Genius Needed fo Ultimate Water Changeout System..

[ZoeReef]

Long story short, we're putting in a large reef tank in our new building early 2007. I'm in the design-thinking mode right now. It will be a peninsula tank in the 700g size.

I'm looking to include an ultimate water changeout system. Perhaps it already exists, but in my mind it would include:

1. dumping an entire 160g tub of IO salt into it at one time.

2. automatic fresh water topoff

3. an easy way of changing out saltwater. Perhaps automatic and continual.

In this day of gizmos, surely someone has created this mousetrap. Any links, technologies, black-boxes or ideas?

I love technology...always and forever

 

[Untamed12]

I gave this a lot of thought as I designed out my 360.

It's all about plumbing, float valves, and motorized valves controlled by a controller. The controlled valves cost quite a bit, but you can make it a semi-manual process by moving the valves yourself

1) You need to make/store a lot of RO water...enough to make your large SW mix and still have enough left for evaporation.

2) Plumb the RO water storage container to your SW mix/storage so that RO water can flow into your SW mix/store on request. (160 gallons worth)

3) Mix the SW, and warm it to tank temp so it is ready for use.

4) Plumb in a 175 gallon tank (WC Sump), direct some overflow tank water into this tank. Bulkhead this tank so that water flows out, then into the main sump such that the WC sump always holds EXACTLY 160 gal. This tank must also have a drain valve. Water from the tank will continuously flow through this tank, but it will always have 160 gallons in it.

5) When it's time to change water...stop the water from entering the WC sump....drain the 160 gallons out...shut the drain valve....pump your fresh 160 gallons SW into this tank...start the flow back into the 175 WC sump

It's just about plumbing and a lot of space. Add float valves and controlled ball valves and the whole thing could be automated.

I'm not going to answer the evaporation question because this is already too wordy.

 

[ZoeReef]

That is a really kewl idea. I'm working on picturing it, the concept seems sound. I'm going to try sketch out what I think you have said and I will post it here in the next day or so.

There would be:

1. 700g reef tank
2. Main sump/refugium
3. 160g salt mix tank. Salt water mixed and heated here.
4. 175g WC sump. This has some water entering into it from the overflow, and it supplies some water into the main sump. 160 gallons can be drained from this tank.

After water is prepared, you dump the WC sump, and replace it with the 160g from the salt mix tank.

This new mix of water then begins to enter the system through the main sump/refugium.

Did I get it right?

 

[javatech]

The 160 gla IO will only put you 160 gal's of water at 1.019
that's fine for a fish only tank but for a reef you want 1.026
so you'll need more salt or less water

 

[ZoeReef]

Thx java. I'll have to look into this. When I mix smaller batches of IO according to the instructions (I measure 1.5 lbs per 5 gallons) I wind up with 1.023. Either way, I appreciate the heads up.

 

[Untamed12]

Yes, you've got it correct.

One other thing about this design that I like is that you can do a water change without stopping the circulation.

If your WC sump drain is a threaded bulkhead through the bottom of the tank, then you can calibrate the amount that you drain out by threading in different lengths of standpipe before you open the drain. That way, you can do different volumes of water changes.

 

[ZoeReef]

great idea about the screw in drains. A question: the flow into the WC sump and out of it into the main sump, is that a slow flow.. moderate..what are your thoughts on this.

your info says you are getting this one put in during the next couple of months. When you are able, we'd love to see some pics. thx for your help

 

[X men]

Did this (exellent) idea ever get to reality ? Or is this described in another thread ?

 

[Untamed12]

Yes...I ended up building pretty much as I described. I didn't outline the water change system in detail in my build thread, but if you want to have a look the best info is in the first few pages...

http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=28436

Water flows through the WC sump then on to the main sump during normal operations.

When a water change starts, I prevent the water from moving on to the main sump, so it collects in the WC sump (50 gallons worth).

When I've got the amount that I want captured, the flow into the WC sump is stopped at which point it flows directly into the main sump. WC sump is then dumped, and replaced with fresh SW.

Normal flow is then resumed through the WC sump and the new SW is pushed into the system.

I'm very happy with how it works. I change 50 gallons per week and the tank circulation never stops.

 

[X men]

OK, but did ZoeReef made a sketch of the system he had in mind back in 2006 ? And more importantly, did he actually build it ?

(I have the thread of Untamed12 in my favourites, it is fantastic, one of the most detailed build-threads on large aquariums, with elaborated close loop systems)

But i am always looking for better/other ideas

 

[Untamed12]

This thread has made me realize that I neglected to explain my water change system on my build thread. That has been corrected.

I can't even understand what I've written above...so here's a graphic of it.

 

[just dave]

I use something like that on my aquarium. I have a 44 gal Brute that is supplied by a separate pump from the tanks sump and drains back into the sump. At the bottom of the Brute I have a valve. When I want to change water I just hook a hose to the drain valve, shut off the feed ,open the drain ,and walk away. The SW mixing vat is the same size so when I refill with new water I can walk away as well as there is no danger of over filling. When it is full I just restart the pump and it starts to mix the new water into the system.

 

[edandsandy]

great thread!

 

[edandsandy]

double post

 

[ReefingBuddha]

I did something like that as well but a little different.

I don't use an extra RO water storage container because I just don't.

I have a 110g WC tank outside that is inline after my chiller. I can turn two valves which isolates the WC tank from the system and diverts the chiller return to the sump. The only difference to the entire system is that 100g are no longer inline. I then turn another valve on the bottom of the WC tank and dump the 100g straight to a drain.

I then allow my topoff (which can feed either the WC tank or the sump) and allow it to fill my WC tank until it overflows and stops the float switch in the sump.

Then just dump half a bucket of salt, and let the eheim pump with air injection aerated the water and a separate controller w/ heaters get the temp right.

switch the 2 ballvalves again and WC done. Would be easy enough to automate with a large automatic feeder (for the salt), a salinity probe w/ controller that would control the automatic feeder, and 3 automatic ball valves.

here are some pictures

pictures don't show it completely done. There is a drain line extension on the bottom now.

 

[ReefingBuddha]

Could also go with a continuous water change system which would be cheaper and more fancy technology...I think you can do it fairly easily with a LM3.