Guide to setup a Quarantine Tank (QT).

[Dr. Reef]

Thanks, here are more questions. I hope you do not mind, jajaj

i dont mind questions, feel free to ask

1.- I planned to use the shrimp method for cycling this big system ( 600+ galon)
Since it is big how many shrimp do you think I would have to put in and for how many days.?
atleast 3-5 shrimp for such big system or use pure ammonia in bottle (for cleaning purposes) and raise the ammonia level in tank to 1.5-2 ppm

I will seed it with ceramic rings with bacteria and also plan to dose stability.
how many days should I dose stability in addition to the seeding?

just to be sure of the cycle, i would hold off on stability till there is atleast 1ppm ammonia in the tank then use it as directed

one thing that I worry is the smell of the tank. When I did it in the quarentine coral fishless tank I put only one shrimp for 7 hours and my wife started complaining.

shrimp will decay and stink in a big system maybe not as much. you can always use pure ammonia or fish food in moderate quantities feeding tank daily till u reach ammoia 1.5 ppm. if u do ghost feed the tank make sure after cycle to siphon the sand and rocks for debris.

I know we have to measure amonia, nitrite and nitrate to be sure tank is cycled, but in quarentine tank amonia levels never got above 0.1 and nitrite was 0.2 the highest. so in big system it could also happen that amonia levels do not sky rocket also. I do not know if this is not good for starting a new tank?
i believe ammonia never went up much is due to stability being used in the tank. if you hold off on it till ammonia rises it would be better.


please tell me what you think.

2.- Quarentine coral fishless tank:
tank is cycled and with coral in it. since there is no fish in tank, I am only using coral food such as reef roids and coral frenzy ( both powders). would these kind of food keep the bacteria happy? I ask becuase I am not sure if they will add amonia for the bacteria? do I have to feed these foods every day of every other day would be fine for the bacteria?
any food source will break down to ammonia. corals will all produce ammonia so you are fine there.

thanks a lot
hope that answers, feels free to ask, good luck and safe reefing

 

[sensei]

Thanks, it helps a lot!
I do not want to ghost feed because it will be difficult to siphon everything and algae maybe a problem down the road. I guess the shrimp or dosing pure ammonia are better in that sense??

which method do you preffer, the shrimp method or dose pure ammonia and why?
when you say pure ammonia, you reffer to amonium hidroxide?
solutions used for cleanings have alcohol and other aditives as well. I guess I would have to find a source of getting pure ammonia.

If I understand correctly I should not seed the Tank with the seeded ceramic rings until after I reach 1.5 or 2 ppm of ammonia?? after I get that reading of ammonia, then I put the seeded ceramic rings in the tank and also dose stability, correct?
In the Quarentine coral fishless tank I seeded the tank with the ceramic rings and also dosed stability since day 1, then I added the shrimp in day 3, I suppose that is why ammonia never got higher than 0.1

Thanks again

 

[Dr. Reef]

Thanks, it helps a lot!
I do not want to ghost feed because it will be difficult to siphon everything and algae maybe a problem down the road. I guess the shrimp or dosing pure ammonia are better in that sense??
that is true ghost feeding is not siphoned will add on to problems later. shrimp in a pantyhose is a better option

which method do you preffer, the shrimp method or dose pure ammonia and why?
when you say pure ammonia, you reffer to amonium hidroxide?
solutions used for cleanings have alcohol and other aditives as well. I guess I would have to find a source of getting pure ammonia.

i personally have never used pure ammonia. i was neer able to find it in stores. atleast never in pure 100% ammonia form so i always used shrimp.

If I understand correctly I should not seed the Tank with the seeded ceramic rings until after I reach 1.5 or 2 ppm of ammonia?? after I get that reading of ammonia, then I put the seeded ceramic rings in the tank and also dose stability, correct?
In the Quarentine coral fishless tank I seeded the tank with the ceramic rings and also dosed stability since day 1, then I added the shrimp in day 3, I suppose that is why ammonia never got higher than 0.1
logic is 100% correct. if the tank is established you may never see ammonia spike. this is the reason why you see posts here on RC where someone started a new tank with all good quality Live rock and they never saw a cycle. The concept of cycling is to generate enough bacteria that it starts to convert ammonia to nitrites and then to nitrates. if some how you bring in a lot of established bacteria in a new system you may never see a spike. in your qt case that was the reason.

Thanks again

 

[sensei]

Happy new year!

Thanks for all that you share with us, it really helps a lot.

Today is the 2nd day of my second tank transffer on the 1st fish.
I decided to treat all my fish with TTM. I have an 80g Quaretine tank for observation only but it will not be cycled when my first fish complete the TTM.
Do you think it is safe to put the fish in the 80g observation tank if I to start dosing stability since day one and have 1 filter sponge inside the tank to poblate with bacteria?
I was thinking of having an amonia badge inside the tank and also dose prime for peace of mind. I will only put 1 fish since it is my first TTM and I wanted to try the method.

2.- my second load of fish to be treated by TTM are tangs. I treat them in 20g tanks for TTM. do you think it would be apropriate to give 2 medium size tangs half a sheet of nory a day in the 20g uncycled tanks when doing the TTM?
I just want to have a feeling if half a sheet is not to much in the sense that ammonia can creep in the 20g tank
I have been dosing prime in 2nd and 3rd day of TTM

3.- I am a pharmacist, I think I know how to get pure ammonia for cycling the a tank.
do you happen to know if what we are looking for is NH4OH (amonium hidroxide)?

please tell me what you think
thanks a lot

 

[pfan151]

Are there any ammonia reducing products that are safe to use with cupramine? I set up a 30 gallon quarantine a few days ago since the fish in my display are starting to show ick. I took some sponges out of my display to put in the HOB filter in the QT tank. I'd like to get my fish moved over in the next few days to avoid losing any. I am assuming the qt tank will not be able to handle to bio load at this point. There will be a decent amount of fish in there (large adult pair of onyx percula clowns, 4 red spot glass cardinals, yellow clown goby, and a yellow tail damsel). The cardinals require pretty heavy feeding to keep healthy. I'm fine with doing frequent water changes but I'm not sure if that will be enough.

 

[row12]

Hello all! I have a 300 gallon SPS DT with the following fish: Emperor Angel, Purple Tang, WhiteTail Bristletooth Tang, Labouti, Lineatus, Solarensis, Orange Back, Red Velvet, Pintail Pair, Rhomboid Pair, 9 Bimac Anthias, Blue Star Leopard, Yellow Coris, and Christmas Wrasse. I just recently picked up an Achillies tang to complete my fish list and he is in an acclimation box in my DT. My DT has had ich for the past yr and I have been debating on going fallow to clear it up especially prior to releasing the Achillies. I have a 300 gallon rubbermaid that I was going to use to house the fish while my DT is fallow, but I have a few questions before I begin setting it up.

I want to perform TTM on the fish prior to housing in my rubbermaid container. My plan is as follows:

1. Take water from my DT after my next water change
2. Setup a canister filter (Aquatop 500 w/ UV light), heater, and powerheads
3. Seed it with filter floss from the DT
4. Treat the rubbermaid setup with copper to eradicate any potential ich on the filter floss and DT water.
5. Begin TTM on fish in separate containers
6. Remove copper medication from rubbermaid setup with carbon and water change
7. Transfer fish to Rubbermaid setup while DT remains fallow

Will copper kill any beneficial biological bacteria?
Should I add any biological bacteria to the rubbermaid setup?
Any other recommendations with my above process?

Thanks for your help!

 

[kyle.nagel13]

I'm far from an expert on Ich, but I believe that both of you, Pfan151 and row12 are just transferring your issues to a new tank by introducing media from your existing tanks. I personally would just ask around and see if any other reefers in your area can seed some media in their tank for you. Again, I'm not an expert and I'm sure someone else will chime in, but by moving media your transferring the ich spores.

 

[row12]

I'm far from an expert on Ich, but I believe that both of you, Pfan151 and row12 are just transferring your issues to a new tank by introducing media from your existing tanks. I personally would just ask around and see if any other reefers in your area can seed some media in their tank for you. Again, I'm not an expert and I'm sure someone else will chime in, but by moving media your transferring the ich spores.

Which is why I want to treat the rubbermaid setup with copper prior to transferring the fish once they are done with TTM...I was thinking by doing so I would eliminate the ich and sterilize the system without having to put the fish thru the stress of copper.

 

[pfan151]

I'm far from an expert on Ich, but I believe that both of you, Pfan151 and row12 are just transferring your issues to a new tank by introducing media from your existing tanks. I personally would just ask around and see if any other reefers in your area can seed some media in their tank for you. Again, I'm not an expert and I'm sure someone else will chime in, but by moving media your transferring the ich spores.

Using media from the ick infected tank to seed the QT tanks doesn't matter. The QT tank will have ick as soon as my fish are put into it anyway. The copper will kill all of the parasites in the QT tank.

 

[pfan151]

Hello all! I have a 300 gallon SPS DT with the following fish: Emperor Angel, Purple Tang, WhiteTail Bristletooth Tang, Labouti, Lineatus, Solarensis, Orange Back, Red Velvet, Pintail Pair, Rhomboid Pair, 9 Bimac Anthias, Blue Star Leopard, Yellow Coris, and Christmas Wrasse. I just recently picked up an Achillies tang to complete my fish list and he is in an acclimation box in my DT. My DT has had ich for the past yr and I have been debating on going fallow to clear it up especially prior to releasing the Achillies. I have a 300 gallon rubbermaid that I was going to use to house the fish while my DT is fallow, but I have a few questions before I begin setting it up.

I want to perform TTM on the fish prior to housing in my rubbermaid container. My plan is as follows:

1. Take water from my DT after my next water change
2. Setup a canister filter (Aquatop 500 w/ UV light), heater, and powerheads
3. Seed it with filter floss from the DT
4. Treat the rubbermaid setup with copper to eradicate any potential ich on the filter floss and DT water.
5. Begin TTM on fish in separate containers
6. Remove copper medication from rubbermaid setup with carbon and water change
7. Transfer fish to Rubbermaid setup while DT remains fallow

Will copper kill any beneficial biological bacteria?
Should I add any biological bacteria to the rubbermaid setup?
Any other recommendations with my above process?

Thanks for your help!

I think you are making it way more work than it needs to be. I'd just put them all in the Rubbermaid and dose the copper. Then after 4 weeks remove the copper and leave them in the Rubbermaid for another six weeks. I think the TTM can work but I wouldn't be as confident that 100% of the parasite is gone. With copper and leaving the tank fallow you know you won't have to deal with ick again.

After this current outbreak I have decided to treat every fish I buy with copper for 4 weeks prior to being added to the display tank. Everything will be treated whether they show visible signs of ick or not.

 

[ReefChasing]

Doesn't the cycling process differ depending on the size of the quarantine tank and the number/size of the fish being added?

I'm adding two clowns, 4 anthias and a flame angel to a 29 gallon and am worried about ammonia spikes.

It would be great if there was some rule of thumb regarding ammonia dosing to replicate the bioload of a fish prior to putting them in the QT tank.

 

[Rognin]

Just need re-assurance I'm doing it right. I've setup a permanent QT for everything that will go in the DT (fish, corals & inverts). The QT's cycle was started mid december and finished at the end of January.

Specs:
75w Ehiem heater
Blau 20 gallon rimless
Fluval LED light as life support for corals
Tunze reefpack 250 (includes a 9004 doc skimmer + media filter)
Tunze turbelle powerhead
Tunze nano osmolator (Overkill but will be practical when I do corals)
Fluval filter beads

I've recently added PVC parts as hiding places and added six juvenile yellow chromis and three juvenile cardinals ( day 16 today).



So now for the Q's:
-My Quarantine plan is as follows. Fish for 72 days, inverts (CUC) and corals for 48, fish for 72 days, coral and inverts 48 days and so on and so forth. Is there anything wrong with this scheduling?
-If I use Copper to treat for ich, can I clean the equipment and use new filter beads that were cycled in the DT without problem for the inverts and the corals in subsequent quarantines?
-How do I go about doing treatments for the corals. Add the dip in the QT with the inverts or take the corals out one by one for the dips? Also what dips are suggested (I'm in Canada, so not all products are available)

Might be more but I'm pulling blanks on questions.

Thanks,

-Rog

Edit: Another Q. What happens if I get to the end of the 72 days with no apparent signs of problem and no treatments given? I just transfer the fish to the DT?

 

[Spar]

So now for the Q's:
-My Quarantine plan is as follows. Fish for 72 days, inverts (CUC) and corals for 48, fish for 72 days, coral and inverts 48 days and so on and so forth. Is there anything wrong with this scheduling?
-If I use Copper to treat for ich, can I clean the equipment and use new filter beads that were cycled in the DT without problem for the inverts and the corals in subsequent quarantines?
-How do I go about doing treatments for the corals. Add the dip in the QT with the inverts or take the corals out one by one for the dips? Also what dips are suggested (I'm in Canada, so not all products are available)


Edit: Another Q. What happens if I get to the end of the 72 days with no apparent signs of problem and no treatments given? I just transfer the fish to the DT?

This seems confusing:
"My Quarantine plan is as follows. Fish for 72 days, inverts (CUC) and corals for 48, fish for 72 days, coral and inverts 48 days and so on and so forth. Is there anything wrong with this scheduling?"

Simplify it down to this:
Non-Fish (includes but not limited to CUC, coral and inverts) = 72 days isolated from fish
Fish = TTM + 4 weeks observation, or copper for 4 weeks + 4 weeks observation

Unless I am missing something here...

 

[Rognin]

This seems confusing:
"My Quarantine plan is as follows. Fish for 72 days, inverts (CUC) and corals for 48, fish for 72 days, coral and inverts 48 days and so on and so forth. Is there anything wrong with this scheduling?"

Simplify it down to this:
Non-Fish (includes but not limited to CUC, coral and inverts) = 72 days isolated from fish
Fish = TTM + 4 weeks observation, or copper for 4 weeks + 4 weeks observation

Unless I am missing something here...

I'll elaborate.

Fish:
72 days of observation of fish in Qt. I'm not doing any prophylactic treatments unless I get signs of a problem, in which case I treat and after the 4 weeks of treatment, I restart the 72 day counter of observation.

Corals and inverts:
Once the fish have been transferred to the DT I start with the CUC and some corals for a 48 day period.

Also, why 72 days for corals and inverts? Is it not just 4 weeks?

 

[Spar]

72 days observation just seems like an odd number... It isn't a bad number, it just doesn't have any specific meaning behind it. You may be confusing this with the 72 days you must leave your DT or non-fish fallow to ensure that ich cysts die out.

 

[ReefRealEstate]

Moving Fish from QT to DT

Moving Fish from QT to DT

I hear everyone saying don't get copper into the DT tank, don't use same net to transfer, etc.. This may be a stupid question but how do I transfer the fish without this happening to a certain extent other than rinsing them off first, does that mean another tank with just tank water from my DT to put them in first after treatment then into DT:uhoh3:?

 

[rjjr1963]

I hear everyone saying don't get copper into the DT tank, don't use same net to transfer, etc.. This may be a stupid question but how do I transfer the fish without this happening to a certain extent other than rinsing them off first, does that mean another tank with just tank water from my DT to put them in first after treatment then into DT:uhoh3:?

You would remove the copper before transferring the fish to the DT. If your net was used during the copper treatment I'd get a new net for the transfer.

 

[ReefRealEstate]

So no worries then for only trace amounts, or is there something else that removes the copper, or is it just the time that passes and a water change or two in the QT tank that does it?

 

[mrpergo]

I was told years ago when transferring from you QT w/copper use the QT net and transfer to container with DT water and remove to DT with your DT net. I have at times just scooped with my QT net and walked over and put the fish in my DT. ( its across the room).....lol

 

[pfan151]

I'll elaborate.

Fish:
72 days of observation of fish in Qt. I'm not doing any prophylactic treatments unless I get signs of a problem, in which case I treat and after the 4 weeks of treatment, I restart the 72 day counter of observation.

Corals and inverts:
Once the fish have been transferred to the DT I start with the CUC and some corals for a 48 day period.

Also, why 72 days for corals and inverts? Is it not just 4 weeks?

I'd still do TTM before any fish goes into the display if your not planning to use copper. If you are going to go through all the time of a 72 day QT you might as well do TTM just to guarantee there is no chance of Ich getting into the tank.