extra safe side and have an emergency drain.

Though it seems like most used setup only come with one drain. Running return line outside of thank is rather awkward. Sigh.

 

[leviburns89]

Had my 4th basement flood this past weekend. Went and bought overflow hardware today.

It was just my rodi reservoir, but about 50 gallons drained, not to mention now I have to replace my filters...

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[CStrickland]

Had my 4th basement flood this past weekend. Went and bought overflow hardware today.

It was just my rodi reservoir, but about 50 gallons drained, not to mention now I have to replace my filters...

sorry for the flood
You don't have your rodi set up to be always on and just topping up the reservoir as the ato removes water, do you?

 

[leviburns89]

sorry for the flood
You don't have your rodi set up to be always on and just topping up the reservoir as the ato removes water, do you?

No, I fill the reservoir once it's at about 1/4 full. And I always let the rodi unit run into the drain for about 10 minutes before filling as to flush anything out of the line.

But I seem to suck at setting an alarm to remind me to shut it off.

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