Frogspawn & Open Brain Woes

[FishDad2]

I've got a Frogspawn and an Open Brain coral that are having some problems...need some help figuring out what to do about it.

The basic problem is that the Frogspawn is expanding a little less every day...going on about 4 weeks of that now. So too is the Open Brain, but it's also losing its color.

The tank has a Hamilton retrofit kit...3 x 250W halides and 4 x 96W PC's.

The pH runs between 8.15 - 8.25, temp 78.0 - 78.3, ORP in the 450-460 range, alkalinity ~9.8 dkh and calcium ~450 ppm. Nitrate and phosphate are virtually undetectable using Salifert test kits.

The Frogspawn sits almost directly below one of the halides...10K bulb. The bulb itself is ~17" above the water line and the coral sits ~12" below the water line...so there's ~29" between the bulb and the coral. It gets fair water movement...nothing too wild, but it sways a bit in the breeze.

The Open Brain sits a little further out towards the front of the tank, about 6-8", and is ~6" deeper in the water. So, it gets a little less light and also gets a little less water movement.

The only notable thing that's happened recently is that my calcium reactor ran out of CO2 and I didn't notice for a few days. The alkalinity dropped into the 7's, but I got it back up quickly after that. As well, the problem started before the issue with the CO2.

All the other corals in the tank are happy, including several in proximity to these two...Acropora, Torch, Lobophyllia, Trachphyllia, zoos, shrooms, etc.

Any thoughts?

Pics from when they were happy...

 

[Sk8r]

That's a poser. I have a frog in just about an identical situation, and it's expanded enormously. I see no problem in your chemistry. The only thing I could suggest is that flow is carrying something it doesn't like. You don't have a softie upwind of it, do you?

One thing that made a great difference in the euphyllia in my tank was adding a Sea Swirl. The intermittent chaotic flow seems to be exactly to their liking.

I also feed cyclopeeze daily, having a number of very small fishes, and they seem to take it in.

 

[FishDad2]

I actually do have one softie in the tank...opposite end, about 5' away.

I have a pair of Tunze Stream pumps in the tank, so they create some good variable flow throughout. And with the amount of water they move around, I think everything in the tank is upwind of everything else...no place to hide.

Do I need to get that softie out of there?

Thanks

 

[Angela Short]

Did you just recently add the MH's or replace the bulbs? My F.Spawn got blasted when I went from very old 14k's to brand new 10k's. I even backed the photoperiod down conciderable and reaclimated the whole tank but the FS still doesn't seem to like the extra par. Hasn't really been the same since I changed bulbs.

 

[FishDad2]

The MH bulbs have been in there since I first setup the tank in July. But now that you mention it, yes, I did change the MH bulbs a couple of months ago...I knew there was something I'd left out of my original problem description.

However, I went in the other direction when I made that swap, trying 14K in place of 10K. The 10K was ~6 mo. old when I swapped it out and the critters didn't seem to object to the change...at least not right away. I like the look with the 14K much better but I went back to the 10K last week in the hope that the more intense light would remedy the situation.

Unfortunately, it's continued to go downhill despite the bulb change.

On the other hand, the softie at the other end of the tank really seems to prefer the 14K over the 10K....so I've left that end alone. The tank looks odd now though...bright yellowish light at one end and the softer bluish light at the other.

 

[Marinemom]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but it is my understanding that open brains do not like alot of light. Maybe the new lighting is too intense for him. Just a thought.

Marinemom

 

[PatMayo]

My frogspawn does not seem to like a lot of light. i have them on either end of my tank in indirect flow. They are about midway up in the tank. Maybe this will help.

Regards,

Pat

 

[FishDad2]

It's a tough one. On the one hand, they're not regarded as a high lighting intensity corals, and from what the last few posts are saying, it seems that you'd agree. But on the other hand, the problems really began after I switched from to the 10K to the 14K MH bulb...i.e. after reducing the intensity of the light they were receiving.

Guess I'll have to wait a little longer to see how they respond to the return of the 10K bulb...if that's not the answer, then I'll have to go the other way and move them to a less well illuminated part of the tank.

Hopefully I can find the right spots for them.

It's not an exact science, is it?!?!

Thanks

 

[sarduci]

You can try putting the plastic window screen over them that you can find at a home improvement store.

Mine react more to water flow issues that light issues. I just brought another 250w de mh over my tank since it's been broke for the last six months. The ones in the middle of the tank are getting twice as much light now than before and they're expanded to be bigger than they have ever been, from the size of a baseball to the size of a softball for the larger heads, and the smaller ones in the branches are puffed out two to three times larger now that they get more light in the branches.

 

[FishDad2]

Thanks, but what would I use the plastic window screen for? I'm not sure I understand what you're suggesting.

 

[Justin74]

He's suggesting you place it(screen material) between your light and your tank to filter some of the intensity till their acclimated to it.

-Justin

 

[FishDad2]

Ah....I see now....thanks.

 

[Malolo]

The open is fading out from too much light. I would move it to the sand bed. Alot of your corals need the light so I opt out on the screen. Move open to less light and you'll see more color. Nice pics btw.

 

[FishDad2]

Mike, it's interesting that you say the Open Brain is suffering from too much light...perhaps I didn't do a good job of explaining the progression of my problem.

1. Both corals doing well for many months under 10k MH lights

2. Switched to 14k and 20k MH bulbs...I prefer the blue spectrum they produce

3. ~4-6 weeks after that switch I noticed that the two corals began to expand less and colors faded

4. I tested/changed water, increased feedings, changed water flow, etc....both corals continued to get worse

5. I re-installed the 10k bulb at the end of the tank where these two corals are as a last resort

6. Both corals seem to be on the rebound now...only time will really tell, but they seem to be expanding more and the color seems to be returning slowly

Since the 10k bulb is more intense than 14k or 20k, the conclusion I've begun to draw is that they need more light, not less. Does your experience tell you otherwise?

Thanks,
Chris

 

[FishDad2]

and thanks for the compliment on the pics

 

[Malolo]

I have two open brains which lost alot of their intense green after being moved into bright light Now that they are lower they look better. They did not get sickly in intense light just pale.

I have read that there are some corals that adjust pigment density like most plants: boosting levels in low light to enhance photosynthesis, and assumed from my experiences that open brains fell into this category.

 

[FishDad2]

Interesting...I'll try moving it and see what happens.

Thanks