Help with flow on new 210g

[jeemann99]

I am helping a friend put together a grocery list for his 210 he has. 72x24x30 dimensions

The tank has 2 overflows. and will be built in the wall exposing 2 sides front and side. It will be part of the corner of the wall we are building.

so far:
- 210g tank
- G4 Skimmer
- 72" 8x 80w
- 75gallon rubbermaid tub for filter/fuge

what to do?
Should we do a Surge? or closed Loop? I do not want to put any powerheads in it. If closed loop what pump should I get that is strong enough for 2 return openings on the opposite side of the tank. Meaning that it will need to push 72" across tankusing 2 returns. If surge how big and will it be enough to push across 72"?

Softies / LPS tank

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance
Garrick

 

[Sullyman]

Softies/LPS tank forget all the plumbing, get a wavebox.

 

[jeemann99]

ya, but I do not want that box in tank. he thinks it is an eye sore. is it enugh to push the length of the 72" tank?

 

[ppurcell]

I saw a wave box a couple of weeks ago, they don't seem much more obtrusive than a built in overflow box to me. But if that isn't an option, then...

Since the tank is in wall, do you have the space to put a surge in above the tank? Perhaps Rod will chime in, but I would think you would want two 10 gallon surges with different fill rates dumping into the display at different points with crossing flows. 1" pipe is reported to introduce the fewest bubbles, but will reduce flow so it may be worth trying a few different pipe sizes to see what your friend can live with.

You may want to talk to LoveReefs1 about the Refusurge design which incorporates a refugium on one side and a surge on the other. Sounds like a perfect match to me and I plan to do this with my tank eventually.

You can certainly get wave-like action from an Oceans Motion on a closed loop. I think one of the drums on the 4-way will allow you to do 1&2, followed by 3&4 which should produce a nice back and forth motion. I think a lot of folks like blueline pumps for this application.

The surge will be easy to build and cheap to run. The closed loop will probably be less noticable, require drilling holes in the tank, running another expensive and possibly noisy pump.

 

[AuroraDave]

I have a wave box in my tank. It is covered with coraline now. I'm surprised you didnt notice, but I guess you were looking more at the corals.

My wavebox is set to give me about a 1" wave. Combined with my 1" sea swirl and CL there is a ton of water movement. Maybe too much for some LPS in fact. My torch/frogspawn/hammer have gotten used to the flow now and grow quickly, but at 1st they were closed a lot.

 

[RobTop]

My 220 has a CL OM 4-way version 1 pushed by a Dart. version 1 fires 1/2, 2/3, 3/4, 4/1 ect ect. The outlets are top left 1 top right 2, bottom left 3 and bottom right 4. This flow is crazy good! I aldo have a dart for the return that is on a OM SS. I have 1 small dead spot towards the back where stuff gathers, other than that it is all good. For once I do not feel as though I need to change the plumbing.
I have read the idea of 2 closed loops and having them on timers so 1 fires then the other. The cost of a dart and plumbing would be pretty close to the cost of the OM and there is less issues with a second dart then a OM 4-way. If I was starting over I would do that, But like I said I could not be happier with the flow, and most importanatly the corals too.
When it comes time to drill holes let me know I have bits and drill will drill for free.

 

[jeemann99]

Phil, Dave, Rob -

Thanks for all your advise and input. I will have to discuss these options with my buddy. Rob - I will definitly look you up if we decide to take that route.

G

 

[Rod Buehler]

I am a big fan of surge tanks, and uncertain of what I think about wave boxes. I havnt been all that impressed with the ones that I have seen (very few). Most likely that arent dialed in correctly.

Here is a video of one of my early refusurges. The video was shot from an old camera that does short video ,and I beleive that it was shot in 1999.

http://rods-reef.com/offweb/DSCN0202.mov

 

[ppurcell]

Awesome video thanks for posting that.

 

[driftin]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9424919#post9424919 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RobTop
... The cost of a dart and plumbing would be pretty close to the cost of the OM and there is less issues with a second dart then a OM 4-way. If I was starting over I would do that, But like I said I could not be happier with the flow, and most importanatly the corals too.

I was thinking about installing an OM on my tank for a closed loop. What kind of issues have you experienced?

Dart pumps wouldn't have a problem cycling on/off every 15 seconds or so? No excessive wear?

 

[RobTop]

What I have hearded about the 2 CL system is cycle them 6+ hours. Less wave type action, but you get 100% of the water flowing 1 way, then switch it to another way. Durning the switch there is lots of random movement. With the OM having a port open for seconds it does not get all the water moving before switching.
Don't get me wrong about the problem, I LOVE my OM products and have Paul working on a custom job that will be programable. The issue I have had is twice in 6 months it has stopped rotating. I take it apart and find noting specific to cause the issue, but wipe down the inside anyway. After wiping it works fin again. I'd call it a minor inconveance not a problem.

 

[BenjieC]

Plan on using a couple of methods, so if one fails you still have something creating flow.

I like the idea of use the Tunze streams or a similar style of pump for the reason that they don't take very much energy to create alot of flow. And if they are on a battery backup you can have flow for hrs in case the power goes out. If you don't like powerheads in the tank then get the vortec it's pretty low profile and there are no chords in the tank. I'd then also use a CL or Rod surge.

 

[Evolley1]

Garrick,

I would suggest any Tunze products. I have two 6100's and a 6045 in a 120. Honestly I don't even realize they are there especially when they are located in the corners. What can you put in the corners anyway? If you have a controller of some sort...that's better yet. It's nice to have the option to turn off the flow when feeding or taking a gander from the top. As a side note I also have 2 return lines plus a closed loop running on a mag 18. As Dave mentioned a wave box it s a good option. On a 210 you probably won't even know it's there compared to what it provides to the tank.

 

[rxinc]

I used two Vortechs on my glass tank (72x24x30) one one each end facing each other and it gives great turbulent flow.

I too only have viewable front and left side and they aren't very noticable themselves, plus no cords in the tank, no drilling for CL, energy efficient, and pretty quiet.

 

[bignick]

I have 4 tunze 6100s on my 210 two on the left side and two on the right and i set them to puls simultaneously every second. By doing this i have created a minature wave in my tank. Of course i have them set at the lowest power because if i didn't i for sure would have a wave crashing over the side of my tank.

I would skip the dart. I mean i have one for my main return and even though it is one of the quitest pumps i have ever heard in my life it still got a little noise to it. I would just go either vortech or TUNZE. Save your maoney and get the TUNZES they are awesome.